BPD/ anxiety in 15 year old

[AMBC25]

Hi all
Our dd15 , after giving up on CAmhs has been given a diagnosis of anxiety/depression and the consultant psychiatrist days she is showing signs of borderline personality disorder. She has been prescribed Prozac. Any advice or shared experiences greatly appreciated as it's quite scary but my dh and I have vowed to keep our heads. It's been a very hard year with her. Little nervous about Prozac but also need to trust doctor and she is extremely low. They are then going to start DPT therapy.
Going privately was where we eventually felt we got some kind of help. Thanks all in advance

Sorry need to clarify, we were referred to CAmhs but got nowhere with them. We got prioritised after an ed visit , assessed by a nurse and registrar and saw the consultant psychiatrist 2 months later who prescribed medication and said therapy would be a help but could give no timeline on when it would start

Have you read this, OP? Here.

Hi - I know of a private DBT offering called Mind Reframed. Not sure if they offer help for children but worth getting in touch. My friend says it saved her life - she manages all factors of BPD and is fairly happy. If you like I can find out more info? DM me if you'd like

My information may be out of date but i understood that borderline personality disorder is not an appropriate diagnosis before the age of 25? Reason being that BPD behaviour is very very like normal teenage behaviour - emotional lability, narcissism etc... most grow out of it, life becomes calmer and things do get better. My child was also given SSRIs, the idea is to help them get to a calm enough place to accept therapy. I thought we’d never get through it in one piece, self harming, risky behaviour, it went on and on (at the time) but time has worked its magic and the hormones levelled and now in early 20s life is much more enjoyable for everyone. Still some issues mind you as autism was eventually diagnosed which is life long but so so much improved. Good luck. Hold your nerve.

The age is usually 18. I had traits from a young age. It wasn't something I grew out, in fact I tried so hard to do it on my own until I had a complete breakdown after finishing my 2nd year of medical school.I was diagnosed at the age of 24 three months after I decided I would kill myself. I've been with my therapist for three years now.

Therapy is vital in my opinion.

I would recommend reading as much as possible about it too. I hate you don't leave me is commonly a good starting point.

There's also DBT books for learning emotional regulation you can start yourself available on amazon.

The documentary having a life worth living- Dr Aguiree's insights and back from the edge are the best that I've found.

Thanks so much for response. This isn't something that you can share with other parents on a day to day basis so it's a big help to get advice/thoughts here.
Hollow talk that article is very reassuring thanks.
Mid clegs thanks too , wherr we have her can offer CBT,and DBT and the doctor said we are looking at about 2 years of therapy.
Iamcurious, yes you're right. She said they would never officially diagnose before 18 but that she was showing traits, I think she is too. Our experiences sound similar. I want to do our very best for her while trying to stay sane ourselves and try to have some quality time for her siblings who have been affected.
Orange cake, so sorry you went through this as I see how my DD struggles. We got that feeling about therapy too from the doctor and luckily they can provide it. Can I ask, is it DBT that you do? I will read and watch your recommendations. We have some self pity moments and days where we feel beaten down but it's better to be proactive I guess.

Hi OP, I could have written most of your post except my DD is 14. We also went private after CAHMS dismissed her as ‘just stressed’ - unbelievable if I told you all her symptoms, which verge on the psychotic. Her psychiatrist mentioned possible ‘emerging BPD’ but we are waiting to see if prozac has any effect. She was on sertraline at first but had terrible side effects. So far so good on the prozac; her mood is better and her counsellor says she is doing well in therapy but we seem to be doing the one step forwards, three steps back dance atm. Nine months since we went private. Are you getting any support from her school - have they set up a care plan? I fear DD’s school is getting a bit antsy at lack of progress (as they see it) but I just don’t know what else we can do 😟.

@OP please do get in touch. I spoke to my friend.. Your daughter's psych is using quite out of date diagnosis criteria; as well as BPD not being diagnosed until later in life it's also now as a diagnosis being phased out and C-PTSD or emotional regulation disorder being used; both diagnoses implying that this is not a personality disorder. And so therefore generally treatable with talking therapy and 'skills' training. Look up Marsha Linehan. CBT won't work but DBT will.!

Also mood stabilisers are great - drugs used for epilepsy so very well tested.

Op we are in the same position as you. I too have a 15 year old dd who is really struggling. 18 months of battling with camhs, constantly changing diagnosis and now the most recent psychiatrist is saying most likely diagnosis is emotional disregulation and depression. I am at my wits end. The constant mood swings and impulsive behaviour are really hard to cope with but camhs don’t seem to be able to offer any long term therapy to help. We have tried various ads and mood stabilizers to very little effect. I’m just praying that some private therapy may help her. It’s absolutely heartbreaking to see her struggling so much but to feel so utterly useless and incapable of helping her.

I actually did psychodynamic therapy twice a week for the first year and a bit then once a week with the occasional second session when needed. It was expensive but I never thought I would live beyond 26 (I'm 28 now). My therapist saw me on his lower fee which was £30 per session less than what he normally charges for an evening slot in London. I'd be lying if I said I was still fixed but I'm not- I still have days where I'm struggling but I'm just glad I wasn't where I was when I first started.

You're doing your best and that's all that matters. I think just providing a safe place where your daughter can come to you means a lot.

Emotional dysregulation is the new diagnosis used to replace BPD. As BPD can be managed and there are moves to remove that as a type of personality disorder.

Marsha Linehan is worth looking up, she is probably the world's best psychiatrist on BPD - and wrote the DBT treatment books for private and NHS practice.

For those who've written about their kids - please don't despair - this is treatable. I would add though that our brains aren't fully matured until mid-20s, so it may take some time.

Thanks midclegs. A CAmhs psychiatrist who saw her in a&e mentioned emotional disregulation and when I looked it up it seemed to be the same as BPD, I'm a bit confused but trying to educate myself. I think both that doctor and her current one have come up with this because of her behaviour along with having anxiety and depression. We have spent many days/nights where she has been allowed to meet friends where at pick up time she doesn't answer her phone and we eventually track her down where we find she is v drunk, probably stoned. The only reason we kept giving her another chance is we were so afraid of what it would do to her mental health keeping her in and away from these friends. She even said once that she would kill herself if she had to stay on. Coupled with that is she seems to not give a s* what she is doing to the whole family (there have been some horrendous nights). She even told the doc in a&e when he asked "do you feel bad about what you have done" she coldly said no. I have to fight myself to not feel resentment towards her as I have 2 other children who need me and there is another family member dying and we would like to be there for them. Sometimes I wonder if she has emotional disregulation or she's just a teenage brat of the highest order. Which is worse an I'll child or a horrible one?! Sorry if that sounds terrible, just venting those inner voices in the hope of non judgement!
Jesterbun I feel so bad for you because I know the constant and immense worry there is. The doc told us we are looking at 2 years of therapy and that she is definitely a suicide risk. Unfortunately my DD is not very open with us hopefully that will change as we work on it. I'm with her pretty much 24/ 7 but my dh and I agreed that he will be there so I can go and do something like a coffee with a friend or a wander around a garden centre to have a break and recharge.
Orangecake thank you again for kind words.
I will be ordering Marsha Linehans books today!
Absolute lifeline to be able to post here xx

Hi OP, no judgment here. I’m sure all parents of teens resent them/get annoyed with them at times (god knows I was horrid from 15-19, my poor mum).

It’s so hard to feel like I can’t express a normal level of annoyance without it becoming a reason for her to want to top herself (eg, make-up on carpet; “please scrub it clean and be more careful with your make-up” = “you hate me! You wish I was dead....I wish I was dead” 🙄

Or when you feel she’s making progress, only for it all to unravel the second you allow yourself to hope things might be getting better. It’s exhausting, and has such an impact on everyone in the family.

Sorry to hear you have another ill relative to deal with on top of everything else 💐

And thanks midclegs for your kind words. I have ordered the Marsha Libehan biog for starters!

Ambc25 I have had similar thoughts to you. I keep telling myself she can’t help it but the impact it is having on family life is horrendous. I dare not leave her alone for any length of time but she hates being “smothered” as she calls it. And as for going to parties - god only knows how I’ll deal with that one. And vinniepolis I totally get what you mean about dealing with the ups and downs. The constant mood swings are exhausting and on the odd occasions where there are glimmers of hope they seem to be followed by more impulsive or risky behaviour and endless phone calls to school, the doctors and CAMHS. I never imagined parenting teens would be this hard. Hang in there everybody - we’ll get them and us through it!

I think labelling a 15 year old is poor practice - especially in an outpatient setting . The label of ‘emerging personality disorder’ which is given to teenagers should be used by real specialists who’ve observed emotions, interactions and behaviour for quite a while. It’s so hard to distinguish between what might be bpd and ordinary teenage dysregulation. I also agree that bpd as a diagnosis seems to be on its way out. I second the idea of getting in touch with mind reframed. Afaik they don’t treat kids, and they’re eye wateringly expensive. But they will definitely talk to you about options and the latest thinking. Also second looking at Marsha linehan. Best of luck to you and your dd.

Thank you craddock 287. I have to agree with you on the labelling after one hour long session and a shorter consultation. But part of me is being careful in case I refuse to believe it and I don't get her the appropriate treatment. It's hard really when you are desperate for help. We have opted to take the advice on starting medication and I hate that our little girl has started Prozac and I question that sometimes but the alternative if I don't could be worse. I'm taking one day at a time, giving her unconditional love and for now have removed anything else that's difficult for her ie. school. She is feeling awful at the moment with flu like symptoms and I'm unsure whether or not Prozac would cause this. She was nauseous too which is to be expected. I know when I was a teen and got caught out I never felt guilt and I adored my mother. So maybe it's the same but she has been excessive in what she has been doing and has caused huge distress and worry in the family and they seem to be basing in on her lack of guilt and the constant lies. We had a happy , funny child until around the time she started secondary school. She was ' wild ' as a child as in fearless and full of life! Wild as a march hare my mother would say 🙂 when she was 2 or 3 she would be fearless in the playgroup and jump off something and never seemed to worry that someone would catch her. She did gorilla circus once no bother to her. Kids on the road called her weird , maybe there was something there I didn't see. We thought she was like a force of nature. She was unbelievably kind to her younger brother and was like a little mother to him. The psychiatrist said that she finds it strange that she was happy, loved school etc and now this and asked did something happen. Sometimes I worry something did and she never told us. One more thing and apologies for very long post but in her group of about 8, every single one without exception is suffering anxiety or depression and school refusal and self harming. Some just one of these, others with all. My dh thought at one stage they were all just feeding off each other but either way she is how she is. She's had two friends tell her on Snapchat that they are going to kill themselves. Who knows?! As I said one day at a time. Thank you all so much again

AMBC25 that’s so interesting what you said about her group of peers. My DD like yours was a force of nature when young, would happily stand up in front of the school and sing a song she’d made up, try anything, no fear, loved school. Until secondary school. In Y8 when this kicked off there seemed to be some competition amongst her group of friends as to who was the most fucked up - they’d show each other their self harm scars etc etc...indeed my own DD stopped self harming because, she said, ‘everyone’s doing it’. (Later on she said she’d stopped because it wasn’t helping, but I’ve always remembered those words.) I read that bulimia was a sort of ‘social contagion’ thing, and the huge growth in teen girls identifying as trans might also be something like that. I have mentioned this to her psych but he just said we should never let her think we don’t believe her because to her the experiences are very real... but I do wonder whether school/social media sowed the seeds. XX

Have you considered ASD? It often goes undiagnosed in girls. Year 8/9 is a classic time when it all falls apart for them as they can no longer mask effectively, leading to massive anxiety and mental health issues.

Foobydoo I have mentioned it to both my DD’s psychiatrist and counsellor, but they’ve said she’s absolutely not, and furthermore I shouldn’t discuss any theories with my DD as to what it might be other than anxiety/depression, as she latches onto ideas, does a bit of research and voila, that “skews” any diagnoses... which kind of feeds into my post above.

@Vinniepolis did they state why they were so sure it was not asd?
I would insist on testing if only to rule it out.

awnnetwork.org/autistic-women-misdiagnosis-and-the-importance-of-getting-it-right/

www.additudemag.com/autism-spectrum-symptoms-adults/
www.autismresearchtrust.org/news/borderline-personality-disorder-or-autism

childmind.org/article/autistic-girls-overlooked-undiagnosed-autism/

@Foobydoo thanks for the links - interesting reading. In some ways she fits, but they seemed to think there are other explanations that fitted better. But I will raise it again and push for a formal assessment.

Hello, I’m sorry to hear you, and others, are going through this. I can’t add anything at the moment but only that my dd 15 has severe anxiety and it’s been a very tough 3/4 years since starting secondary school. I am in despair most of the time. It has been utterly heartbreaking and I cannot look at photos of my beautiful girl at primary school without a mix of hurt, sadness, anger, jealousy and bitterness. Sending you hugs 🥰🥰🥰😳😳😳 You are not alone.....

It's very hard Dodie when you look back at old photos, my dds problems emerged when she went into secondary. She wasn't a shy child in primary, in fact seemed the opposite. I get dad too looking at her age group walking into school chatting, laughing etc but I have found it a bit helpful to just take one day at a time. She has dropped out of school completely. She is now with the best doctor/counseling our area has to offer (private). I also find it helpful to tell myself I'm doing as much as I can as a parent which I'm sure you are too. I'm handing a lot of it now over to the professionals and I will just try and give herots of love and a few laughs at home and try not to let her feel guilty for this. Like I day. I just take day by day and try not to compare us to other families. xx

Hi again all, I'm hoping you will see my post/update and respond. My DD is currently in an adolescent mental health unit. She had been prescribed Prozac to little effect and they are now taking her off it, they say they want to get a baseline for her as on see what she is like without ad. They also mentioned traits of emotional disregulation but they called it personality disorder. When I look it up even for teens, it doesn't seem to fit except for low mood, self harm and suicidal ideation. She can read people's emotions very well, she is actually easy enough at home, there are no mood swings, she just has constant low mood. She told me the other night on the phone that she doesn't want to die, if she could just kill her brain. For two nights on there she did have 'episodes' when left alone at night where she tore the place apart looking for something to kill herself with and that she hadn't done that at home because she didn't want me to find her. Last night she rang after asking a nurse to speak to me and was sobbing down the phone saying she wanted me to hug her. It's torture! We can't see her because of covid. I see that they want to observe her over time to see exactly what she is going through. The pain she is in is unbelievably heartbreaking. And I am terrified of the idea that she will suffer for life or/ have bpd which is negative of me. After over a year of intense stress, worry, tension on the house around her behaviour with friends drinking etc( we also just found out that she had been sexually active too) I have finally unravelled. I was strong up to then even when I brought her to the unit to say goodbye. A few months ago I went on a low dose of ad as anxiety was ramping up and I gave up my job to look after her but I feel like I can't cope anymore. Yesterday I had strong suicidal thoughts, it's as if something has snapped. I have been given a higher dose of ad which will help I know. Jesus, I can't be like this when I need to care for her. It feels like an overwhelmingly hopeless situation. I have two other kids who are suffering through all this. Sorry for moaning about me, this should be about my DD. I also miss her so much and she me.