Bullying by excluding

[spiderpig8]

I really don't know what to do.DD1 is in Yr4.there are only 4 other girls in her yr group and a further 4 in her class (in yr 5 & 6)
Three of the other girls in DD s year are extremely pushy and selfish and mean to DD who is not aggressive.
DD says she feels invisible.She says the other girls ignore her all the time and won't let her play.They chorus in unison 'we aren't playing anything ' when they obviously are , or just run away from her.
One girl in particular steems to be the ringleader and I have noticed if anyone makes friendly overtures to DD this girl intercedes.
this has really been going on since reception.We have had children in her year back to play but they have been so utterly awful, it hasn't really been enjoyable for anyone.
DD makes friends readily at Brownies ,non-school clubs and on holiday.Although we have noticed she is getting less confident at this.I asked her to try and make friends with the 'nice' girl.She siad that her hair looked lovely after it had been cut and the girl just said 'whatever' and turned away.
We have spoken to the school.The first time we asked what DD is doing to make the other girls not like her.The answer came back very resoundingly that it isn't DD it is the other girls who are so pushy !The Brownie leader , told me she had never had such a group of little madams in the 30 years she had been running brownies.
Recently we have approached the HT who made all the right noises but did nothing.
DD speaks very very quietly at school and now anywhere out of the house.
DD is now becoming a lot more upset by the situation.We went into school again last week and the HT suggested that he thought that the 2 boys in her yr group were being bullied too.(DD actually is friendly with these boys but they have very different interests)HT said he would move the classroom round so DD could be sitting with the older girls and some nice boys.But this hasn't happened.In fact yesterday the teacher let 2 of the nasty girls pick teams for games and DD was picked last.So they are obviously taking no notice of our complaint at all
I can't see anything ever changing.The 'ringleader' is the chair of governors only child and the only non-white child in the school.When we went to
I am so worried about what it is doing to my little girls self esteem and confidence.I really want to move her but I am worried about going from the frying pan into the fire as most of the schools round here are of a similar size.the nearest bigger school is about 8 miles away and would mean we have to move DD2 who is very happy and popular where she is.One of us would have to give up work to HE and we really couldn't afford this .
This type of emotional bullying is so difficult to prove but I feel probably the most damaging.
I wonder whether I should write a letter to the chair of governors to outline my complaint and make her realise how her little princess has affected my DD

[LilySmalls]

I have just read this thread. I too hope that your daughter has regained her confidence and things have worked out for the best.

[Mytholmroyd]

Spiderpig - just found the thread again. I hope it has worked out and your daughter is happy - have you found a new school?

[spiderpig8]

Can I update you ?
Things took a turn for the worse and there was an incident of physical violence by the ringleader one day.We sent a letter to the head who had insisted we report every inscident.The following day he called us all in and said the perpetrator had perhaps punched DD in the stomach accidentally as she had denied it.Poor DDs face just looked so betrayed and it was as if at that time the HT had crossed the line .
DD was very white and felt sick when we got home.At that moment we decided that she wouldn't go there again.We wrote a letter saying we were deregistering her with immediate effect.She seems much calmer and more confident at home already.
The school are hushing up the fact that she has left and trying to talk me into sending her back everytime I go with DD2.
I just feel as though I want to cry all the time and I don't know why,I should be feeling happy.

[spiderpig8]

Thankyou everyone.Well it seems that this time (with DH involved rather than just me)
He reported to us today.Apparently he had a word with the girls concerned while DD was at a music lesson.He has also lined up a couple of the older girls to befriend DD so she has had someone to do stuff with at playtime.In class they have been doing a lot of work generally on bullying.|So this week has been nice for DD .Please god let be the start of things getting better!If things don't though we have decided to pull her out
Thankyou so much everyone for your advice and concernXXX

[twentyoneagain]

Thinking about you and your DD spiderpig8, I do hope things are starting to improve and that DD has a better day again today.

[CarGirl]

How did it go today?

[PlanetEarth]

My daughter has had similar problems, despite being in an average sized school. Are there any boys at the school? My daughter often plays with boys as they aren't so cliquey, and like to run around like she does (rather than stand in groups discussing X-Factor). She's also become more friendly with a nice girl in the year below (despite the girls in her year trying to ridicule her for spending time with someone younger).

Out of school activities and out of school friends are all very well, but they still have to get through lunchtimes and breaks, and it's not very nice to be always the one left over when the kids have to pick partners.

[shockers]

What schools do the nice girls from Brownies go to?

I'm a TA and was in yr 3 last year. I have moved up with the same class this year. We had 3 new pupils from other schools who had experienced problems socialising. They have all settled extremely well and made friends.

I think it would be better to move your DD now than wait until her confidence is really shattered and she's going up to high school.

Hope you manage to sort something out.

[mathanxiety]

Move her. Not only will the little madams not be persuaded by any efforts of yours to be civil to your DD, you don't want these girls as 'friends' of your DD. In order to be friends, they would need personality transplants. I recommend the books "Queen Bees and Wannabees" and also "Queen Bee Moms and Kingpin Dads" by Rosalind Wiseman, for some great insights into what's going on at this school.

I wouldn't bother writing to the mother of the ringleader. You will only be scoffed at, and you run the risk of having her D hear of your letter.

The fact that a teacher allows individual children to pick teams speaks volumes about the level of insensitivity to these issues that is present in the school. Any school that has even the smallest clue about the dynamic of one-upmanship that can go on among children would not allow this.

[Openbook]

I suppose there's no answer to that. Parents must keep trying though and call schools to account over Every Child Matters. Mental health is an aspect of that and has to be addressed.

[Hullygully]

Openbook - I would love to think that, but unfortunately in my (wide) experience it is simply not possible as there are too many children and not enough time. But I think they think they do.

[Openbook]

Hullygully - you must realise that most primary teachers take the social dynamics of their classes very seriously and do consider the mental health and happiness of the children in their care. I don't have expeience of a small school which is exacerbating the problem here and think making a new start might be the best answerr but it is a hard one.

[spiderpig8]

Thankyou so much for all your helpful replies.SE13 I wish you were a teacher at our school.
I had more or less made up my mind to take DD out of school and have DH cut down on his work a bit and together with mum and dad home ed her for a while til her confidence increased before looking for another school for her.
But today she came out looking very happy having apparently played with the one and only y6 girl.I don't know if the school engineered this but it wasm so nice to see her looking happy.Although I'm aware of 'one swallow does not a summer make'

[nickschick]

ahh, 21again the thread moves so fast and my situation never seems to get much better i felt a bit of a drain to you all .

Thankyou for remebering me .

[castlesintheair]

Spiderpig8, I had a similar sounding experience at (one of) my primary schools. It was 2 years of hell. I 'coped' by doing every single extra-curricular activity I could which often involved missing playtime. As someone suggested, I used to start 'crazes' but they simply became 'crazes' from which I was excluded.

Sadly, for me, it only stopped when I went to boarding school aged 9. I do hope it can be different for your DD. Maybe there is a teacher like SE13 who you can approach?

[twentyoneagain]

I rarely post on this thread but for some reason clicked on it today. SE13Mummy if only there were more teachers like you school would be a much happier place for so many children. Wow I am impressed , maybe spiderpig8 should print this off and show it to her DD's teachers.

Nickschick - hi we were wondering about you yesterday.

[SE13Mummy]

Hullygully - I'm not! I spent 6 years working in a tricky school full of challenging children and jam-packed with teachers who would have done (and often did) the same sort of thing.

[Hullygully]

SE13Mummy - you are the only teacher in the world who would do all that. Good show.

[nickschick]

Actually Romanarama has a point .....can you not pal up with some mums and try and build friendships for your dd or are the mums as bad as the daughters?

[Romanarama]

If somebody talked to me about this kind of situation, as a parent, I would do my best to help, and to get my own child to help the lonely one feel included. Do you think that others wouldn't? I would be very sympathetic, esp as you never know when you'll be in the same position.

[nickschick]

So many lovely children feeling sad at school it makes me just to think about it.

[maggotts]

Am just about to move DD2 (also Year 4) for same reason albeit not as bad as your situation seems to be. She is at a small school so not many other girls to choose from. She is not being bullied and no one is being explicity horrid and some days are absolutely fine BUT there so many days when she is isolated at playtimes and just very lonely.

In our case, the problem is that a group of mothers all know each other very well and socialise all the time out of school so that their DDs mix in school. There isn't room for an "outsider" and the school can't (won't?)really do much about this.

So DD2 is about to move at Easter to a bigger school and it will involve a long journey each way but will be worth it if she is happy and has friends.

[Mytholmroyd]

Oh your poor daughter! My DD3 is also in year 4 at a small village school and used to come home with heart-rending stories of sitting on the "lonely bench" - apparently it was invented so anyone feeling lonely could sit there and the other children should notice and go and ask them to join in their games. She said she sat there every playtime crying (could have been a slight exaggeration) and just got laughed at. It was heart-rending.

I spoke to the lunchtime supervisors and asked them to keep an eye on her. Then suddenly she made a best friend (a girl with glasses and a squint god bless her who probably was also getting similar treatment - but they make each other very happy!) and she is a different child now.

But I has started the process to move her to another school. And if it is altering your DDs behaviour at home to the degree you say I would have her out pronto - could it be any worse? I was bullied at junior school and I have never forgotten it.

[SE13Mummy]

Is the Head also the teacher of your DD's class? If not I think it might be helpful to ask for a meeting with the Head, the class teacher and the senior mealtime supervisor so all bases are covered and a single approach can be used to manage the behaviour of the girls who are causing so much upset.

I'm trying to think what I would do as a teacher if a parent came and told me that this had been happening (although I'd like to think that I'd notice!) but as I've never taught in a small school I'm not sure....

I think I'd rearrange the class according to children's requests - I actually do this anyway; let each child write down the name of 3 people they work well with and a different 3 they are friends with and I say I'll do my best to put them with one person on their list. I give them an option to come and speak to/e-mail/leave a note for me if there is someone they would feel unhappy about being placed next to. This is quite a telling exercise in itself in terms of class dynamics. I'd then position the children uber-carefully so that the probable ring-leader was in a position that meant she could not make eye-contact with her cronies (at the very front or very back) whilst positioning the 'got at' children (your DD and the two boys) in positions that would give them lots of options for people to talk to, good eye contact positions with their peers but also with me. I'd also devise a lining up order for whenever the children go to assembly/line up in the playground/into the dinner hall etc. so key characters were split up and others supported by friends.

At the same time I'd set up 'worry books' (I've done this and implemented it across the whole school) which are notebooks that every single child writes in every single day after lunch and the teacher reads every single one ASAP (silent reading time for the children). If everyone writes/draws in it daily, even if what they write is "I have no worries" then it is not possible for others to work out if they're being 'told on'. It's an effective way for children to inform teachers of possible bullying behaviour and means it can be dealt with immediately. It also helps that the upset is written down as it forms a record and means any patterns can be identified but also gives an opportunity for the teacher to reply. I have often written in Y4+ worry books, "would you like me to speak to X about this?" or "let me know if you'd like me to help you sort this out". There are potential child protection issues with it so I always make it clear that although a teacher will never show one child's worry book to another child sometimes we may need another adult to see it to help sort out a problem and I always ask a child before I show their book to another member of staff (I usually get them to take it to the other member of staff so they are the one doing the sharing - it can help children feel like they're being taken seriously too which is no bad thing).

Once I'd completely and utterly manipulated their in-class movements I'd work on lunchtimes/playtimes which would probably involve something along the lines of sending 2 children per day to 'help in the office' (I have actually done this - they love shredding paper, delivering registers, sorting school newsletters etc.) and I would be very careful to separate the ringleader and your daughter as often as I could so that the ringleader couldn't see who her other friends were playing with whilst she was occupied.

Meanwhile, I'd be speaking with the mealtime supervisors and asking them how things such as the bars were monitored and perhaps find out if a more concrete system could be put in place to ensure turns were taken fairly.

I would probably also suggest to the parent of the child that they consider moving to a larger school but would warn that girls aged 8+ often have friendship issues and that there's no guarantee that moving school would be the answer. I'm not sure how helpful my reply is but I thought I'd explain what I'd do if your DD were in my class - I detest exclusive behaviour of any sort in school though and would do everything I could to turn it around and would very definitely make sure I didn't let the ringleader choose teams but would come up with a fair and transparent system so she didn't have a chance to leave your DD out in class. I'd probably end up being complained about by the ringleader!

[slotnicki]

So sorry to hear about your dd. My dd is also in Y4 and is also rather isolated amongst the girls - but has one really good friend. She has been subjected to some really horrible behaviour from some of the other girls this year (but hadn't experienced anything like it before).

Until the end of last term, I ignored it and felt that it was typical playground behaviour. I changed my mind, when my dd was taken to the Head's office with one of the girls involved in the bullying and my dd was told to apologise - but there was no attempt to explain what she'd done. It was one of those silly discussions where everyone had to apologise. One of the aspects of the bullying was that the girls would make false accusations against my dd either individually or as a group.

At that point I wrote to the head about the issue and had a meeting. When the bullying started again this term, I e mailed the Head again with a detailed account of my concerns.

The person who has been most helpful to me is the school learning mentor - I am wondering whether there is one in your dd's school? I found that she had the best understanding of the problem. She has assured my dd that she can go to her at anytime and makes a point of asking me how things are going.

I don't think that the problem has been resolved for my dd. but I do feel reassured that there is someone who has some understanding of what's going on.

I think that if it wasn't for my dd having a really good friend, I would probably think about changing schools. I, too, have been told that Y4 is a particularly bad year for this types of behaviour - but to be honest, in a small school, there are limited opportunities to find other friendships. I think that if I was in your position, I would change schools.