Difficult Dr's appointment - told to cut down BF and add Formula

[Stefka]

I went to the Dr because I have been feeling really run down since I had my baby. He's seven months now and I still BF him as well as give him his solids. At the moment he has about four feeds a day and then he also feeds a couple of times in the night though those I think are just comfort go back to sleep type feeds.

The Dr told me that he should only be on three feeds a day and that because I am so run down I ought to add in some formula. She said I am not eating enough and therefore he won't be getting what he needs for me anyway plus he will be sucking me dry of nutrients that I need. She wasn't nasty about it at all but said she was very worried about my health.

I don't want to give him formula. I am not sure about cutting down his feeds either. I have to go back and see her again. She gave me a prescription for some kind of multivitamin. I feel kind of confused and upset and not sure what to do.

I don't think there's anything wrong with four feeds a day at seven months. If you are run down, then try to look after yourself. There is a great iron-rich liquid that I drank when I was breastfeeding. Begins with an F. Makes you ravenous and you hoover up everything in sight. Keep really good cereals in the house at all times. Slow release carbs and all that. And get some sleep. Make someone take the baby out for a while while you get an afternoon nap.
Good luck.

the doctor knows jack all about bfing.

can you get an afternoon nap in? maybe when baby is napping too? or co-sleep part of hte night if you are not already doing this?

you sound more overtired than anything else. all that rubbish about 'quality of milk' shows how little your doc knows about bfing. and all the rest is bullshit too.

If you don't want to give him formula, then don't. You should, though, take the supplements and ensure you are eating as healthily and as much as you can/should. IME your baby will eventually cut down on g=feeds himself, so the best you can do for both of you is eat healthily, look after yourself and take those vitamins.

nkf - was it FLORADIX? I bought this, was recommended to me by the health visitor when pg, as it is easier for your body to absorb than iron tablets.

how rotten for you sorry you are feeling so run down.

i take a multi-vit and that has helped loads. also have cut down to 1 feed in the night by upping the solids and having battle against giving a comfort feed.

is there anybody who could give bottle of ebm for you once or twice a week during the night so that you can get a full nights sleep that always helps me.

hope somebody who is more knowledgeable than me comes along soon.

I think the other part of this that is making it really has is that I have a history of food issues and it is hard for me to think about eating more than I currently am. She wanted to weigh me but then forgot. Partly I am glad about this because I hate being weighed but I sort of wish she had done it too because it would make me more accountable.

I know I won't give him formula - I had too hard a time to establish bfeeding to do that. I don't know about trying to cut him down - I didn't think he was feeding that much to be honest. I do think the night ones are just tiny feeds for comfort and he has one in the morning, mid morning, mid afternoon and then before bed.

Not sure what she has prescribed actually - can't read the writing!!

at 7 months you baby doesn't need to feed during the night at all, can you sort that bit out as if oyu are tired it can affect milk production, am sad the gp wasn't more supportive of you bf , but sometimes it can be in the best interests of the mother to reduce it or stop, i am not saying htis is necessarily true in your case but you do sound tired and rundown and maybe she was worried about your mental and physical health, and in the end bf for 7 months is afbulous achievement so reducing now would n't be the end of hte world

Oh dear. I'm afraid your doctor has shown her ignorance of how breastfeeding works. It's a useful test, in fact: if someone intimates that the mother's diet makes a difference to the baby getting 'what he needs', then they reveal they know very little It also means that you can probably discount what they say about breastfeeding.

In your case, of course you need to pay attention to your health and well-being. But this does not have to be done at the expense of something that's good for your baby, and which you are happy to continue doing (that is, bf).

You can present your doc with the facts about mum's diet and breastfeeding if you like (plenty on the internet - try www.kellymom.com ) and say you appreciate her concern. Or you can take the prescription for the multivits and see if it helps, and if it doesn't, you can go back and say you think you need more help.

There is no number of breastfeeds a baby 'ought' to have, BTW. There may be ways you can cope with the night waking better (co-sleeping, for instance) and other ways to give you a bit of pep - that will depend on what else you do in your day and what you can change.

I could rock him to sleep - I just feed him because it's the fastest way to get him back off to sleep. Plus he is heavy!

mummydoc - are you a doctor, too?

Tiredness does not affect milk production.

Babies don't usually need to feed at night at 7 months to grow properly, but they may need to feed for comfort and to return to sleep, or for thirst (on a warm night). What do you suggest happens with a baby who needs to feed for these reasons? Sleep training at 7 mths????

Thanks - I really think the issue is about me not the breast feeding if that makes sense. I need to figure out how to sort my own health out but that doesn't need to include cutting out breast feeding. I have to go and see her again so I am going to try and put that across.

yes am a doctor and i have to disagree with people who say itrdness doesn't affect production, chronic long term tirdness can affect production, and it is not necessarily wrong to suggest alternatives to breast feeding your baby back to sleep, it is not right for every mother and i didn't suggest the op must do it, if i was her gp i owuld be concerned , this is a mum who presented sounding run down, tired , with food issues .... and a 7 months who is still wholly dependent on her, so she cannot get support from partner or family , has not had an undisturbed nights sleep for 7 months and the suggestions were not to stop bf but maybe to indroduce other forms of feeding . leaving the situation could runthe risk of this lady developing PND / depression .

Stefka, can you get some support? Do you have any friends/relatives who could help out?

This might help a lot more in the long term than cutting out bf - which might not help with the tiredness, or might even make it worse. Struggling with an exhausted baby who only wants to feed is very tiring.

From my own (limited) experience I would say that I found trying to force my DS to take a bottle, give up feeds or sleep through without a bf was actually far more tiring than going with the flow. I felt like I was swimming against the current and spending hours rocking/patting at night was certainly not any more relaxing than a quick nip and back to sleep for both of us.

But do try to eat right - I think this is not about BF but about you taking care of yourself and your body - which is a separate issue.

Stefka, you seem to be hinting that you are worried that you may have a recurrence of an eating disorder? Is that right? I suspect the whole breastfeeding thing is a total red herring and you feel run down because you are not looking after YOURSELF. You need to sleep and eat well, not for your baby, but for you. Do you have a history of eating disorders or depression?

Would you consider build up type drinks for yourself rather than formula for the baby? I would imagine that if you can easily get the nutrition into yourself that both you and your baby need then you would start to feel better quite quickly.

I have never been diagnosed with an eating disorder but I would say food has been an on going issue for me. I have also had depression in the past.

It's hard because I know I can sort of get away with the way I behave around food as it's not that serious but at the same time I realise there are health implications. Plus it drives my husband nuts.

I was lucky when I went to my GP at around 10m with DD that she had a better understanding of a) breastfeeding and b) my wish to continue breastfeeding. I went in there thinking it was 'draining' me, I was so run down and picking up all sorts of colds and thought should maybe think about finishing (but not really wanting to). She tried to encourage me to rest and eat well etc (for myself) but said that looking after a baby is hard work anyway and that breastfeeding itself isn't 'to blame'.
You have done tremendously well to bf till now and from what you say you want to continue so I hope it all goes well for you as breastfeeding an older baby/toddler is very rewarding and actually a nice way to wind down and relax (though not in the middle of the night, I admit!)
All the advice on looking after yourself sounds good to me. I do hope you feel better soon. It's rotten feeling so run down and trying to do the best for your LO.

Sadly I think that breastfeeding is being pushed as the issue, by a health professional nonetheless, when it isn't the case.
Many times now I have seen people thinking Bfing is a problem when really it isn't, it's just an easier 'problem' to deal with.
Much nicer to imagine everything will be fixed if you stop Bfing than to admit it's a much deeper problem.
Thankfully you seem to acknowledge that the issue here is your eating habits, whether you have an eating disorder or just an unhealthy relationship with food, it needs to be sorted, so go back to the doctors and tell her wha you know.

Also, aside from the issue, well done for continuing so far, is your SiL still managing too?

Yes, that's it - Floradix.

You do - well remembered! She's not sadly. I think the combination of her being so young plus all the crap advice she got and no support meant it was all too much for her. I felt really sad for them because she never really had a good chance in a way.

I think I need to ask for some help with the food thing. I am embarrassed too because it seems a bit daft. Also I went to the Dr about a few years back and he just weighed me and said I was fine. It was kind of humiliating.

I know I have no intention of giving up breast feeding though so I need to take better care of myself. I think if I can focus on doing it for my boy it will help.

mummydoc - you are mistaken, sorry. While I agree with you that 'chronic long term tiredness' has an impact on health (of course it does) it does not have an impact on breastmilk production - you can share references with me, please, if you know different. I have a few that show that tiredness (and diet) do not have an impact on breastmilk production...a very tired mother is going to find it harder to cope with a baby, of course, but her breastmilk production will be unaffected.

I do agree 100 per cent the OP needs help and care - but I did ask how she could get her baby to sleep at night when he wakes without breastfeeding, and you have talked vaguely of 'alternatives' and I'd be interested in knowing what they are! An older baby/toddler can certainly be 'trained' to get back to sleep in other ways, but these methods are not normally recommended for babies of this young age - perhaps you have something else in mind?

Her doctor sounds caring (as do you)but the care should be coupled with good understanding.

Stefka, I have never rocked a baby to sleep. I now have a 3yo who was always fed to sleep. As she got older, she needed it less and less and now her dad can put her to sleep w/out milk, but i still give her a quick feed in bed, unlatch her and she rolls over and goes off on her own.

just before her 3rd birthday, she demanded to sleep in her own room and refuses to come into our bed at night/or in the morning when i would like a lie in.

even without your eating issues, i think you would be really tired now anyway if you are getting up during the night ot feed, say once or twice and even if you are awake for only say, 10 mins.

the thing with co-sleeping which makes this not happen, even if you are feeding several times a night, is that you and your baby enter light and deep sleep cycles at the same time so he won't be waking you up out of one of your deep sleep cycles to ask for food. Plus, i never seemed to be awake for more than half a minute to feed dd.

I worked full time since dd was 4 mo old and she did not wean onto solids properly till well over 10 months so I know about frequent night feeds. In fact, i was very run down around when seh was 8 months old and my gp suggested weaning her from the breast so i could get more sleep. I didn't follow his advice, I started to cosleep full time instead and I haven't looked back since.

It was a good thing i didn't wean her either as it turned out she is allergic to egg and cow's milk protein, which we didn't know back then.

Um, Kikis, that was not my experience of co-sleepign at all! My babies would go into light sleep when I was desperate to get into deep sleep - and kick me vigorously, turn horizontal in the bed leaving me clinging precariously to the edge with them sticking their toes up my nose I was a wreck!
Also one of my kids simply could not latch on while lying down as well and liked to feed for hours in teh night. While co-sleeping works beautifully for many people, I';m sure, I promise youit's not a guaranteed one-size-fits all solution.

Stefka, I dropped loads of weight when pg and bfing in the first months and year (I am 5 foot and went to under a size 8). I must have looked like I was ill - plus I was well low on iron which was affecting my mood and my own perception of the situation.

I do not have an eating issue - but believe me in those early months you need to take care of yourself and eat healthily and well.

With dd2 I lost loads of weight again, but this time I took the supplements and ate regularly (little and often) and have not had the same mood or tiredness issues - despite having 2 kids to run after!

Why not tell the gp you're going to take the supplements, eat healthily, and see how it goes?