"Support for imminent VBACers" thread?

[pendulum]

Hi there,
I am 38 weeks today and planning a VBAC after my el CS for breech.

I haven't spent much time on the ante natal threads because I couldn't keep up with them! But now I am on mat leave and due date is approaching I would love to chat to anyone else hoping for a VBAC in the near future.

Is there anyone else out there, or another thread I can join? (Am just heading to docs to check baby position but will log in again later!)

Thanks
p xx

Hi all,

Hope it's ok for me to join. I'm currently 40+4 and very much hoping for a VBAC. I had an elective c/s with my twins in July '05 for breech presentation.

Just looking for a little inspiration really to help me fight my corner if needs be. I've tentatively agreed to be booked in for an 'assessment for induction' next Friday 19th though I have no intention of going ahead with being induced!

I feel that baby probably won't have put in an appearance by then though unfortunately, not least because i think my due date is inaccurate. I was also still breastfeeding my twins when I conceived so I think realistically I am probably only reaching 40 weeks today.

The hospital I'm under 'routinely' induce at 10 days over - I find it a little off-putting that they routinely induce VBAC mums at all though. I've done all my research and consider myself quite 'clued up' on all the pros and cons of the different approaches but I'm still finding it difficult to fight my corner, particularly when they start on about the risk of stillbirth in overdue Mothers!

Anyway, sorry for the rant. Congratulations to all new mums! It's very inspiring to read all the positive birth stories.

Hi all,

Hope it's ok for me to join. I'm currently 40+4 and very much hoping for a VBAC. I had an elective c/s with my twins in July '05 for breech presentation.

Just looking for a little inspiration really to help me fight my corner if needs be. I've tentatively agreed to be booked in for an 'assessment for induction' next Friday 19th though I have no intention of going ahead with being induced!

I feel that baby probably won't have put in an appearance by then though unfortunately, not least because i think my due date is inaccurate. I was also still breastfeeding my twins when I conceived so I think realistically I am probably only reaching 40 weeks today.

The hospital I'm under 'routinely' induce at 10 days over - I find it a little off-putting that they routinely induce VBAC mums at all though. I've done all my research and consider myself quite 'clued up' on all the pros and cons of the different approaches but I'm still finding it difficult to fight my corner, particularly when they start on about the risk of stillbirth in overdue Mothers!

Anyway, sorry for the rant. Congratulations to all new mums! It's very inspiring to read all the positive birth stories.

Hello Voxish! Well, you don't have to be routinely induced at 10 days over. I cancelled the induction booked for me at 42wks (scan), after repeatedly refusing to allow them to book one. You can ask for 'Expectant Managment' and continue to wait, which I'm sure you know about as you've been doing your research!

Stay strong, make informed decisions and post here for added support. Your body, your baby, your birth!!!

The thing to bear in mind with the 10-days over 'rule' (for want of a better word!) is that it is based on a research which showed that stillbirth rates started to rise fairly quickly after 42 weeks. They also found that women who were induced past 42 weeks were more likely to end up with a cesarean. So, the theory with inducing at 41 weeks plus 3 days is that it reduces stillbirth without increasing the chance of needing a cesarean. HOWEVER, this research was seriously flawed because women who were over 42 weeks were sent for CS at the drop of a hat whereas those below 42 weeks were given more chance to deliver vaginally. Most doctors recognise that induction increases the risk of CS and so you have to wonder why they are still persisting to routinely induce at 41 weeks before stillbirth rates beging to rise significantly.

You might also like to ask them for their actual figures on the risk of stillbirth at different gestations. NICE quotes that the risks are 1 in 3000 at 37 weeks, 1 in 1000 at 42 weeks and 1 in 500 at 43 weeks - so the absolute risk is still quite small.

hi, would just add my twopennorth about the overdue thing. am typing while b'feeding so pls excuse lack of punctuation!

I had managed to get my consultant to agree to let me go to 42+3 before doing cs, despite hospital policy being not to go past 41 weeks. i was fairly convinced that my official EDD was too early based on my cycle.

In the end i delivered at 41 weeks and DD was definitely overcooked. also they showed me the placenta and it had gone green and chalky in places, which they said were signs of serious deterioration. so in the end i'm relieved i didn't go all the way up to my time limit and if i ever have another will be careful to ensure i'm properly monitored if i go well overdue.

not trying to scare anyone but just think it was something i was a bit cavalier about in hindsight.

Klaw - thanks for link to article, I will definitely have a read when I have a bit more time. Tbh I have done quite a lot of research, I attended good antenatal classes the first time and have also spoken to A LOT of women about their birthes (I mean the birthes of their babies, not their own births...). And this could be the problem - I know too many people with bad stories to tell. It's not that I definitely want an epidural, it's just that I need the safety cushion of that as an option when I go into labour. I am so scared of reaching a time and a place where I can't cope any more and then having to carry on - for a long time. A lot of people have reached that stage, had the epidural, and then said it was copable with after that.

Can you tell I'm not very good with pain

Hi claraq - my due date is 6th dec. I'm actually hoping to avoid an epidural this time as I feel it contributed to my dd not being able to get into a good position last time. But I've not be told that I shouldn't have one. I thought the pain between contractions thing was a relatively late indicator of rupture and that careful montoring should make it OK to have an epidural...not sure though. I certainly haven't ruled it out!

Hi Kitsilano (I think I've seen you on the dec board too now!) - glad I'm not the only coward who needs to keep the epidural option in the back of my mind just in case.....

Anyone fancy popping along to the due april 2008 thread and telling us wannabe VBACers that we ARE going to be able to do it??

I'll officially join in now that there's april people on here!
Here's me:
Lisa, 38, married,ex LD nurse, doing OU degree to get a place on midwifery course when DC4 is old enough for nursery

DS1(1999) breech, went for Vag delivery, all went pear shaped -if i knew then what i know now etc!
DS2(2003) HBAC with NHS midwives and Doula

DD (2005) HBAC with NHS midwives and Doula

D? due Jan planned HBAC with same midwives as with DD

I'll apologise in advance for when I get a bit passionate - but I hate with a vengeance some of the crap that gets dealt out to us VBACers
Lisa X

Hi everyone, I had an em cs with DD in 2000 after placental abruption at 32 weeks, and was practically forced into an el cs with DS in 2004. I asked my consultant a million times if I could possibly try a natural birth but he was adamnat I couldnt. Pity I didnt know then that I could have told him I was!

I'm 15 weeks now with DC3,(on the due april 2008 thread) and my midwife and doctor have both seemed perfrectly fine with my insistance on VAB2C, although I have yet to speak to my consultant.

The only possible problem is that the scar on the outside of my tummy is vertical, but I think I remember the surgeon with DS telling me he would go over the internal line (on my uterus) as it was horizontal.
My doctor and midwife both think it was likely that the cut was horizontal, as the reason I have a vertical cut outside is that the cs was performed alongside an exploratory operation of my bowels and ovaries as the abruption was not obvious until they opened me up.

On top of that I recently had a LEEP operation on my cervix 6 months ago, so apparently that can cause early labour (from around 36 weeks) and problems with dilation.

As you can probably gather I need to be quite clued up on all this to make sure I get to try for a VAB2C, so have read alot about it, from everything I have seen as long as the cut is horizontal it shouldnt really be a problem.

Fingers crossed.

(Soph/Paranoidmummy get over here!!!)

Hello all, can I join in too?

DS1 born by ecs Jan 06 after becoming distressed following induction at 41+4.

EDD for this one varies - 21st Oct (by LMP), 29 Oct (conception....TMI), 31st Oct scan 2, 3 Nov scan 1. Been measuring ahead since week 26 - last scan predicting big headed, long limbed hairy baby! DS1 also predicted to be bigger but just a wee thing at 6 lb 2 oz. Turned out I had insufficient amount of waters.

Was breech until 36 weeks, then stuck at oblique for another week. Finally found a sense of direction at last scan. By the constant BH and wriggling headbutting my lady bits, this one feels huge and I am really quite fed up of being pg, thank you very much (HG both pregnancies). But going on past experience, I am not getting hopes up of an arrival any time soon.

Planning VBAC, told I have 'very good chance' but given my reaction last time, absolutely no way cons will try any induction other than sweep and poss ARM. And given how it felt last time, no way they will be coming near me with anything to speed things up. So VBAC as long as it happens naturally (agreed now to let me go to 12 Nov max), otherwise likely to be planned section.

Am generally pretty happy with treatment. Unlike some of your experience, I got the impression the cons had this big speech prepared to convince me to have VBAC - seemed quite pleasantly taken aback when I asked for it!

Looking forward to hearing all your positive birth stories!

lol! I'm here I'm here!

I reckon you'll be fine Lorayn. It sounds like it is just the outer scar that's vertical. Are you meeting with your consultant soon? hopefully he/she can shed some light?

I'm supposed to be mtg with my consultant next wk to discuss labour but haven't had my appt through yet Not due until 6th Apr but i'd like to know where I stand in terms of labour cos its really worrying me!!!

I was wondering if anyone here had any advice on monitoring etc? I think its my hosp policy to be monitored constantly but is there an alternative? My mw also said they will suggest an epidural. I thought that was a big no-no tho cos of uterine rupture?? If anyone can shed any light or help a bit with some advice pre-meeting consultant I would be eternally grateful!

Also not sure exactly why i ended up with cs last time around which may be a factor. I was in labour for a few days and my fore waters had gone but not my hind. I wasn't in too much pain and felt like things were going quite steadily! I'm quite small so I imagine my body needed to expand for him to get out!!!! They broke my hind waters and things really started to move along. then for no apparent reason - was never explained to me - they put me on drip (oxytocin drip maybe?). Things went pretty tits up from there!!! All went v quickly and suddenly he descended v low and heart rate dropped. they pushed him back up (pleasant feeling and tmi i know, sorry!!!) and then next thing i knew they said i needed an epidural and told me i'd need a section. i was so worried about ds i went along with it even tho he was all fine by then.

Sorry to moan on. Just really desperate for a natural one this time so trying to gibve any info i can if there is anyone lovely out there who can help me!!!!!

sorry stripey, crossed posts

HI everyone, can I join you? I had DS in March 2004 by ECS. I was induced due to having cholostatis. After 4 days I was shattered and because of hte drip I was contracting every min but only 3 cm. They took me for section and found out he was head down but sideways with the cord round his neck.

I am now 35 weeks (tomorrow) wiht number 2 and praying for a VBAC. Head is down but don't know if it is engaged. So far everything is ok for VBAC. I have my mode of delivery appointment next thursday at 36 weeks so hope to find out more about what will happen.

It is great to hear about all you birth stories espcially those tht have turned out to be the VBAC you wanted.

Great to have so many newbies on the thread

I'm 38wks today & just waiting for things to kick off.....

There are a load of useful links near the bottom of the thread if you are still in "reading" mode, or post if you have any qus, someone will answer.

Lulumama & Klaw are both doulas who have done their own VBACs too, so they are often on this thread offering great advice & support

Sorry to jump in on the thread but I'm not due until April 2008 but getting anxious about a VBAC. My plan is to sit quietly in the background and read all the positive threads and advice.

Congrats to all those who have had a successful VBAC (or HBAC) you give me hope!

paranoidmummy i had a vbac attempt 2 weeks ago and had an epidural. my consultant said that the pain of scar rupture is a very late sign and they would pick up on it earlier via the maternal obs (heart rate, blood pressure). I had read Mary Cronk's guidance on detecting scar rupture (can't link but you should be able to google it or search on this site) which seemed to corroborate this. actually i printed out a copy (it's only 2 pages) and got DH to read it and kept it in my notes.

in an ideal world i wouldn't have had the epi because i will always wonder if it contributed to my vbac being unsuccessful, but at the time it was a straight choice between epi and c-section because i was so tired after days of (pre)labour.

hth and good luck

p xx

Mark Cronk link mentioned below

thanks Betsy [technically illiterate icon]

no problem Pendulum

I've got it a copy with my notes too, for my imminent VBAC (hopefully...)

I think a dose of Mary should be prescribed to every pregnant woman - She's a legend! If you ever find yourself being intimidated by a consultant Mary's useful phrases are superb!

Mary?s four useful phrases in her own words

4 useful phrases to be learnt off by heart by pregnant women and used if appropriate.

1. Thank you (Mr Hi-an-mi-tee or Midwife Sinister) for your advice I/We will consider it carefully and let you know what we decide.

2. Would you like to reconsider what you have just said? or Would you like to repeat what you have just said? - Spoken with a look of incredulity

3. ( said with an expression of sweet regret) I'm afraid I shall have to regard any further discussion as harassment .

4. Stop that at once! This was used against me by a woman to whom I had taught it. (I was getting overenthusiastic during a VE) I deserved it and I was very proud of her

Lisa X

No apologies required from the likes of me and Lulu when it comes to being passionate about VBAC, Jamila!!!

At this rate we might get MNHQ to make a complete separate heading for VBAC, wouldn't that be great!?

I have Mary Cronks 4 phrases on a Sticky note on my desk top!!!

LoRayn, as your Uterine scar is most probably horizontal I would not worry, yes UR is a real risk but it's about 0.35%. For a Vertical scar it's about 2%, so still fairly small and with a vigilant mw I would consider it a risk worth taking, personally.

Paranoidmummy, you were augmented last time and that's not going to happen this time! You will be making informed choices rather than being told you need an epidural, then a CS!!! This is your birth, your body and your baby! We can help you to make your own Birth Choices.

thank you every body for all your support. I'm going to check out that website and stick a copy in my notes.

I just need to make sure I go in knowing what I want and what to say etc. I think that way I can't be 'persuaded' to think i want something else if that makes sense!!!

Hello all,

Just to let you know I posted this thread earlier VBAC how does your body know different from first time - anyone got any advice?

Bit fed up today as such an anti-climax. Really would like to wave magic fairy wand and deliver before EDD or at least near to it. As opposed to last time when EDD a distant memory by the end of failed induction 41+4 and ECS. Bit frightened of history repeating itself TBH. Am very flattered babies enjoy my uterine hospitality so much but a timely departure would be appreciated please!