Prem baby not taking to BFing

[rascal1979]

My baby was born 9 weeks early and has been having EBM since about day 3. However despite trying to breast feed for over 3 weeks we don't seem to be progressing. She has latched on a few times and sucked 3-5 times but that's it. I try her to the breast upto 3 times a day when she is about to/being tube fed. She will hold my nipple inher mouth and suck /lick the milk or just let it flow into her mouth and then swallow bits but not actually breastfeeding properly.

I'm starting to get really despondant as other mums inthe unit seem to be doing far better at actually feeding.

She is now 36 wks gestation (5 weeks old) and weighs 3lb 2oz. The nurses just keep saying that she is small and she will do it eventually but I'm starting to worry that she won't.

Anyone else had a similar situation with a happy ending! or does it look like she won't be able to feed?

You just reminded me, we had a nurse one time who didn't want us to do things as normal, instead of PTB before a feed, she wanted it after! So rather than her being hungry and rooting, she was sleepy and cross with me for waking her! I told her it would happen and was really upset she made me go through that, but I got there just after a feed and they wouldn't wait till the next!

Hi Rascal,

Yippee to being in a cot - I found ds just seemed more normal and accessible and I didn't need to ask anyone to be able to do things for him or even pick him up! And he seemed more like a real baby too - the tiny noises he made, I could finally hear them properly instead of being muted by the incubator plastic. Sorry, rambling, I'm just so pleased things are moving on for you.

Hope today is good bf-ing day.

Stick with it you will get there in the end

Hi All

Not had the best day - She'd had a cup feed of 20ml at 7am. The 11am feed went pretty well she fed from the breast on and off for 30 min or so. 3pm fast asleep and 7pm she was wide awake but it was as if she had forgotten what she was supposed to do

I know that there are going to be 'off' days but I'm never quite prepared for them and they always get me down. Not helped that 2 babies went home today - 14th and 15th ones to go since we have been on the unit (just under 5 weeks).

hi rascal, sorry it hasn't gone as well as you hoped today. Although, there are still lots of good stuff, one good feed and a some awake time. Even though she was awake, she was probably still knackered from the earlier feed. AND, I just re-read this thread, and its only 8 days since she took her very first sucks, so you're making fab progress. I hope you don't think I'm making light of you feeling a bit down about it all, I just wanted to tell you how well you're doing in the grand scheme of things and I PROMISE things will be so much better very soon. Also, i think it should be banned that those who arrive after you in scbu, should not be allowed to leave before you . I hated seeing that, I can really empathise. Ugh! Take care, hope the pumping goes well overnight and good luck tomorrow.

thanks for your suport Annabannana it really helps.

I know that some babies will go home before us but each time it happens it really upsets me. One woman that I have got on really well with leaves early next week and although I am SOOOOO happy for her to be going home after 8 long weeks I am dreading it

You won't believe the amount of times I cried "Just give her a bottle and let me take her home!"! They always said no though, lol.

It is hard, but you know I feel we have the advantage over term mums, cause you know how much help most of them get? Very little! Women who went to the same hospital as me complain they didn't get much help to establish breastfeeding and it makes me realise how fortunate I was that I was given that time and space to get it right before we went home and to establish something of a routine.

I promise it will all be over soon and it won't be long before you look back and say "it feels like a different lifetime ago". I can't even relate to that time as being Tink now, it all happened so fast when I looked back on it and so much has happened since.

That's the worst part about being in SCBU, progress never seems to go in a straight line, it always goes up and down! And it's horrible to see babies who arrive after yours and leave before, we had a lot of that and it was horribly painful every time. But she really is doing brilliantly well and it will be your turn before you know it.

Actually just reread your post - 20ml from a cup and 30 mins on and off the breast 8 days after her first latching on?! Not a bad day at all!! You should be very proud of both of you . Hope today is going well, keep us posted.

been following this thread and think you're doing a great job. fwiw dd2 who was a 27 weeker didn't really 'get' bf until the week before we came home (at 37 weeks) - she was still being topped up with ebm by tube up until just a few days before we came home. in all honesty i would say it wasn't until we went to full demand breastfeeding (and that wasn't until we came home)that she became a pro!she was a shocking cup feeder as well -her notes would say 'cup given - v v v messy!!! it comes in the end - frustrating as it may be, and i'm not sure that by changing to bottles we would have come home significantly earlier (she was a shocking desatter).

Hi All

Having an 'off day' today - no particular reason just one of those days. Weekends tend to be worse for some reason - think it's cos I'm having to work around my DH and he's also finding it all overwhelming and stressful to and we keep clashing

HOWEVER!

Yesterday she did really well

7am - 41ml by cup
11am, 3pm and 7pm good attempts at breast feeding
11pm - 30 ml by cup! (Apparently she was crying for her feed!)

So 5 out of 6 feeds were part cup or breast!

Then she slept through her 3am, 7am and 11am feed. Had a small attempt at 3pm and 7pm.

I'm going to have a chat with the Dr tomorrow as I;ve ben told if she is awake don't miss the opportunity and try a breast feed. However others have done one feed tube to one feed breast to allow their baby to rest between feeds.

I only try her to the breast if she is wide awake and rooting...

After an attempt I keep her near my breast whilst I tube feed and she sometimes latches on again a bit.

Just spoke to the unit and she is settled and being weighed at 3am - they will then try her with a cup feed.

wow what a fab day yesterday. Bless her, completely knackered today from the effort. Well done Rascal, its getting better and better. And the cup thing is fab too. Fingers crossed for the weigh in at 3, and some mega feeding tomorrow.

Rascal,

Think how far you both have come. The progress is ENORMOUS and it has be such a heart moving experience...

You are doing great...

I can only imagine how you must feel.. just wanting her to be at your breast a rooting all day long. But this will come.

Have you discussed Kangaroo Care with the CONSULTANT? Not just any old Dr the CONSULTANT? as although she may not be rooting or even awake.. she will still be there at your breast having skin to skin contact.. and that would be SSSOOOOOO good for you both. Expecially you. Please speak to them about this again.

Hope you had a better day today.

BIG HUGS

Hi All

Thanks for all your continuing support. Today has been a better day.

She was weighed last night and has put on 97g so is now 3lb 14.5oz! This is 17g more than she normal puts on so she must be getting plently of milk from her breastfeeds.

Today she had an attempt at BF at 11am and again at 7pm. The 7pm feed was a decent attempt - although because my milk flow is so good it was literally pouring into her mouth so no real need for her to suck just fills her mouth then she swallows. I'm a little concerned as this is not helping her to suck efficiently BUT she did do several sucks throughout the 40 min feed! and she is getting plently of milk from the 'feed'.

I'm going to have a chat with one of the nurses tomorrow about maybe expressing a little before hand maybe so not as 'gushing' which shuold make her work more!....maybe? Any thoughts on this?

Re Kangaroo care. It's really difficult to know when to do this as she falls asleep whenever we do this so feeding during Kangaroo care is a big no no and she needs her rest so inbetween feeds it's difficult to strip her off for this. We do do it but not for a couple of weeks..and both enjoy it. Just seems really difficult to fit it in around feeds.

Could you lie down on a bed with her even with her completely dressed and you with breasts out?? and every feeding time change her nappy or strip her to waken her??

Just to allow her to be at your breasts more often, this would let her rest and allow you to rest but also have her close.
Just an idea...

Regarding the expressing first.. i would definately do this as this will make it far easier for her to latch without having the force of your initial letdown to fight against..

Hi Rascal, I agree with determination about expressing a little. With kangaroo care, and I'm no expert but from what I've read, it's fine and good for her to be asleep on you and for it to be non-mealtimes. Again think determination's idea is good about feeding lying down and you could try a few different things. I think I'd undress her and wrap in blanket for feed and then transfer on to you skin to skin straight after feed. I think I saw that even a small time doing this is worth doing. I don't think that then waking her to redress her would cause any problems about the rest she needs but then I'm not a dr so hopefully the consultant could reassure. Good luck! You're doing FAB!

Rascal, I expressed before a feed with ds because he really struggled with my let-down (sounds like your dd is coping much better!). I bought a manual Avent pump so I could express a few mls right next to his cot and then be ready to feed.

Re the kangaroo care - I know what you mean about finding the right time. I often cuddled ds whilst he was asleep with my shirt open, so that at least his face was bare against me. If she is in a sleepsuit maybe you could just open the poppers down the front to hold her bare tummy against you?

Sounds like it is all going really well, and what a brilliant weight gain!

Hi All

Had a really down day yesterday - even had the nurse in tears!

However had a long chat with a couple of nurses and they have suggested that I try her with demand feeding cos she can latch on and suck but seems to full to actually NEED to feed.

Need to get the goahead off her consultant this morning but shuold be fine with it - just the issue with her weight as they have said that she will more than likley loose a little weight or not put as much on when we start demand feeding. However they feel its a calculated 'risk' to get her feeding better..also a step closer to going home.

SOOOO I'm packing a bag and will (so long as the consulatnt agrees) be staying over at the hospital to have a go.

Wish me luck.

I'll be nipping home once she gets going so will keep youposted x

Sorry you had a bad day Rascal. I know this is easy to say and very difficult to do but try not to let the days where there is less progress get you down too much - it's really common for the progress to go up and down for babies in SCBU. Ds was tranferred back to HDU at one stage and I was so upset, but the nurses said they'd seen so many babies bounce between SCBU and HDU before they went home. If she didn't do so well yesterday, it definitely doesn't mean she's on a downwards slope! Probably just needing a bit of a rest. But I very much know the feeling that you will be there forever and never going home!

Anyway, sounds like you have a good plan to discuss with the consultant, and it's great that you're able to stay in SCBU with her. Do hope it all goes well and is a bit of a turning point.

Don't forget how wonderfully you've both done to get this stage . And no matter how long it takes, you will be taking your gorgeous baby girl home to enjoy to the full!

ask if they have a tub at the hospital for you to do cobathing in. it is also called rebirthing. if you search this forum with that term and my username you should find a youtube link with a video.

WoooHoooo This is fantastic news. It is sssoooo good that they are allowing you to stay over with her to feed on demand. Well Done.

You really do deserve a medal for being so patient and determined. Well Done

Hi All

Well I started demand feeding yesterday but she wasn't really taking to feeding any better. They said to persevere so I did - was up every 10 min from 10pm to 4am (bar an hours respite at 1-2am). She would cry cos she was hungry but was too tired and exhausted to latch on....they said to keep trying as she would take a while to get there. She did seem to improve as the night went on and slept from 4.15am - 7.30am - tho suspect that this was from exhaustion!

By this morning I was feeling a little deflated and was unsure what to do. This was compounded when she was weighed and had lost 20g and had not had a wet nappy for over 6hrs.

The nurse looking after her was watching me trying to get her to latch on with difficulty and suggested that she ring the BF co-ordinator. As she left the room little missy latched on and fed - did over 100 consecutive good sucks (and swallows), paused then more, paused then more! She has never done more than 15-20 consecutive sucks nor has she stayed latched on and restarted sucking so this was a massive improvement. The nurse was a bit 'oh yeah that's good' and as she had fallen asleep suggested that I put her back in her cot. I did and she woke up and cried - still hungry. The nurse suggested giving her 30ml top up via ng tube as she was tired and needed to eat, in particular in view of her loosing weight.

I agreed and she has now been tube fed every 2hrs since 12pm cos she has been asleep. The BF co-ordinator has suggested 2hrly feeds to get her into a more realistic pattern of feeding and by spliting the total volume into two feeds won't over stretch her tummy.... She has been flat out all day.

I was going to stay over tonight but think that as we are both knackered may be better to wait til tomorrow after a good nights sleep and start again. We have got our discharge meeting tomorrow to dicuss plans for ways forward to get her home.

"fed - did over 100 consecutive good sucks (and swallows), paused then more, paused then more!" This is great.

She is still really really small and obviously will get tired easily.

But there is MASSIVE improvement there. You are both doing great.

It wont be long until she is home with you now.

Thanks Determination. I know that she is getting better at BFing and that she is doing well it's just that some days it really gets me down even tho she does something amazing like taking over 100 sucks rather than usual 10-15.

Just wish someone could tell me how long it will be til she can come home really need to start being a real mummy and a proper family.

Rascal this is brilliant! 100 sucks and then some! I know it is very hard waiting to be able to go home. ds was in until 2 weeks past his due date and I found those last 2 weeks very hard going, as we had been expecting him to come home around his due date. But in those last few days he really took off. Just take it day by day and before you know it she will amazing you every day and will soon be ready to come home.

I only have my own experiences to go on here, but it sounds like your bf councillor and the nurses are changing your bf plan quite often. The nurses in my SCBU told me it was rare to get a prem baby successfully bfing when they were on 2hrly ng feeds, because they weren't hungry enough to try very hard. They suggested putting to the breast every other feed during the day until feeding was really well established, and would feed by ng tube all night unless he was rooting. His tube only came out a few days before we left. It's great if your dd is able to bf at every feed, but she is still very small and obviously getting very tired. Might be worth discussing with several doctors/nurses to see what they think, or even give LLL a ring.

Hope today is going well - make sure you are looking after yourself as well as dd! It's a well known fact that vast quantities of chocolate are essential for bm production...