"Keep an open mind". No shit!

[ChineapplePunk]

It just seems to be one of those phrases that I hear every time I discuss my birth preparations/plans/thoughts/hopes/expectations with friends/family who have had kids, and it's really beginning to annoy me.

My birth plan, inasmuch as you can have one, is to have a water birth. Will try to get as far as I can with Tens Machine, then G & A and pool. Then, if I need an epidural and have to abandon a water birth, so be it.

I am well aware that complications can arise and births can take a multitude of different turns. If things progress naturally, then great. However, if I have to consider things like sweeps, inductions, CS, etc., then I will, but I wont be railroaded into procedures that I regard as unnecessary (unless there is a genuine medical emergency). I am well aware that placenta function can be compromised and that fetal distress can occur, etc., and would never do anything that would put my baby at risk.

So how an earth could my mind be any more open?

I just get "hahaha - birth plan! What quaint idea that you'll have any control over any of it - or even care!"

...even more annoying when one of the people this fabulous advice comes from is my childless sister.

Your birth plan planning sounds fairly similar to mine - but other people seem to think that usually intelligent people are incapable of research or rational decision making when it comes to their pregnancy. And that they're totally entitled to tell you how wrong you are, based on their experiences, which may have happened 30 years ago - or even longer!

It may be it's not you that needs to be more open minded... :)

wrt your title OP: you are right to have an open mind because there definitely will be shit

suss out who is a useful ear and who isn't
don't discuss things with the poor listeners
easier said than done, I know

good luck with your birth

I had exactly the same thing. My birth plan was also exactly the same as yours, but when I spoke about about it to some people (including the midwife at my 36 week appointment) was a kind of 'yes, yes dear' attitude, as if it was that's all very nice but do wait and see (and keep that open mind) because it probably won't be like that. I felt patronised, as if I wouldn't keep an open mind!

Actually my labour went exactly as I wanted - TENS and then a natural water birth (apart from not being able to have G & A as it made me too sick). I realise I was lucky, but plenty of births won't have complications. But of course my baby's safe delivery was my upmost concern and I would have done whatever was necessary and would never have insisted on rigorously sticking to the plan!

Yeh, the constant snickering about birth plans annoys me too. :)

What the hell is wrong with writing down a plan? Not stoopid! Know it isn't set in stone but it's nice to have guidelines and a feeling of being slightly organised.

Sorry, forget to say best of luck, you'll be fine, it sounds like you have the right attitude.

I saw my mw yesterday and told her a bit of my birth plan.

She replied 'oh, so what you want is a low risk birth then?'. er, yeah, doesn't everyone?

She then followed with 'have you considered an independent midwife?

Wtf?

I think having a good idea of the different pain relief methods is great. What is even more great is knowing that at certain times these might go out the window, but having a good enough grip of what you want to be able to voice it clearly.

Same goes for after the baby is born too and you have annoying MW's, HV's and family and friends offering advice which goes against what you want and what you want for your child.

It seems daring to have opinions or express a preference means your mind is closed....

I uses to preface everything with 'I know we may encounter complications and I have considers all the options very carefully but I would prefer XYZ all being well'.

"It seems daring to have opinions or express a preference means your mind is closed...."

Fraktal That is exactly how I feel. If you openly discuss what you would "like" to happen at your birth then somehow this translates to you being an inflexible control freak.

My MW was great about my birth plan and when she saw I'd written "NO FORCEPS UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES" on it, she clearly explained why it might be necessary and we had a discussion about what could be done to avoid that. Given that I was planning a home birth anyway, we both knew that if I was transferring in because of complications then it was going to be a whole different birth scenario anyway. I'd also had enough appointments with her that she knew I wasn't about to take silly risks and although stubborn, i will listen to reason. I guess when you're presented with a MW who doesn't know you, they sort of have to take the default "anything can happen" approach.

FWIW I think your birth plan sounds great but make sure your partner is familiar with it too. When I was in transition, the second MW who turned up declined to read my birth plan, but always explained what was happening and why and I was in a position to make the decisions that were needed.

I'm glad I did the preparation for the birth plan because at least it meant I was familiar with all the options when put under pressure so those options were less stressful.

Good luck with your water birth.

gallicgirl No worries o that score. My DH is completely in the loop. We wrote the birth plan together and have been doing a hypnobirthing course, so all things being well, he is going to be my "facilitator" during birth. :)

Legs. They're the things to keep open.

At my NHS breastfeeding class, every woman in the room, practically, out of about 30 of us said we were planning a water birth...and with 3 pools available at the hospital we're all going to, and lots of clashing due dates, that's going to be a LOT of women fighting over pools...the only woman not planning a water birth at hospital wanted to have one at home instead :)

I am writing my plan - I will be v surprised if it all goes to plan, but what the hell, I want it down in black and white what my preferences are, just so it's 'there'. If just one thing goes more smoothly to plan or less panicked than it would otherwise, it's got to help, surely? (Mainly thinking of DH - if I'm incapacitated or not able to communicate well, he knows what my intentions are and can communicate on my behalf, hopefully).

Well done DH.

The only other thing I would add is, it's ok to say NO.

You already have the right attitude and honestly you will be totally fine.

There is only one birthing pool at my hospital, but it's actually a fairly "quiet" maternity unit with a lot less traffic than other hospitals. At each antenatal class the MV's have said that clashes with pool are actually very rare, however, they also have big corner baths that they can plop you in. :) If a water birth is not possible then that that'll be another "so be it" scenario.

Chineapple, I always feel a great sense of affinity with your posts, as they often pick up on something I've been thinking, often rather crossly, about!

I'm due tomorrow, and am feeling more than a bit 'yes, deared' on the same grounds, recently. My community midwife has been great throughout the pregnancy, and an excellent listener and advisor, but last week - despite the fact that several weeks ago I made it plain I would not have a sweep - she's started to sound as if she thinks I am being irresponsible by not having one to 'avoid an induction' (this was at 39 weeks into a perfectly normal pregnancy).

I've done the reading on post-term stillbirths, and I'm familiar with the NICE guidelines, and I've made it as clear as I can to her that I'm not going to be railroaded into any intervention other than expectant monitoring without there being a clear medical indication as to why it is necessary. I'm not even actually due yet, the baby is in position, I've had some bouts of practice contractions, and there's a good chance the scan dates are more than a week out, so I don't think there's any need for panic.

But as you say, it's the slightly sneery 'yes, dear, we all wrote birth plans when we were silly first-timers' thing from certain other people that's getting me down a bit. Not helped by picking up an issue of an NCT magazine yesterday all of whose birth stories mocked the mere idea of birth plans as signs of naive first-timer idealism.

I'm a realist - I know perfectly well that there's no way I can know how I'll cope with pain, or what possible complications may happen. I would prefer to rely on TENS and water for pain relief, but I know perfectly well that that may change. My mind is as open as it can possibly be, but I'm heartily sick of being told I'm silly for even having preferences. Grr.

I've already adapted my DC1 birthplan for DC2.

It contains 'yes please I would very much like a local for any stitches' (eternally grateful to that MW) and instructions for DH

Gah posted.

.... So I really don't think it's only first timers who write or should write birth plans, in fact they should be done with every pregnancy taking into account your thoughts, feelings, available facilities and any peculiarities eg positioning of baby, maternal conditions such as SPD etc.

Hardcheese, I think what you are doing is perfectly sensible, and most definitely not irresponsible. As my due date approaches, I have the same concerns as you. I think that as D-Day gets closer I may find the attitudes of my MV's change and the "guilt card" may be played. Maybe I am am wrong, but, based on the experiences of women I know, it would seem that lip service is paid to the idea that nothing is compulsory and you DO have choices in regards to sweeps/inductions, but when you pass your due date the railroading can begin. :(

HardCheese, I am on birth no. 3 and each baby has had a birth plan more detailed than the one before. It isn't just something 'silly' first timers do I can assure you. If anything people who didn't make one first time have VERY strong preferences based on their experiences during the first.

I would say a lot of second-timers who didn't enjoy their first birth/had complications have birth plans.

I also think people remind you to keep an open mind because, even with quite flexible preferences, it can be a bit shocking when it all goes tits up. I had a very laid back approach to my plan, though I did have one and had done hypnobirthing/juju sundining etc. However, I ended up having to be induced and so the waterbirth/homebirth was out the window, and six hours into the drip, I got the epidural (which I was fine with, I had planned for this in the event of induction) and then I had the almost obligatory first-timers' two hours pushing followed by trial of forceps in theatre/Kielland's forceps delivery.

It was all fine in its own way but, being pregnant again now, I can see why people say it. I thought my mind was open but the whole thing was quite profoundly shocking and that did impact on me. This is not to say that stating your preferences is in any way a bad thing, but bearing in mind that birth can be unpredictable right up to and even beyond the delivery of the placenta is probably no bad thing. It's a catch-22. Often people end up saying: "but why did no one prepare me?", when in fact, these sorts of conversations are as far as people can take it pre-birth. It's not meant to patronise.

Other than that, I would say if you don't want to have this feedback do choose who you talk to and talk to others in your situation vs people who may feel differently because of their own situations. I don't really talk about my birth plans to anyone other than my husband, caregivers and people I know who are going to consider births like mine (home waterbirth). I have a lot of good friends who are due in the next 3-4 months and I literally haven't mentioned it to any of them in any detail because they are all birthing in hospitals and very pro-epidural and last time I did bring it up I got a lot of talk about how modern drugs were made for a reason.. which is fine, and I don't have any issue with them thinking this way for themselves, but I don't want to have to argue my own choices with them, it all seems too sensitive and private to me. I say "oh, my plan for this birth is to prepare for everything and expect nothing" and no one ever seems to quibble with that!

Op people deliht in telling. You how stupid you were to plan how it will all go wrong and how awful it will be. It doesn't stop there. You won't brush your hair for a year and won't make a phone call uninterrupted for 5 years. Ok that ones true :)

I think part of the problem is the name 'birth plan' - it does sound like it is more fixed than it often turns out to be. Maybe there should be a new name maybe 'birth wishes' or 'preferred birthing decisions,' although that obviously needs to be set out with the absolute need for consent to any treatment in mind.

I think its partly a personality thing I would never write a plan for anything

The thing is that most people have met someone who straight out of NCT classes has said 'I want a natural birth'. Don't most people???? I am yet to hear anyone say 'I've decided I fancy ventouse'. They are under the impression that instrumental deliveries and CS only happens to people who dont sit on birthing balls for an hour a day from 37 weeks.

Anyway, the same person has the baby ends up with an induction lasting 3 days with forceps and they come out feeling like a failure and traumatised. This person said to a friend of mine who has had two ventouse deliveries 'until it happened to me I just thought you werent pushing right' say what!?

That is why people are telling you to keep an open mind. You are clearly intelligent enough to have worked this out for yourself so I can understand also why you find them irritating. I hope everything goes well for you (as it did for me I was one of the lucky ones with my 2 births)