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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

Low Milk Supply in Afternoon and Evening ...Tiktok ???!!!!

129 replies

lovinit · 25/07/2005 07:49

Would it make sense for me to use a formula feed at 5-6pm and then express for the 10pm feed once milk supply has built up ?

Also, DD2 is 4wks and seems to only take 10-15 mins for day feeds and night feeds. Is this OK ? She never sucks for longer unless it is to soothe in the eraly morning. I guess that I am hopign Tiktok is here to answer this !

OP posts:
Original poster
lovinit · 01/08/2005 03:05

Tiktok, can you tell me why it that when I express, the breasts seem to be stimulated more and the breasts are so much fuller for the next feed ??? I thought that babies were more efficient at stimulating ? It took me only 5-10 mins to express 4 oz which i thought was pretty good ...

also, when I BF lying down during the night, I find that DD2 seems to choke a bit as she does not swallow well ... Is this normal ?

OP posts:
throckenholt · 01/08/2005 07:53

lovinit - do you mean you are expressing instead of or as well as breastfeeding at any one time ?

If it is in addition to breastfeeding then the fullness in your breasts will be a response to a general increase in demand (and they will gradually get used to that demand and start to feel less full again).

Generally babies are much better at stimulating supply and getting milk out. I think rarely the baby has a physical problem which means it doesn't suck very well - but usually you would see signs of that as "failure to thrive".

tiktok · 01/08/2005 09:34

Throckenholt is right. Expressing in addition to feeding is an extra stimulation to the milk supply. Therefore, with smaller gaps between removal of milk, milk is made more rapidly. This will lead to a temporary feeling of being 'over-full'.

While it's true that babies will normally stimulate the breastmilk production more efficiently than a pump, this is not always the case. A baby who is not feeding well will not be as good as the pump.

Why are you bothering to express, lovinit???

With regard to the choking when lying down, could just mean you need to adjust the position you have her in to help her. Alternatively, maybe she has stopped sucking but is still latched on and has a mouthful of milk which trickles down....and she splutters because she is caught unawares. Are you sure it's choking and not just spluttering?

Original poster
lovinit · 02/08/2005 06:53

I expressed as I was going out and needed to take a bottle of EBM. So the expressing was not additional to a feed .

With regards to the choking, I think that you are right and it is a reservoir of milk she has not swallowed. It does seem like a huge mouthful though !

she is also spitting up more and more than usual ... sign of reflux ?

OP posts:
mandyc66 · 02/08/2005 07:28

not an expert but I dont think reflux comes on..I think they are born with it!
Posting with care!!

tiktok · 02/08/2005 09:54

I've said elsewhere I think reflux is over-diagnosed. I don't think anyone knows if babies are born with it or not, Mandy. In any case, spitting up, even a lot, even an increasing amount, is not a sign of anything wrong. It's just a sign of being a baby

The reason you felt the extra fullness, lovinit, was probably because you missed a feed because of feeding your baby EBM when you were out. You therefore get a temporary feeling of fullness because you have gone a little extra time between feeds. This is not a recipe for making more milk though.After a short time, going extra time between feeds means less milk.

mandyc66 · 02/08/2005 16:56

thought reflux was a valve that should be 'nonreturn' but in some babies not developed properly. therefore born with it?
Just being sick or possiting isnt a sign of reflux I agree.

hoolahoop · 06/08/2005 00:55

hi everyone - i'm new to this list, struggling with low supply in the afternoon and evening, so this conversation is very helpful

tiktok and others - i'm hoping you might have some advice for me. my dd is 7 months, i have been working for 3.5 months and pumping while at work. just the past couple of weeks my supply seems to be dropping -- i'm not pumping as much at work and it really takes a dip in the afternoon and evening, when dd wants to nurse. (might be b/c AF has come back recently... also i think dd's appetite is increasing) i've been trying to coax her into chain nursing to get what she needs but at this point if it is a low day then she just won't nurse - she pushes away in frustration and cries, is generally miserable and hungry... and it is bedtime.... so i have been giving her bottles of EBM out of desperation (EBM from my stash). Is there any other way around this? And if I have to give bottles of EBM, does this mean I should pump even tho the problem is I don't have much milk - so I would be essentially dry pumping for a long time to try to simulate the chain nursing she would have done had she been willing?.... i'm just worried that by supplementing i'm compromising my supply but i don't see a way around it.

also, to boost my supply i've been taking fenugreek and just also got some blessed thistle, plus i've boosted my pumping sessions at work to every 2 h or less - but i seem to get less milk doing that than i did pumping every 2.5 or 3h....

i am also going to try to start pumping after every time she feeds.

i'm quite worried about getting to a point of no return w/the low supply...

any ideas you have for me would be GREATLY appreciated, thanks so much!

robinia · 08/08/2005 15:34

bump

larlylou · 08/08/2005 20:44

sorry I can't be any help but I thought I'd bump for you on the off chance that Tiktok is around as she will surely be able to help you

robinia · 09/08/2005 11:24

Sorry no one's got back to you on this - think tiktok must not be around at the moment as she usually responds very quickly.

Is it just when you get back from work that she's fractious when feeding? Lots of babies are fractious at that time anyway - maybe she's just tired or not actually hungry enough? I can't imagine that there's nothing there - although perhaps you're stressed (understandably) and the letdown is slower than she'd like? Maybe try to get the milk flow going before you think about latching her on?

It might be an idea to start a new thread on this as people may have stopped watching this one?

hercules · 09/08/2005 18:14

bump or mears as you're around!

mumtosomeone · 09/08/2005 19:05

Is your baby on solids?
Is she too hungry to feed? maybe give her some rice then breast feed when not so desperate?

hunkermunker · 10/08/2005 11:06

Bump again

PeachyClair · 10/08/2005 11:15

Hiya.

I'm not as clued up as TikTok, but I did the Unicef baby friendly cousre on breastfeeding- can I help in her absence?

I remember being told that hormone levels can cause a drop in milk supply in the afternoon and evening, which in turn is why a lot of babies feed frequently in this period (mine all did).

Keep pumping in the evenings to boost your supply, give EBM if it settles you both more (stress won't help your supply) and have you considered if she is hungry for food? She is at that weaning age, maybe she needs a bedtime rusk? BM is a great and fabulous food, but when you want a sarnie will a drink do? I doubt it! She may also be having a growth spurt, in which case she will grizle for a while whilst she tries to boost your supply- it does take a few days.

You're doing ever so well, keep going and pumping an dgood luck to you. If TikTok not back soon, the ABM has a great website where you can e-mail someone who has studied BF more recently than I for help.

throckenholt · 10/08/2005 11:39

how much fenugreek are you taking ?

I think if she is not feeding then you have to pump to stimulate supply - otherwise your body gets the message that you don't need more milk.

With expressing don't do it more than 3 hourly if you are getting less by doing it more often.

The rule is generally pump for 2-3 mins after the milk stops flowing, but no more than say 20 minutes at any one session. Massage your breasts before pumping. And for me at least - try and distract yourself from what you are doing - I always got more that way.

As for getting her to fed directly - maybe you could express a bit before you feed her so that letdown may come more quickly when she starts.

Hopefully this is just a blip coinciding with your periods returning.

hercules · 10/08/2005 16:29

bump for mears

hercules · 10/08/2005 16:29

hulahoop needs adsvice!b

mears · 10/08/2005 16:41

Hulahoop - there are lots of reasons why 7 month babies refuse to nurse and it may not be anything to do with poor supply. She may sense that you are getting stressed about it as well. At night, have you tried lying down in bed with her to feed? Just cuddling her in may encourage her to feed more.

Does she have breastfeeds during the day when you are not at work? Do you breastfeed her before you go?
When I expressed at work I got variable amounts but I knew my milk was well established, as is yours. It will come back from this dip with regular breastfeeding or expressing. Baby is the best stimulus of all. Offer feeds more frequently when you are at home. Continue to express when you are not there for feeds or if she refuses a feed. If she has fed well the I would not express straight afterwards - I personally never got anything expressing after feeds. I always did it inbetween, even if it was just a couple of ounces at a time. It soon mounts up.
As you habe been breastfeeding for 7 months I personally do not think supplements taken to boost supply will make that much difference but it may help psychologically. Up to you really. The main thing is to remember is that you will produce more in response to more stimulation. HTH.

yummymummy73 · 06/01/2008 19:07

hi, i'm new to this but i really need some advice. My 21 week old baby is only feeding for 5 minutes each breast whereas before he fed for at least 10 minutes each side. I have had a bad cold recently and took sinus tablets. I have read that the tablets can dry up my milk and I want to try to increase it again. He hasn't put on any weight in 2 weeks. Help

Tutter · 06/01/2008 19:11

i'm, sure an expertb will be along soon, but just to say that at 21 weeks it is noit unusual for a baby not to gain weight for a week or two. it was about that time that ds1 didn't gain any weioght over 3 weeks. he then had a bit of a growth spurt. try no to fret about week-by-week gains/losses (unless you have been advised to watch weight - eg if baby v low weight)

also - babies often get faster abnd faster at emptying the breats. ds2 is down to 2-3 mins per breast but stil will go the same length of time between feeds

VictorianSqualor · 06/01/2008 19:18

Firstly, it is unlikely your milk would dry up just in the evenings, so I would imagine you still have milk.

If your baby is feeding less it may just be becoming better at feeding, or you could have just come out of a growth spurt so in comparison it feels like it is feeding less.

Also, your milk is made on a supply and demand basis, the more needed, the more gets made, so if you're worried about supply just keep offering, every little suckle helps.

Lastly, you may want to post your own thread on this (just above it says add new thread in this topic) just ebcause a lot of peopel might try reading from the very beginning of the thread not realising you have only asked for help recently.

Try not to worry

yummymummy73 · 06/01/2008 19:21

thanks, i am just getting so stressed about it because we have been cruising along nicely and now this. I'm panicking that I don't have enough milk. It's getting harder and harder to express milk and even after a feed he will then take a 5 ounce bottle of ebm.

NorthernLurker · 06/01/2008 19:25

Don't panic - my dd1 used to take 45 mins to feed - until about 15 weeks when she suddenly started taking 15 - and refusing to latch on again. Baby becomes more efficent, your boobs get into their stride - things change. Re the weight gain - I'm assuming your baby seems well and lively otherwise?

Tutter · 06/01/2008 19:27

does he seem satisfied by a feed?

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