My 8 year old DD won't sleep in her bed

[Gattasyl]

We are very close to being completely broken. My 8 year old DD won't sleep in her bed. She has always being difficult at bedtimes but we went through times where she was OK and even sometimes slept through the night. 90% of the time though, if she falls asleep in her bed (which might take up to 2 hours of 'drama'), she will wake up at the slightest noise and come in our bedroom, wake us up with the final goal of getting my husband to leave our bed so she can sleep with me. If that is allowed to happen she settles fairly easily most of the time, if we challenge her we are looking at hours awake in the middle of the night trying to placate her / fighting / shouting /crying...

My DH and I haven't slept together in our bed from start to finish in months and months and months. Bedtimes are charged with anxiety and sadness and anger and I just don't know what to do anymore. My husband always adopts the 'hard ball route', while I most of the time am so shattered physically and emotionally that I allow her to come and sleep with me or end us sitting by her bed until she falls asleep and then try and creep out of her bedroom. Sometimes she still wakes up even if she sounds to me deeply sleeping.

The reasons for all this are always different. She comes up with a different excuse every time...sometimes a physical ailment, at the moment she says she's scared someone might come in. I feel they are just excuses and she knows it. I feel manipulated and so resentful. My DH blames me for having been 'always too soft with her', holding her hand while she fell asleep when she was little etc etc. I am scared she might have an anxiety disorder.

I don't know what to do anymore. Anyone has any advice?

What is she like at school ? Does she have friends/get invited to tea/parties ? What do the teachers say about her behaviour and where she’s at ?

Unless you and dh are on the same page trying to find a solution is pointless.. What consequences is there for dd? At 8 she should be in her own bed imo.

Maybe some family therapy for you all. Sounds like your family dynamic is out of whack.
Also get the book or better if there’s a local class, do the ‘how to talk so kids will listen, how to listen so kids will talk’, its very important that your husband does it as well.
Sorry I haven’t got anything more useful. Sounds very stressful for all of you.

At 8 she needs her own bed. You need to be consistent though, and don't cave in as it's the easy option. Small time pain for long term gain. Caveated by if there is any sign of ND

Have you seen how super nanny deals with this?

take her back to her bed, no words apart from, it’s time to sleep, you need to go to bed

no drama, no emotions, no conversation outside of this

broken record

yea it will take a while to do, but when she realises you’re serious - and in agreement with each other - she will eventually drop the drama.

Never ever cave. Never.

You need to take care he same approach as DH.
Never cave. Tell her she won't be sleeping in your bed again and stick to it.

Yeah tbh I agree with your husband - this is where all that "just stay with them, they're only little once, they'll grow out of it" business gets you. Maybe you should go away for a few nights and let your husband deal with it.

No, it has to be both, consistent and unbreakable

@Gattasyl YOU have to get on board to get your life back.

you can do this and you have to.

Surely you are feeding her anxiety? You have provided so many props now she will feel she needs them! Bath. Book. Kiss
Leave.
You really do owe it to your entire family to be tougher.. Dd will ime be happier after better sleep. Happier to go to bed before long.

Ir really depends if she’s playing up because she’s scared or if she is just wanting her own way imo. My DD is now 14 and was very anxious at bed time at that age, fortunately she would go into her bed by herself but one of us had to stay upstairs in our bedroom till she did so she could hear us nearby. She would always wake in the night and be scared and wanted me to be in her room or for her to come in our bed, I was like you absolutely shattered and it caused friction between me and DH as he said I was too soft but she was genuinely frightened when she woke up.

What worked in the end was putting a put up bed in our bedroom. If she woke in the night and was scared she just came and got in the put up bed, often we would wake up in the morning and wouldn’t have even heard her come in. It meant we all got a good nights sleep. On nights she was very anxious she would get straight in the put up bed in our room. I could see my DD wasn’t just playing up though, she was incredibly anxious and scared and no amount of reassuring / ignoring did any good. She carried on sleeping in our room till she was about 10 and then she just stopped and didn’t do it anymore and we haven’t had any issues with sleeping since. I realise my approach wouldn’t work for everyone but it was the only way none of us were disturbed in the night and got a good nights sleep and I actually got to sleep in the same bed as DH! Good luck though as lack of sleep is the absolute worst!

A nanny friend recommended having a sleeping bag on the floor. If she comes in - 'yes of course, there's the sleeping bag for you.' They usually realise reasonably quickly that their own bed is more comfy.

My ds has a meditation podcast he listens to. I thought it might be complete bunkum, but it sends him off pretty quickly (he's only 4 though).

Hope you find a solution to this - you sound at the end of your tether! X

I was in this position, couldn't see an end.
However I set a date in advance and made it clear on that date she'd be in her bed all night, lots of incentives.
When it came to it, I had a few nights of coming into my room but I took her back to her room and reminded her of the new rules.
She was 9, it worked and she settled well, I talked of the sleepovers she could have etc.
It's tough but stand your ground and brace yourself for a few disturbed nights, she'll get there.

Does she ever have sleepovers? Either at home, at a friend's house or with grandparents? Or does she go to Brownie camps?

There's sure to be a school residential in the next year or so - she needs to be ready for that.

Both of you sit down with her and tell her she is too old to come in your bed and that it's not fair on her dad to have to leave his bed every night. Tell her what's going to happen - ie that she will go to bed at x time. She can either read to herself or someone will read to her until y time. Then it's lights out and sleep time. Downstairs is for adults only after this because adults need to relax away from children in the evenings because they have work.
Tell her that if she comes to your room you will take her (send her?) back every time.
And then stick to it. There will be tears, but I bet only for three or four nights.
Agree a reward system with her - whatever floats her boat (within reason!) and then

I never understand this. The solution to your problem is clear as day.

Do you know what you need to do but you just don't have the will to do it? If it's this, nobody can help you.

Or do you not know what to say and do to get her to stay in bed? If it's this, watch super nanny. Keep taking her back to bed. Enforce the boundary.

Im ill and my house was messy today, but I had family coming around. My options were leave it messy and be embarrassed or get off my arse and clean up. I cleaned up. Sometimes you just have to get off your arse and do the thing you don't have the energy to do.

You have my sympathy OP. We are in a similar position with my dd who is 9 but I think we are coming out the other side now.
dd has always found bedtimes tricky, she has ‘rituals’ and routines that she must do before any thought of settling. This time last year her anxiety reached new levels and she started refusing to be in her bed at all. She actually started adding OCD routines in other areas of her life, had tummy aches and vomiting, and started refusing to go in to school (she’d always loved school and had lots of friends).

We ended up getting a camhs referral through the GP (largely due to the vomiting through anxiety). We then ended up with a block of Family Therapy which addressed the OCD behaviours, our responses to her, our other dc’s responses to her, dd’s aspirations (e.g. sleepovers!) etc
We are now at the point that most of the rituals have gone, and she is sleeping in her own bed. We still have to ‘pop in’ until she is asleep. She is going to attempt her first sleepover at her best friend’s house this weekend.

It’s far too simplistic to say ‘nip it in the bud’ etc. These behaviours happen for genuine reasons. The last thing I wanted to do was cause her added stress and anxiety by taking a ‘firm approach’. Sure, there were many occasions where I lost my shit, but this never helped! What has ultimately worked for my dd is a more gentle unpicking of the root causes of the behaviours and then gradually making changes.

Sorry for the lengthy post- as the OP is realising it can have massive impacts on all relationships in the home and it’s not as straight forward as ‘take her back to bed without saying a word’.

I don’t think it’s as easy as some PPs either. It does sound like very real anxiety and and dismissing it won’t help and could make it worse .

The pop up bed / sleeping bag idea is a a good one initially, then I’d be looking for outside help. Is private counselling possible, OP? Cahms are overrun. Pay if you can, you’ll get seen much quicker.

I don’t think it’s as easy as some PPs either. It does sound like very real anxiety and and dismissing it won’t help and could make it worse

You think so? It sounds to me like a little girl who has learned to manipulate her mum to get what she wants.

You think so? It sounds to me like a little girl who has learned to manipulate her mum to get what she wants.

All she wants is to be close to someone at night when she feels insecure. She's hardly manipulating her for sweets or money is she.

You must be exhausted OP.

The only way to solve this is to take her back to her bedroom every. single. time.

Not once does she get to stay. As a PP says it’s short term pain for long term gain, she’s doing this because it’s a habit and she knows you’ll give in.

When she learns you won’t, she (eventually) won’t.

Apply the same rules you do when a toddler gets up at night just out of habit, lead her back to bed, no chat, no eye contact, kiss her goodnight and leave her.

Some kids are just like this. I know a family where 1 child out of four siblings needed to come into mum and dad’s room in the middle of the night until the age of nine or ten. The parents coped by having a space for him to sleep at the end of their bed (A little bench or sofa type thing). None of the other kids did anything like this and they’d all been raised the same. It wasn’t the young child either and they were all pretty close in age.
Try a designated space in your room for her to sleep - could be a camp bed or similar with a spare blanket - at least then your DH won’t be kicked out of bed. You don’t say in your OP but I’d only be comfortable with that idea if he’s her dad. If he’s her stepdad I’d be wanting clearer boundaries and would put a mattress or trundle in her room so you can finish the night in her room if need be. Take the anger and frustration out of the situation. Your DH should not be getting kicked out of his own bed, that needs to stop.

God sod that. She's controlling the situation no end. Be the parents and sort this out. Watch the 3 day nanny back to bed routine on you tube. Stick to your guns and it will work. Do not ever back down and you will sort this out once and for all No way would I have an 8 year old causing all this disturbance at night it's ridiculous

Agree with @Turquoisesea we put single bed next to double and child could get into that when they wanted, they grow out of it but some children take longer than others. Is it really such a big deal if it makes them feel safe and loved🤷 they are not still there at 21😂

Firstly you and DH need to agree on your approach.

Mine often don't like to sleep alone, they prefer to all be together, they are able to sleep alone as they've been to relatives for sleepovers. Sometimes I find them all cuddled up together in one bed. Personally it's never bothered us having them in the room we have a spare matress under our bed and it's there if they need it. If it makes them feel safer and means everyone can get as much sleep as possible then it works for me.

She does sound like she is experiencing some anxiety or insecurity of some sort....maybe try to get to the bottom of that.I don't think letting her constantly come in your bed and push DH out is good for any of you mentally or the family dynamic HOWEVER nor is not providing her the emotional reassurance she needs if she is genuinely upset and worried...could you or DH go and sleep in her room/bed instead of someone getting pushed out of your bed? I've done this on occasion with my 5yo DD when she has had nightmares etc, although i get this might be abit trickier space wise if yours is 8 and in a single bed.
If not maybe try some gentle sleep training, such as reassauring/ snuggling her before she goes to sleep each time if she wants to, but departing from the room before she is actually asleep so there isn't co-dependancy each time she wakes up.My friend had this too...her DD is very anxious and is 9 now and in her own bed all night every night I think, but only in the past year or so and I think they used rewards x