Bullying by excluding

[spiderpig8]

I really don't know what to do.DD1 is in Yr4.there are only 4 other girls in her yr group and a further 4 in her class (in yr 5 & 6)
Three of the other girls in DD s year are extremely pushy and selfish and mean to DD who is not aggressive.
DD says she feels invisible.She says the other girls ignore her all the time and won't let her play.They chorus in unison 'we aren't playing anything ' when they obviously are , or just run away from her.
One girl in particular steems to be the ringleader and I have noticed if anyone makes friendly overtures to DD this girl intercedes.
this has really been going on since reception.We have had children in her year back to play but they have been so utterly awful, it hasn't really been enjoyable for anyone.
DD makes friends readily at Brownies ,non-school clubs and on holiday.Although we have noticed she is getting less confident at this.I asked her to try and make friends with the 'nice' girl.She siad that her hair looked lovely after it had been cut and the girl just said 'whatever' and turned away.
We have spoken to the school.The first time we asked what DD is doing to make the other girls not like her.The answer came back very resoundingly that it isn't DD it is the other girls who are so pushy !The Brownie leader , told me she had never had such a group of little madams in the 30 years she had been running brownies.
Recently we have approached the HT who made all the right noises but did nothing.
DD speaks very very quietly at school and now anywhere out of the house.
DD is now becoming a lot more upset by the situation.We went into school again last week and the HT suggested that he thought that the 2 boys in her yr group were being bullied too.(DD actually is friendly with these boys but they have very different interests)HT said he would move the classroom round so DD could be sitting with the older girls and some nice boys.But this hasn't happened.In fact yesterday the teacher let 2 of the nasty girls pick teams for games and DD was picked last.So they are obviously taking no notice of our complaint at all
I can't see anything ever changing.The 'ringleader' is the chair of governors only child and the only non-white child in the school.When we went to
I am so worried about what it is doing to my little girls self esteem and confidence.I really want to move her but I am worried about going from the frying pan into the fire as most of the schools round here are of a similar size.the nearest bigger school is about 8 miles away and would mean we have to move DD2 who is very happy and popular where she is.One of us would have to give up work to HE and we really couldn't afford this .
This type of emotional bullying is so difficult to prove but I feel probably the most damaging.
I wonder whether I should write a letter to the chair of governors to outline my complaint and make her realise how her little princess has affected my DD

You do realise that you are going to get slated for mentioning the racial difference of one of the bullying children?
I can't see that a personal letter to the governor of the offending child is going to help either. It's not the right procedure.

It's not clear to me what you've said to your DD's actual teacher, that teacher is in the front line of dealing with this, so is the first port of call.

Another school might be just the ticket, though.

I think you should write a letter of complaint and copy in the LEA.

I would also put in motion the necessary systems to move your child, as in reality these girls are very unlikely to change their personailities.

As to the non white thing, yes, I have noticed sometimes authority are very reluctant to do anything in case they are accused of racism. My DH has found this in the past in his line of work. It also happens if the child's parents are influential in the area. When I was growing up the doctor's child was never reprimanded when other children would be for the same behaviour, becuase his dad was the local bigwig whom the head did not wnat to upset.

I do have vast experience of bullying in school and Im at a loss with this.

I agree that a new school might be just the ticket but appreciate thats a major upheaval.

What are the playground trends? are they playing skipping or elastics? is there some new collecting cards that are getting the children excited? could she start a trend??

Would it be possible to suggest dd went to help look after the younger ones at playtime as a special job?

You cant make these horrid girls accept dd as shes clearly become the 'whipping boy' but perhaps you could try and get dd into a different place at playtime.

I feel really sorry for your dd and feel that school especially her teacher are being very unfair .

Hi the letter to the bullying girls parent would not be a personal letter , but a letter to her in her role as C of G , as I thought maybe that the governing body was the next port of call after the HT ?
i mentioned the girls colour because I think it has a bearing on how allegations against her might be perceived.
At the moment the girls like the somersault bars in the playground and as soon as they get on they take turns amongst themselves while DD waits for a turn.Then when the bell rings she gets one go before they rush in.

She used to read on a bench at playtime but now apparently she isn't allowed to do that.They aren't allowed to take toys to school either

Vile. Poor kid. I'd move her at once.

(So outraged that forgot to say had v similar probs with own dd and moved her at teh end of Year 3. It was traumatic at first (change is never easy!), but she has blossomed.)

This is the biggest downside to small schools- there just aren't enough children to allow for different friendship groups, you are either in or out, and your poor DD is out. Is there another school nearby? I would move my DD like a shot. Yes it is an upheaval, but it would be worth it.

oh spiderpig8 your poor porr dd, you are describing my school days to the letter, it was utterly vile and shit, I cannot remember being happy as a child apart from on holiday. I don't want to scare you but then effects on my confidence and self-esteem are apparent to this day (35 years old). I also have had lifelong problems having female friendships as I used to be so suspicious of other women. I now have some amazing female friends but it has taken until I'm in my 30s to get there.

Don't let this be your dd, move her straight away even if it means a lot of travelling. My parents said one of their biggest regrets was not moving me, as a result of what happened to me my little sister went to a different primary school and she had the opposite experience and as a result is a much mpre sociable confident person that I'll ever be.

move her please!

I would put in writing your complaint to the HT and copy it to the C of G, if nothing changes write to the LEA and cc it to the HT & CofG but if great strides aren't made I'd move her.

You can write to everyone, but no matter how many letters and cc you write, no one can force those little girls to be nice to your dd. They may pay lip service in front of the staff, but they won't be her friends.

Also, it is often the case that they would rather turn a blind eye to one quiet sad little girl, than try and tackle the group.

I would give her a fresh start somewhere else, somewhere that you trust will put the effort and time in to help her settle in and rebuild her confidence. The poor thing must dread each and every day.

I would move her now. ime 'little madams' can't be turned into nice, considerate, thoughtful girls simply by being told off. If this has been going on since reception its not realistically going to get better. Bullying by exclusion is too hard to police. If she was being punched then the school can intervine but they can't help when all you really have is a series of very trivial/petty sounding complaints. Its akin to the early stages of domestic abuse where the victim can't really say anything because it all sounds a bit silly and they blame themselves. The girls can even make it worse with oily friendliness in front of the staff and ramping up the bullying whenever the teacher is more than 3 feet away ie the vast majority of the day.

IME Year 4 is a bad time for this kind of behaviour. Both mind found it a difficult year, even my very socially confident daughter.

Both of them found Year 5 was better. It's as though children suddenly discoversome of themtheir 'power'.

Empathy!

So sorry to hear about your dd. My dd is also in Y4 and is also rather isolated amongst the girls - but has one really good friend. She has been subjected to some really horrible behaviour from some of the other girls this year (but hadn't experienced anything like it before).

Until the end of last term, I ignored it and felt that it was typical playground behaviour. I changed my mind, when my dd was taken to the Head's office with one of the girls involved in the bullying and my dd was told to apologise - but there was no attempt to explain what she'd done. It was one of those silly discussions where everyone had to apologise. One of the aspects of the bullying was that the girls would make false accusations against my dd either individually or as a group.

At that point I wrote to the head about the issue and had a meeting. When the bullying started again this term, I e mailed the Head again with a detailed account of my concerns.

The person who has been most helpful to me is the school learning mentor - I am wondering whether there is one in your dd's school? I found that she had the best understanding of the problem. She has assured my dd that she can go to her at anytime and makes a point of asking me how things are going.

I don't think that the problem has been resolved for my dd. but I do feel reassured that there is someone who has some understanding of what's going on.

I think that if it wasn't for my dd having a really good friend, I would probably think about changing schools. I, too, have been told that Y4 is a particularly bad year for this types of behaviour - but to be honest, in a small school, there are limited opportunities to find other friendships. I think that if I was in your position, I would change schools.

Is the Head also the teacher of your DD's class? If not I think it might be helpful to ask for a meeting with the Head, the class teacher and the senior mealtime supervisor so all bases are covered and a single approach can be used to manage the behaviour of the girls who are causing so much upset.

I'm trying to think what I would do as a teacher if a parent came and told me that this had been happening (although I'd like to think that I'd notice!) but as I've never taught in a small school I'm not sure....

I think I'd rearrange the class according to children's requests - I actually do this anyway; let each child write down the name of 3 people they work well with and a different 3 they are friends with and I say I'll do my best to put them with one person on their list. I give them an option to come and speak to/e-mail/leave a note for me if there is someone they would feel unhappy about being placed next to. This is quite a telling exercise in itself in terms of class dynamics. I'd then position the children uber-carefully so that the probable ring-leader was in a position that meant she could not make eye-contact with her cronies (at the very front or very back) whilst positioning the 'got at' children (your DD and the two boys) in positions that would give them lots of options for people to talk to, good eye contact positions with their peers but also with me. I'd also devise a lining up order for whenever the children go to assembly/line up in the playground/into the dinner hall etc. so key characters were split up and others supported by friends.

At the same time I'd set up 'worry books' (I've done this and implemented it across the whole school) which are notebooks that every single child writes in every single day after lunch and the teacher reads every single one ASAP (silent reading time for the children). If everyone writes/draws in it daily, even if what they write is "I have no worries" then it is not possible for others to work out if they're being 'told on'. It's an effective way for children to inform teachers of possible bullying behaviour and means it can be dealt with immediately. It also helps that the upset is written down as it forms a record and means any patterns can be identified but also gives an opportunity for the teacher to reply. I have often written in Y4+ worry books, "would you like me to speak to X about this?" or "let me know if you'd like me to help you sort this out". There are potential child protection issues with it so I always make it clear that although a teacher will never show one child's worry book to another child sometimes we may need another adult to see it to help sort out a problem and I always ask a child before I show their book to another member of staff (I usually get them to take it to the other member of staff so they are the one doing the sharing - it can help children feel like they're being taken seriously too which is no bad thing).

Once I'd completely and utterly manipulated their in-class movements I'd work on lunchtimes/playtimes which would probably involve something along the lines of sending 2 children per day to 'help in the office' (I have actually done this - they love shredding paper, delivering registers, sorting school newsletters etc.) and I would be very careful to separate the ringleader and your daughter as often as I could so that the ringleader couldn't see who her other friends were playing with whilst she was occupied.

Meanwhile, I'd be speaking with the mealtime supervisors and asking them how things such as the bars were monitored and perhaps find out if a more concrete system could be put in place to ensure turns were taken fairly.

I would probably also suggest to the parent of the child that they consider moving to a larger school but would warn that girls aged 8+ often have friendship issues and that there's no guarantee that moving school would be the answer. I'm not sure how helpful my reply is but I thought I'd explain what I'd do if your DD were in my class - I detest exclusive behaviour of any sort in school though and would do everything I could to turn it around and would very definitely make sure I didn't let the ringleader choose teams but would come up with a fair and transparent system so she didn't have a chance to leave your DD out in class. I'd probably end up being complained about by the ringleader!

Oh your poor daughter! My DD3 is also in year 4 at a small village school and used to come home with heart-rending stories of sitting on the "lonely bench" - apparently it was invented so anyone feeling lonely could sit there and the other children should notice and go and ask them to join in their games. She said she sat there every playtime crying (could have been a slight exaggeration) and just got laughed at. It was heart-rending.

I spoke to the lunchtime supervisors and asked them to keep an eye on her. Then suddenly she made a best friend (a girl with glasses and a squint god bless her who probably was also getting similar treatment - but they make each other very happy!) and she is a different child now.

But I has started the process to move her to another school. And if it is altering your DDs behaviour at home to the degree you say I would have her out pronto - could it be any worse? I was bullied at junior school and I have never forgotten it.

Am just about to move DD2 (also Year 4) for same reason albeit not as bad as your situation seems to be. She is at a small school so not many other girls to choose from. She is not being bullied and no one is being explicity horrid and some days are absolutely fine BUT there so many days when she is isolated at playtimes and just very lonely.

In our case, the problem is that a group of mothers all know each other very well and socialise all the time out of school so that their DDs mix in school. There isn't room for an "outsider" and the school can't (won't?)really do much about this.

So DD2 is about to move at Easter to a bigger school and it will involve a long journey each way but will be worth it if she is happy and has friends.

So many lovely children feeling sad at school it makes me just to think about it.

If somebody talked to me about this kind of situation, as a parent, I would do my best to help, and to get my own child to help the lonely one feel included. Do you think that others wouldn't? I would be very sympathetic, esp as you never know when you'll be in the same position.

Actually Romanarama has a point .....can you not pal up with some mums and try and build friendships for your dd or are the mums as bad as the daughters?

SE13Mummy - you are the only teacher in the world who would do all that. Good show.

Hullygully - I'm not! I spent 6 years working in a tricky school full of challenging children and jam-packed with teachers who would have done (and often did) the same sort of thing.

I rarely post on this thread but for some reason clicked on it today. SE13Mummy if only there were more teachers like you school would be a much happier place for so many children. Wow I am impressed , maybe spiderpig8 should print this off and show it to her DD's teachers.

Nickschick - hi we were wondering about you yesterday.

Spiderpig8, I had a similar sounding experience at (one of) my primary schools. It was 2 years of hell. I 'coped' by doing every single extra-curricular activity I could which often involved missing playtime. As someone suggested, I used to start 'crazes' but they simply became 'crazes' from which I was excluded.

Sadly, for me, it only stopped when I went to boarding school aged 9. I do hope it can be different for your DD. Maybe there is a teacher like SE13 who you can approach?

ahh, 21again the thread moves so fast and my situation never seems to get much better i felt a bit of a drain to you all .

Thankyou for remebering me .