Want a C section, but cant convince doctors, what do i do?

[Jessi28]

Can anyone give me advice? i'm desperately scared of natural birth. My granmother was permanently disabeld by birth. My Aunt and sister both died in childbirth. And my own mother had such a horrific experience she rejected me completely.After a 5 day labour, massive blood loss and literally dying in the delivery room and having to be resusitated. And my whole life has been blighted by it, as 28 years later she still hates me for it. I always wanted to be a mother, but always thought i'd adopt till i found myself pregnant. The problem in my family is the size of head. We all have babies with larg heads and we seem to have narrow pelvises. I'm only 28 weeks but my baies head is huge measuring nearly 35 weeks already. Meaning to me its inherited to same characteristics that have caused so many problems to my family. The doctor told me today they wont do a c section till it becomes medically necessary. As childbirth problems are'nt genetic. Meaning i'm traumatised as i feel like i'm on death row i cant enjoy my pregnancy or form a bond with my baby.As i believe i'll never know her. I genuinely believe it is medically necessary. But they wont even address that. Preffering to lecture me, rather than offer reasurance that what i'm concerned about is not an issue. I think they think i'm jsut hysterical, and need mental help. But would'nt anyone with the history i have feel the same way. And instinctively want a c section. Or at least to be reasurred, and have their medical concerns addressed. I asked to referred to someone who'l listen. But got no respone what do i do?

If i could get a doctor, to look at my x rays. To examine me, to look at the babies size in relation to that. It would go a million miles to making me feel better.Or at least calmer (god knows what my blood pressure must be) I'll be always be more anxious than most given the history. But to simply dismiss me, and brand me a mental health case. Feels like a betrayal, from people i always thought were there to help. I more than anyone know i probably do have a some issues. But so does my whole family, who would'nt with the experiences we have had. And the doctors ive encountered seem to be doing nothing other than making that worse.Doctors take an oath to do no harm which i my case i think they are. I will be taking all, of your advice. As being pro active seems a positive thing to do right now. Or i'll go mad. I cant thank you all enough.

Write down your family medical history in a calm, factual way, detailing each incident. Write down the impact this has had on you.

Write down your fears about this birth, including the size of the head and of your hips, and your fears of death, serious injury, inability to bond with your child etc

Include your understanding of the NICE guidelines - that you are entitled to ask for a c section.

Take a copy of all this in with you and ask again for a c-section. If you feel dismissed again, tell them you want them to put their refusal in writing and for them to acknowledging (in writing) that they've read your letter .

May I ask whereabouts in the UK that you please, and/or which hospital/clinic you are receiving this response from?
As many posters have stated, the NICE Guideline DOES state that maternal request should be supported - and absolutely where tokophobia is a reason - but unfortunately, I am aware of numerous cases where NICE's revised and new caesarean recommendations are being willfully ignored.
If you would like to message me personally, I will do my best to help with your situation, and in the meantime, you can find a number of useful links to the NICE guideline, including its "patient version", here:
www.electivecesarean.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=491&Itemid=670

Yes, if you can help or advise that would be great.

Ushy - I totally agree and actually I do see those problems as that is exactly the clinic I work in. There are long term risks with any way of delivering a baby.

Which is why I support any women and her right to choose but I believe the choice should be informed which means hearing the good and also the not so good.

Jessi your xrays may not give any information about the actual shape of your pelvic inlet, mid cavity and outlet. It would depend ont he xrays you had and the reason for them. Those measurement need a huge level of detailed looking at and wouldn't be done for many reasons at all. SO that may not be a useful path [although it may be - and it is worth seeing what a consultant thinks]

Don't worry about your bloodpressure - honestly the coolest cats get pregnancy induced hypertension, the most stressed people in the most stressed circumstances dont. Its to do with placental function and whilst your worry and stress is totally horrible for you, you can be comforted that your baby is enjoying the comfortable and nurturing ride your uterus is giving him/her.
Stress happens and it is a normal part of life so get this issue sorted and put plans in place to help you enjoy this wonderful time.

I'm in basingstoke, hampshire

Are you a midwife Tree?

Jess - can you say who your consultant is?

treedelivery "If this is what you want then read about your choices, their implications, know your risks and be prepared to accept them. Reasure your care givers that you get their point and have considered their points and believe your decision is right for you. "

But how many midwives or doctors sit with women and tell them about the risks of perineal trauma, incontinence, fistula, tears, sex problems, post traumatic stress disorder for VAGINAL birth. They don't

It is all one sided - all the downsides of caesarean but the risks of vaginal are glossed over. "Mustn't tell them about that, they'll get scared and all want caesareans, tee hee"

I speak from experience having had both - elcs was far better!

Yes, so I'll bow out now as it'd tricky trying to be supportive but at the same time giving no opinions or personal advice which is seriously dodgy in terms of my professional practice. Plus don't want to piss anyone off!

The very very very best of all luck Op. I wish you a very fulfilling birth and a lovely lovey baby.

I can hand on heart say I have never tee hee'd at anyone.

I'm certainly off now!

treedelivery "I can hand on heart say I have never tee hee'd at anyone."

Wasn't aimed at you tree but there ARE midwives who behave like that.

Well done for naming and shaming Jess - one to avoid.

You've had lots of good advice on here and my heart goes out to you.

I think you should ask for a CS on the basis of being terrified of birth, which everyone on here can see you are. The concerns you have about physical aspects are almost a red herring in terms of persuading the hospital that you need a section. Your fear is a genuine, accepted and necessary reason why you must have a section. Your fear is totally logical based on your family history, regardless of physical issues.

Only thing I wanted to say was that I had a planned CS last year and it was the loveliest, calmest birth I could have dreamt of. I hope you get this. You will meet your baby and love him or her so much. Fight in a calm and logical way to get the birthing experience you deserve x

I'm going to start putting all of my concrns down in writing. In a calm logical manner. That seems a good place to start. Thanks for all of your support once again

I agree with what was said further up the thread.

You need to contact your midwife and tell her you would like to arrange a meeting with a supervisor of midwives.

In meeting with them you should have an opportunity discuss all your concerns/ fears. They will NOT be able to agree a c-section for you but they will have much more time to have a proper discussion with you than you will get in a 10 minute consultant appointment.

They can then advocate for you and put your case to those who have the ability to agree to a c section.

If you are not happy with the consultant you have, you can ask to see an alternative consultant, though you should be aware they may not be any more willing to agree to a c section.

It may also be worth your while going to see your GP to discuss your concerns and they may be able to write to your consultant supporting the fact that this is having an impact on your mental health.

Please report back to us. I hope you have a happy healthy delivery.

treedelivery

I find it really patronising that anyone wanting an ELC for maternal request is some how thinking that its an easy choice!

To me its like getting my left arm cut off or my right arm.

There is no " easy" choice but with an ELC there is a smaller range of things that can go wrong, compared to a vast array of problems during birth and for long affterwards with " natural " birth.

Also there is the mental side of birth that seems to be dismissed that it can be overwhelmingly mentally traumatic and even a so called straight forward labour can result in trauma for years afterwards as with me.

To me labour is nothing less than torture that you have no idea how and when it will end.

Will you die, be butchered down below? Ever be continent again, will they have to dislocate your babies limbs to get it out....will you push for hours then have an EMC.

Unfortuanlty with the state of the hospitals round me, will you even be admitted to the labour ward? As an increasing number of women cant even get in.

I just cant imagine anything worse than being so vulnerable as to be in labour - then be turned away from your hospital!

One of the reasons i want an ELC is so I can actually simply - get in to the hospital.

Then if you are in, will you get a decent level of care?

At my local hosp women have been left to give birth alone, wrong drugs in jected into them, a serious heart condition not monitered, so many women with placenta left in, they have been heamoraging and on life support machines with every organ shutting down to blood poisoning....

I have tokophobia and since I can remember I have worried about giving birth, even joking to my mother who had four maybe she could be my surrogate. At all the toddler groups I have been to, with a wide range of women I have asked about thier birth experiences, sadly rarely have I heard a positive story, and alot of that has been down to hospitals failing the women.

Out of my own group of friends I was the ONLY one who had a textbook labour and birth, the only one, I would have lost the lives of five friends through the various horrors that went on, and one baby did die, in natural labour with the mother having pre eclampsia which they knew about!

I do not belive that many of the people one comes across in hospital is worried about the mother, in this case if they were they would not have handled the OP;s personal, deeply upsetting circs in such a callous way.

I feel I was very naive and now I know thanks to Mumsnet about the whole Epidural con!!!! I too was conned, the rug was pulled out from under me at the last minuete,..it was an elusive saviour I was never able to get - only x cm, then too much, then too late...Its about BEDS.

There is a BED and cash crisis,

Push them to have a Vbac and you will be lucky if you can get them out with minimum care and cost it doesnt matter that they are left physically damaged for life.....

From my post above

'BTW - I do NOT mean to imply that any one on the thread thinks LSCS is the eay way out'

What more can I say? In what way is that patronising? I've tried to help the op develop awareness of how to get the birth that is best for her. That's all.

I'm 110% outta here as it's upsetting to feel vulnerable and I always end up feeling like a baddie on threads such as these.

Again - all the very very best op.

ElizaRegina,

The OP didn't ask for a el lscs vs vaginal birth debate and I don't think this thread is the place to do it.

The op isnt gettting any "debate" at all from her hospital and it seems that there is "no debate" and as Ushy says - pushing all the problems with ELC is one sided, scare stories and the other side is never mentioned.

As Ushy mentions above, dreadful horrific injuries sustained in " natural" birth that no one tells you about!

treedelivery "I'm afraid that for many of us in the service it is about patient health. Many of us have seen 1st hand that LSCS is not 'the easy way out' and some of us have - very very sadly - seen families who believed it was in real distress at being the unlucky one all the side effects and risks happened."

The problem is for the OP and for many others who have posted about problems with requsting C sections for whatever reasons, is that there isnt any " informed" chat about BOTH sides....it seems they get a blanket no - and thats it.

If they had the choice and proper support going through both sets of problems - they wouldnt be posting on here in a state of utter distress and turmoil and abject fear, desperatly seeking advice!

Beachblue has a point there OP, I should't have asked you the name. It might be worth getting HQ to delete that.

elizaregina your post was from the heart ..well said...you put into words what so many of us know.

What is such a shame is that there is such a difference of opinion between those who provide the service and some of us on the receiving end.

tree I don't count you as a baddie at all but I think there is a mismatch between what maternity services provide and what is being delivered and it isn't just money - a lot of the 'achieving natural birth' rhetoric is about ideology not money.

Bottom line is that the OP is in desperate need and the current system is failing her.

Even as a midwife I've never been part of the natural birth rhetoric. I'm more of a "informed choice" rhetoric. I do believe in supporting a woman in her choices and being her advocate - even if she may choose something I would disagree with.

She isn't me and the risks she may or may not choose to take will have different priorities to how I would view them.

I think I annoy some colleagues by being "too quick" to get epidurals sorted out for women who ask for them. Ie; straight away whereever possible. I do wait for the contraction she's having to subside and ask her if she's sure, run through any consequences, risks, etc and then go and ring the Dr. Where I know other midwives may be more of a "no, you can do it" mentality. Its not my birth.

Jessi28

I wonder what support you had from your community midwife, maybe you didnt convey your fears earlier on? Its just that when I saw mine I said immedialty that I wanted an ELC and of course she gave me a funny look and then said about all the risks.....and how it isnt an easy option.

When she actually let me say - why I wanted one - her whole demenour changed. I had a list of traumas around the birth to do with family BUT I also lost my brother and buried him days before giving birth.

She seemed to think that alone was a good reason to put me forward and she was very supportive after hearing that. She told me I had a good case and to write it all down for consultant and she would too in my notes.

I am so sorry for my rant to you, I am not level headed on this - but its just your post has really moved me, and I feel your pain. Loosing your Aunt/sister alone without in labour would be trauma for anyone to deal with, let alone in these circumstances!

I wish you all the best and I am sure you will be able to get the birth you want.
When you hold your baby in your arms this will all be long forgotton.