Very worried about 8 week of EBF daughter.

[Mamatoriley]

Hi all, I have an 8 week old daughter who is EBF. We had some latch issues in the beginning with soreness but used nipple shields for a few days then straight back to without with seemingly no issues. However, she lost 4.8% of her birthweight and was slowish to regain it (day 17).

Fast forward to a couple of weeks ago and she is constantly fussing at the boob and doesn't seem to be taking a full feed. She also has lots of griping pains even if we wind her lots during and after feeds. She also squirms and arches her back during feeds and cannot sleep on her back so tends to sleep on my chest which I know is not good. Shes had her 6 week check at 7 weeks and had dropped from just above the 25th percentile to just above the 9th. She was 7lb 10oz born and was only 9lb 1oz at week 7.

Lately she cannot sleep in the day, constant crying (dont know if its pain or overtiredness related). We tried everything yesterday 2x walks, a drive, rocking, the sling (she slept for 1 hour in it). By 5:30 she was so tired so I took her up to where her bed is in our room. It took until 10:30 to get her to sleep which involved constant crying (sounded in pain) belly was gurgling, you could hear it it was so loud. I finally got her to sleep and as soon as she was asleep her bottom end exploded with lots of farts and a greenish tinted poo. She is disinterested in feeding and only having short feeds. She went 8 hours overnight with no feeds (2 hours of disinterest and eventually 6 hours sleep). She had a feed at 4am and went back to sleep and a short one this morning about half 6 and has gone back to sleep on me for a bit.

I have been in contact with the infant feeding team for possible posterior tongue tie. But I am away on holiday tomorrow for my sons birthday which is today. I've taken her to the doctors who said to speak to infant feeding team. We ended up ringing 111 last night who said she needed to be seen and booked an apt for 12:30 by which time she had settled and I didn't want to disturb her.

Its been weeks of not sleeping and constant crying, I dont know how to fix it for her.

She also had her jabs on Thursday including the rotavirus and gastroenteritis one.

Does this sound like purely a feeding issue e.g. tongue tie or foremilk/hindmilk imbalance? Or something medical such as a cows milk allergy/intolerance or reflux? Or is this just normal breastfed baby behaviour and will it pass?

I'm beside myself, im barely eating as dont have time as I have spent the last few weeks walking or rocking her and I am worried.

She was such a happy baby, ate, slept and pooped pretty much in that order and never cried. Where has my happy little girl gone?

Would she be happier on formula? Am I doing something wrong? Any advice would be greatly appreciated

Some of it will be related to her jabs on Thursday. My DC was out of sorts for a while after hers.

When you say short feeds, how long is she actively feeding for? Your supply will have settled a bit and baby will have become more efficient so feeds do become a bit shorter. Have you tried doing breast compressions/block feeding?

It's so hard when your baby is upset and you can't help!! Hope today is a better day

You should have taken her for the appointment, can you make another ?
I’m wondering about allergies or reflux.
Are you eating well yourself to feed her, and drinking a glass of water every time you feed her ?

I have a similar situation with my 8 week old DS. We had latch issues at the start, slow to regain birth weight, began feeding ok but had only put on 2 lbs at 7 week check (over 9 lbs at birth - now just over 11).

Now fussing at the breast again. Lots of wind and hic ups. Lots of gripping pain, bringing up feeds.

I have requested a tongue tie review as my DD was similar (but worse). Sadly with my dd by the time we got her posterior tie cut I developed mastitis and an MRSA infection in one of my breasts so she went straight to formula - this didn't solve everything though and she turned out to have a cow's milk intolerance as well. DD also slept in her cot with one end wedged up so she was sleeping at a slight angle - this really helped.

I have cut down the amount of dairy I'm eating incase ds is the same and he has his tongue tie review this Tuesday so hopefully they will do something.

I feel for you as it is awful but it sounds like getting a tongue tie review is the next step. It might be worth keeping a food diary to see if your baby is worse after you have eaten certain foods. X x

Sounds like reflux to me. I could have written everything you have (apart from the slow weight gain as dd was a comfort feeder. She was sill fussy but was attached to the breast almost constantly so did get plenty over time)

@DinosaurDiana I know I should've taken her and im kicking myself now. She was just so tired and had finally calmed down and drifted off. A clinician was supposed to call us instead but never did so could probably call again and book an appt.

I was eating really well until about a week ago when this suddenly got worse. She won't settle for my partner she just screams at him, only I will do so I'm barely getting time to pee, let alone eat.

It sounds like CMPA (cows milk protein allergy) i would agree with pp about keeping a good diary. Good.luck though have been in the position and its so so hard and draining x

@Quail15 I'm sorry you've experienced similar it so difficult isn't it. We have her moses basket propped at an angle already and she will sleep in there occasionally.

I did think about cows milk intolerance or reflux but the Drs just said 'its the hot weather, sounds normal and you are just worrying'.

OP There’s an LLL help sheet on the unhappy breastfed baby that is a checklist of things to try. It’s worth a look, it’s a short read and very practical:
www.laleche.org.uk/unhappy-baby/

Can I just say her weight loss after birth and time regaining it are completely normal, up to 10% weight loss is normal and 3 weeks is the average time for bf babies to regain their birth weight so that's all fine.

Has she been seen by an osteopath at all?

My heart goes out to you OP

How often are you offering the boob to your LO?

Have you also tried expressing and then after a boob feed having a top-up paced fed bottle feed?

Can you feed her to sleep or does that not work? Have you tried using her wake windows to try and get the timing right for a sleep?

I'd say reflux too.

This can be down to what you are eating passing through into breast milk. I was lucky to have a good friends specialising in this area & she was a godsend with her advice.

Layered veg, so lettuce, onions leeks etc cause colic & reflux, cutting these out, stopped colic.

Azo dyes & benzoate preservatives caused eczema like rashes & reflux. I was eating a clean diet bar my monthly cravings for cheap jelly sweets. Those sweets caused DD problems. DD is still sensitive to these at 18

Sometimes it can be diary, lactose or soy

Basically look at your own diet, what you eat can make a hell of a difference to your EBF baby

Reflux and green poos are.often symptoms of allergies. Dairy allergy is common in newborns, at least 5% have some sensitivity. You could try cutting dairy from your own diet for 2 weeks. My DD2 was like this, things started around 4 weeks and got worse until I cut all dairy. Also try gentle abdominal massage (draw a rainbow left to right across tummy, bicycle legs) at regular points to help with intestinal travel and gas.

For us it was dairy and soy - absolutely hideous and took far longer than this to establish that this was the issue. I would certainly consider an exclusion diet, I wish I’d sorted it sooner.

@SpringBluebellWoods thank you I will have a look at that now.

@Garman I haven't tried an osteopath yet but it has been recommended by breast feedinf support group as she is a forceps baby. I have found one in my area that does appointments on Sundays so will give them a ring today. Thank you.

@RaeRaeMama im demand feeding and also offer boob for comfort too, so pretty much whenever she needs it, lots of opportunities for her to eat some she takes others she refusing and I dont push it after that. I have a stock of breastmilk in the freezer and have also tried expressing fresh milk for her but its a bit hit and miss, she has only taken 2 bottles in about 4 weeks and refused the rest.

Feeding to sleep always used to work and it does still sometimes but not often which I find upsetting because I used to love having her fall asleep milk drunk knowing she was fed and happy.

I dont think I have a supply issue either because there is plenty of milk and if she pulls off during letdown it flows out and sometimes flows out randomly when I'm cuddling her! Oh I just don't know

My ebf son was like this for weeks including the green poo. But he didn’t have an allergy, it was just a stage he went through. Very fussy, loads of wind. Their tummies don’t settle until six months I find.
The only thing from your post that worries me is her weight gain, I would definitely try to see somebody from infant feeding about that. Keep going with the breastfeeding and offer often. You also really need to be eating lots yourself. Take care

Ps I tied myself in all the knots you are doing, including going down the route of reflux treatments that didn’t work. It honestly was just a stage.
But you need somebody from infant feeding to help you, all of us on the internet have our own experiences and random diagnoses!

Sounds like dairy allergy to me even cutting dairy for 72 hrs might see an immediate improvement... and if it's not you know you have tried. ( you do however need to look at everything you eat, ( whey whey powder lactose it's in everything including medications) a half hearted attempt will tell you nothing.

Just to add to the voices saying investigate cows milk allergy. My son's turned up at around six weeks, and I cut dairy at 8 weeks. He didn't improve until I cut out soya as well, and the not sleeping, fussy feeding, explosive green poo just brings back all the memories. I spent hours pacing up and down our hallway trying to get him to sleep, often in tears myself as nothing I was doing was working.

Get a GP appt, I'd also say continue with osteopath (our sessions definitely made a difference), and try cutting dairy. You need to do it for six weeks though - not 3 days or 2 weeks as PPs have said above. Lactose in medication is also fine, as medical grade lactose is so refined. Look up the "Breastfeeding with CMPA" Facebook group and the website https://dilanandme.com - run by the same person and with a wealth of information.

Good luck and hang in there - it will get better!

I have no experience with CMPA but plenty with the rarely acknowledged situation of lactose overload. Try the following for 24 hours:
Feed only every 3 hours. If you feel like you havea lot of milk, pump or hand strip off some formula first. Settle her by any other means than bf in between those 3 hourly feeds. When she does then feed, encourage her to empty one breast before going to the other. If she is fermenting lactose in her gut, causing pain and gas and explosive green poops, and you are topping her up with more sugary foremilk every time she seems to want comfort, you get into a horrible vicious circle. You should see a difference in a day or two and if you don't, then start investigating reflux and CMPA and all the other stuff that requires a longer trial time. Good luck.

Wtf, pump or hand strip off some milk first. No idea how formula got in that sentence!

@MamatoRnC

Hmmm 🤔 do you think you maybe you have a fast let down?

This could explain the green poop as well

If it was a fast let down, you could hand express a little off before feeding her and see if this helps

I think that if it did turn out to be an allergy as some have suggested then it would most likely be a dairy allergy (this is the common culprit apparently) and in which case switching to formula would make it worse.

Another suggestion, you could ask that some blood be taken and tested to see if baby has raised markers? This would rule out whether this was being caused by an infection. A couple of the signs of illness are fussiness, difficulty settling, difficulty feeding and diarrhoea. I assume she hasn't had a temperature?

Hi all, just wanted to update, had a better day yesterday as she slept and fed pretty much all day. Nighttime was a bit different she kept waking with bellyache and trumping but slept on and off from 9:30pm-8am. She the did a huge runny yellow/brown watery poop this morning.

I saw a doctor yesterday and told him Cali's symptoms but didn't mentioned anything about what I thought it may be. He immediately said to cut dairy out of my diet for 2 weeks so we went and stocked up on dairy free alternatives so will see how that goes.

He said he wasn't convinced its an allergy though but worth a try and that she definitely needs reweighing which is booked for the 29th w HV. I am also in contact with the infant feeding team and have contacted a cranial osteopath.

Thank you for all of your kind words and wonderful advice, couldn't be more grateful. Will update this thread once we've gotten to the bottom of it for anyone else experiencing similar xx

Thanks for the update, OP. If it is over-supply, then there’s an LLL leaflet on that, which is helpful. It can cause wind and upset, but you definitely do want her weighed before you start doing anything that might reduce supply.

If you do get to that point, it’s worth looking at block feeding (only from one breast for x hours, where x gets gradually higher until your supply and her needs are more aligned). It worked well for me with an over-supply problem.

@SpringBluebellWoods I'm starting to suspect oversupply and lactose overload as she is very uncomfortable and has had 3x loose stools this morning and now a green string one I thought by breastfeeding I was giving her the best start but feels as though I'm not anymore. She also hasn't slept all day

Well, oversupply is a relatively easy fix. I’m less sure about lactose overload, none of the research I’ve read seems to agree about different lactose content in fore and hind milk, or even agree on whether there is a consistent difference.

Dairy allergy is also a possibility, but do be wary of making it so tricky to find what to eat that you eat less. That’s not a good position to be in when breastfeeding. A non dairy diet takes a bit of getting used to, and with an unsettled baby is not the ideal time, unless you have someone else to do all the cooking and meal planning.