Rear-facing car seats to 18kg in Britain Campaign!!!

[justforinfo]

Hey guys!

I am a child seat fitter at a large child seat supplying store (I don't think i'd be allowed to say which one!) and I have recently read about rear-facing seats to the age of 4 and after doing some intense research have found that the offer optimum safety for children. They are the norm in Scandinavian countries where child fatalities in crashes are near enough 0 every year. Britax, Graco etc all stress on the websites for scandinavian countries that children should be rear-facing untill they are about 4 years of age but there is no mention of this anywhere on the British sites. The British medical journal stresses that rear-ward facing is the safest option. So why are these seats not widely known about? Why are they not in big stores like the one I work in? Apparently it's because British parents don't want them. So are they trying to say British parents don't value their children's lives? The customers i've spoken to about these rearward facing seats had never heard of them and were shocked they were not being given information that would potentially save their child's life! These seats were not even mentioned in ANY of my training.

It's only through my own personal research I do to make sure i'm offering the best and safest options to parents did I find out about them!

I am currently trying to raise awareness of these seats and to get some at least on display in the company I work for. At the minute this is pretty single-handed!

I'd love to know what your views are on the seats and if you would like the option to have a seat that is 5 times safer?

I'd need alot of support to make any changes to what is supplied in store, but if parents are contacting big chains that supply child seats and asking why they are not being offered these seats it will change! Consumer pressure works wonders and I am at a loss to see how "health and safety Britain" has missed this!

I may just be talking out my backside and parents may be perfectly happy with the traditional seat but i'd appreciate the feedback all the same. Please take a moment to look at this website and watch the crash tests. www.rearfacing.co.uk

Sorry about the essay!
Thanks!

Facebook site here

bump
just joined the facebook group, am very keen to spread the word!

With ISOfix the only advantage on safety is that they can't be fitted incorrectly. Incorrectly fitted seats are the cause of a lot of car-related injuries, I believe.

NOT SO FAST
I know about someone, who couldn´t find out how to install the Britax Duo Plus with isofix! Not even with the user guide at hand

As a result she claimed these seats were nowhere near easy to fit, and that the local seats (non-European) were safer that way.

Lena

I haven't read all of this thread but a lot of you seem to be saying that you'd like to see a rf seat in a high street store. I was in John Leis the other day and they had the Recaro Polaric for £230 on display. They don't sell it online so you have to live relatively near a store unless you want to make a special trip.
Sorry if this has been posted about already.

aswellasyou - John Lewis do stock the polaric in store, and Halfords do it online, but it's isofix only :-/ personally i'd love to see the polaric in store, the britax 2way and the maxi cosi mobi! It's a start though :)

It would be nice to have a whole range available in lots of stores so we can try them without a big trek to Milton Keynes or Belfast! I don't drive so my daughter's seat will be in and out of different cars, which means I have to make an educated guess at what seat will fit in the various cars. If JL or others had different ones to choose from I would be able to try them in different cars without taking a fleet of cars on a road trip. Unfortunately, because the Polaric is Isofix, it won't go in two of the three cars I want it to. I'm pleased JL have made a start and hopefully this is the beginning of a car seat revolution!

I will be buying a rear-facing seat for DD despite having perfectly good ones left over from DS1 and DS2. I need to drive 50+ miles to a JL to get a Recaro Polaric next week. It'll be worth it, but a bit of a pain.

Hi
I have joined the facebook campaign, and invited a couple of friends who have rear facers.
We got our Besafe from That's My Baby in Swindon.
Once you get the hang of installing them, it only takes a few minutes to move them from car to car. Ours are installed in a Ford Focus estate and a VW Polo. There is adequate leg room in the front passenger seat for DH who is about 5 foot 9, but he does prefer to drive for longer journeys.
Good luck with spreading the word, OP!

Have joined the Facebook campaign. Was converted to RF after reading here on MN. Almost no availability back then (apart from Milton Keynes) so had one shipped from Sweden. We have the Akta Graco Duologic II and have been very happy with it - now on to second child

We chose that one because it fitted Isofix and seatbelt and was easy to move between cars because it doesn't use tethers. It also has quite a small footprint so fitted better. It also is suitable from birth to 18Kg, so if you plan ahead you can buy it from newborn, which saves the expense of buying both a Group 0+ and Group 1 seat.

Purveyor, that's the one I'm planning on getting. I don't know whether I'll get the I or II yet. I'm selling a load of old clothes on eBay at the moment so I'll have some money to go towards the car seat (nearly £100 so far! ). I'm single and on benefits at the moment so £300 is a lot for me but it will be worth it if she's unfortunate enough to be in an incident before she's 4. It's a shame I didn't know about them before or I would have bought it from newborn.

aswellasyou good luck with your eBay-ing. It is a good seat and very much worth the expense. The Britax 2-way is also worth considering as it can be used for longer and is £100 cheaper. It isn't isofix though.

I was thinking about another one but the Graco passed the Swedish Plus Test/Test Plus (I don't remeber which way round that goes) and I know it fits in a Peugeot 206 so I assume it'll fit a 207. I like the fact it is both isofix and non-isofix too.

thanks for joining the campaign! x

I'm going to have a little moan about John Lewis today.

I need the car seat for DD now - she's getting too big for the baby seat, so I looked at the JL website to try to get the polaric. It said it was only available in store, and to ring to check they had it in. So I rang the local store, they said they didn't keep it in stock anywhere and they would have to order it from the distributor. And I would have to pay for it because they couldn't get stock without a customer order.

The whole point of going to JL is that they have trained car seat people to advise on whether things fit before you buy. . I have paid for this seat, but if I take it out of its packaging, I can't get my money back. I can't test it in my car without taking it out of its packaging. All the other car seats in the store are easy to buy - JL want to sell them. It's as difficult as it could be to buy this one. I will be making a 50 mile trip to the local branch next week to pick this up, with 3 kids in tow, and have to go to the customer collection point, lug the car seat plus three kids to the nursery department, lug the thing back to the car, hope to goodness it fits...

I didn't have to jump through these hoops when I bought my other car seats for my older two kids. I went to the shop, had a look, got some advice and then chose a seat and paid for it. For the recaro I have to do this in reverse.

So JL please improve your service here.

noid just so you know, halfords do the recaro polaric online! I think it will also be ordered in from the supplier but there are more of them than there are john lewis' so will be easier to return. Also, if you contact recaro they can tell you if it'll fit :)

www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_801153_langId_-1_categoryId_165763

Direct form recaro - www.recaro-seats.co.uk/child-seats/recaro-polaric.php

I don't understand how none of the big retailers have realised what a massive advantage they would have if they were the first and only high street store selling and fitting an RF seat. Even if they only sold them in their larger stores, rather than in every store, most people will be in driving distance of one of their large out of town stores, there are loads.

Lets say Mothercare decided to sell and fit the Britax Two Way Elite, it fits most cars (not just isofix ones or ones that can have a support leg or just massive cars) and is easy to fit. Everyone who currently would buy it online would buy in Mothercare instead because they can try it in their car before buying it and have it fitted for them.

I guess they must think there isn't enough demand for them, I think they'd be surprised if they tried.

too late now, I've already given JL my money. But I think it'll fit as the car has isofix.

But aside from my difficulty in getting a rear-facing seat I just don't understand why one of these big existing companies isn't going to stand up and say "we do rear-facing seats. Aren't they good? Come and give us your money"

Is it because they'd be somehow admitting that forward-facing aren't so good? It seems that there's a huge market waiting and noones jumping on the opportunity. I wish I was an entrepreneur as I think there's a quid or two to be made here.

noid just because your car has isofix it doesn't mean it'll fit, for any isofix seat you need to check with the manufacturer :-/ i've had customers in work with isofix that have wanted the maxi-cosi easyfix & cabrio and it hasn't been listed... :(

When I asked the head of child seats why we don't stock them the reason was:

"It is difficult to get the information out about rear-facing seats in a sensitive manner and without using scare-tactics. Large companies such as Britax and Maxi-Cosi feel that British parents don't want rear-facing group 1 seats and prefer the look of the seat to the safety advantages. They are also very tricky to fit and the risk of incorrect fitment is too high"

I completely agree that the larger stores should trail some of the seats and train 1 or 2 members of staff in correct fitting of the seat. I think it would show the company in a fantastic light and would prove that they are serious about child in car safety. Unfortunately there isn't enough demand for them and it would take a major store like Halfords or Mothercare to kick-start it.

I also don't think you need to use scare tactics. I frequently upsell from the cheaper seats to seats with seat-belt tensioners/better side impact etc. As someone has posted previously, you don't need to scream "INTERNAL DECAPITATION" to sell them!

I have looked into starting up and selling these seats but it's pretty much impossible to get started :-(

Oh dear.

I schlepped 50 miles to John Lewis today, with 3 kids and husband in tow. I expected to get there, fit the seat and take DD home in the new car seat with her baby seat in the boot.

It all went horribly wrong. The lady I spoke to on the phone when I got the car seat had told me that someone from the nursery department would be able to show me how to fit it. It turned out (and to be fair to JL they were apologetic) that none of the staff in this large branch - Cribbs Causeway - was trained to fit the Recaro Polaric. One of the partners showed me the display version but she didn't know how to fit it. One of the other partners had seen it fitted more than a year ago but never fitted it himself. They gave us all vouchers for a coffee and a cake, which helped pacify kids and husband, but we needed to travel home with car seat in huge box, taking up the entire boot, and the buggy (which would have fitted in the boot with DD's infant seat) in front of my legs all the way back. The store will ring recaro next week to see if their rep can help with the fitting. I may have to go back there for this.

I will contact our local fire station in the meantime, as they offer to check child car seat fittings. There is a video online, but tbh I'd rather be shown by someone who knows their stuff. Hopefully the fire station can help us with this.

I'm a bit cross with JL, but the staff were very helpful and polite, and the lady who was helping us explained that there was very little demand for the polaric so she'd never needed to help fit it. We haven't yet got it out of the box but I am optimistic we will get it fitted safely - we have a scenic which is apparently compatible and the fire station's website looks promising.

I'm reeling a little bit about all the hurdles we need to jump just to get a rear-facing seat.

"British parents don't want rear-facing group 1 seats and prefer the look of the seat to the safety advantages"

I wonder what they are basing that on?

Noid Come back and tell us if the fire department were able to help. That would be very helpful for people who buy their RF seats online.

We are 3 hours + from any stores (also from a John Lewis). I wouldn't buy anything from Halfords as both nearest stores didn't have much in stock or have any knowledge of group 0 seats.

I've taken advice from here & will be making calls to find out more.

I've also spoken to my mp ( who has a transport brief)who is a fan & owns a RF seat for his dd.

Great to see this.

I am very, very luck to live one mile away from the incarsafetycentre and both of my children are in rf car seats.

yorkie the fire service were wonderful with their home safety checks they did a few years ago, and their website looks promising. And they might be dishy :o

Will let you know how this one works out.

The incarsafetycentre does have a video on youtube on how to fit the thing. It doesn't look too hard - it's just that I'd want to know I'd done it right rather than just think I'd done it right.

Both my children are in rear facing car seats. It was a total pain to find somewhere that stocks and fits them anywhere near me. I ended up buying the car seats on a trip to visit a friend in Dorset (6 hours away!). I am appalled that a wide range are not sold in major department stores (and surprised as they are missing out on a lot of money!) There is still very poor awareness and my friends and family are still very surprised that DD is still rear facing at 3 years old and I don't know anyone else that has a rear facing car seat.