Need encouragement....10 weeks of sleep deprivation building up and formula looks soooo tempting

[dal21]

Hi everyone

DS is 10 weeks old and have been exclusive breastfeeding. Always knew I wanted to bfeed and was very lucky in having fab midwives who helped me get the hang of it all.

I really want to exclusive bfeed for 6 months also - but am surrounded by friends whose LO's are now starting to sleep 10.30-7 (formula fed) and I have hit a brick wall.

All I keep thinking is

• I can have my body back and exercise without worrying about impact on milk supply
• can drink alcohol (pretty much still abstaining as am concerned about alcohol and bfeeding)
• can leave DS with family and not worry about expressing etc
• most importantly - he is more likely to start sleeping longer stretches.

Bad mummy

I know there are many downsides to formula, that there are no guarantees that formula feeding will guarantee any longer sleeping patterns etc etc. DH has been doing dreamfeed already for 5 weeks with EBM...if there are any other tips that could help, let me know.

I just need encouragement to get through the next month or so (from mid dec onwards, lots of family will be on hand again to help). I really want to persevere with bfeeding and with a much more positive mindset towards it than i have now.

Your ds won't sleep through the night on just breastmilk - possibly not ever. I don't want to put doubts in your mind but the first thing you have to do is accept that the broken nights are probably there to stay if you're bf-ing exclusively! My aunt who was fervently anti formula used baby rice to fill up her babies' tummies from week five - not in the books, but it worked for her - an idea maybe? She made it with breastmilk and swore by it - never gave any of her three babies one bottle of formula! (I'm not that impressive, tho', more of which later!)

You're not a bad mum though for wanting your life back! .

Some of my friends found that bfeeding got a lot easier after 12 weeks - it takes a lot longer for routines to really get going than the books like to make out, and often it takes 'til at least 12 weeks for mum and babe to fall into a nice pattern. That's when a lot of mums actually start enjoying their babies.

The expressing sounds like a good idea. Do you have a babe that's growing very fast? As they get hungry very easily (in my experience). My dd was born 4.7 kilos and continued to gain weight at a rapid weight - she's now 15 months and the size of a 2 year old - so I had nightmares with her glued to the breast the whole time, and we supplemented with formula from 10 weeks. I have to say that it made things so much more complicated - all the sterilising, not knowing how much bmilk she's taken. Then again it was nice that she slept through the night from four months (mixed-fed). It's a lot easier for them to quench their hunger on the formula stuff so it will probably interfere with your milk supply unless you are seriously organised about which feeds are formula only. I made the mistake of trying more formula when my daughter seemed upset - I just didn't know if she was hungry or not and I found it all very stressful - she got very chubby for a bit! But don't worry about that aspect of formula because it all falls off when they start walking.

Um - not sure what else to say. If you really want to persevere with bfeeding the try to give yourself a big pat on the back - mums who don't take to it completely are total legends in my mind for managing to get to 4/6 months. It is such a big deal for most parents and of course everyone tries to make out it's a synch, and some mums make it look so easy, it used to drive me mad! Also you may not have a huge milk supply, I never did, and had to express for 40 minutes to get two ounces.

Apparently the Omega (I think it is) or NHS electric pumps are meant to be good, I'm thinking of hiring a really good one for when number two comes along.

Good luck!

Hi BBM, my milk supply is good - can get 5fl. oz in 10-15 mins using the medela swing.
This is why i feel guilty - DS feeds every 3 hours during the day and is into a good routine already, midwives helped to establish the 2 then 3 hour routine.

I think the problem is knowing that there is something out there that can give a break from the night waking. I am kind of accepting that the longest I am going to make DS go is 4/5 hours at night....and I am battling to continue with the option of not seeing dh as I go to bed at 8pm in order to be well rested for the night feeds.

Oh my god, do NOT start using baby rice at 10 weeks! Weaning guidelines are milk until 6 months, that's 26 weeks, NOT 10. Talk to Aitch about the problems she has had from being weaning very early.

dal21, there is no guarantee that by going onto formula your baby will sleep through, the experiences of your friends are not necessarily the rule. I have friends whose FFed children didn't sleep through for ages, and my exclusively BFed DS slept through at 12 weeks. If you want to switch to formula for the other reasons, that is your choice (and you are NOT a bad mummy), but I would say that you shouldn't do it just for the sleep.

Hopefully tiktok will be along soon, she can give you advice about exercise etc. With regard to alcohol, I found the best thing was to have a glass of wine just after you have finished a feed. That way, you give the maximum time for the alcohol to pass out of your body before the next feed.

Good luck, and if you want to persevere there is lots and lots of support on here - well, there is support whatever you decide! I'm sure you'll make the best decision for you and your DS .

btw - thanks for the honesty and the words of encouragement. much appreciated.

By the way, 10 weeks is pretty bloody early to sleep through. Have a look at the sleep boards, you'll see lots of mums with similar problems, maybe you could talk to some of them? Sometimes it just helps to know you are not alone!

Hiya Dal21, I too exclusively b-fed until DD was 6 months. I too felt envious of formula fed babies sleeping through but as my HV told me, there are a lot of formula fed babies that DONT sleep through too. So I wouldnt give up on that basis alone! Sleep deprivation is horrible but the way I got around it was to build up my supply by expressing and that way I could leave DP or she could stay with Granny who'd give DD her night feed. (and morning feed too in some cases) This is also a way that you could have a glass of wine or two but tbh, I couldn't face any alcohol until DD was about 18 months because it made me ridiculously tired.

As for the exercize part, I am a runner so found it very hard too, i was very jealous everytime i passed someone running. But because of a tough birth, I wasnt allowed to do any rigorous exercise until 5 months. So I had kind of resigned myself to this. I did start doing lots of walking though and some gentle areobic DVD's.

Good luck with it all, it is so worth the 6 months IMO, especially since you are nearly half way through it! Before you know it, DS will be waltzing around with his own bottle and you may even miss that awful but always cuddly night time feed.

Your friends babies are the exceptions. All the babies I have looked after ff/bf have not slept through at 10 weeks. Switching to ff is absolutely not a guarentee. Definitely do not give baby rice to your baby at such a young age!!! Somebody told one of my mums to give their baby mashed rusk in the bottle to fill him up, I was furious. If you have other issues to switch to formula then thats your decision but it sounds like the breastfeeding is going well so enjoy, you are doing fantastic.

Hi Dal21

Afaik, it's only really, really, really ultra strenuous exercise you need to avoid, something about lactic acid I think. And by ultra strenuous I mean you can't go on twenty four mile top speed marathons and the like.

You can have a drink... you can have a couple of glasses of wine in the evening. If you drink just after you've fed ds that's even better as by the time you do the next feed, the majority of alcohol will have left your blood stream.

One thing that helped me, and I started at about six months (would have started earlier if I'd known how well it would work), was giving ds his own bed time and (something approaching a) bedtime routine. I would feed him, switch feeding (one side 'til sleepy, other side 'til sleepy, back to first side 'til sleepy, other side 'til sleepy and so on until he just wasn't sucking at all) to make sure he was really full... then I would read him a story, then cuddle him to sleep.

The first few nights he did cry as he was used to being fed to sleep. But he was crying while I was holding him, so I didn't feel I was neglecting him.

After a few nights he was then used to being cuddled to sleep. And I'm not sure why, but he now sleeps a lot longer in the evenings.

This gives me and dh valuable time together but also, if I am really tired, gives me the option of an early night as I get a couple of hours' extra sleep.

I also have ds in the bed with me after his first waking, so sleep through most of his feeds, well, barely wake anyway.

(Obviously be careful with this if you are having a couple of glasses of wine and it's making you drowsy, and don't do it if you smoke.)

HTH. And congrats on getting this far... it doesn't necessarily get easier but it does get much more fun (especially when they can "ask" for it by tapping your chest, or when they play with your nose whilst feeding... hilarious!)

yup - am runner also, and really miss it. am going for walks but isnt the same.
i am holding onto the fact that i have surely gone through the hardest weeks and it has to start getting easier (trying not to think about 3 month growth spurt)

is there a buggyfit class near you? Great workout outside and you get to meet some other mums.

yogi - thanks - dont worry, wont give ds solids, not even considering that as an option.

Mossy - DS is quite good, bedtime routine of feed, little play then bath then top up feed is going great. He is in bed for 7.30/8 every night. Sleeps til dreamfeed which DH gives at 10. So I have a window of 5-6 hours where I can have a drink. The problem is that by 8 I am utterly exhausted and bed with earplugs is far more tempting than a glass of vino with DH.
LOVE the example you have given me of what they do when they are older!

I think I need to relax a little more, not listen to the mums whose LO's are sleeping through at 10-12 weeks. May also look at placing DS in nursery for an afternoon/ day a week when he is a little older so I get a little me/ powernap time. May equip me to handle it all a little better and give me one night a week where I do have the energy to have supper with DH.

YUP - did pushy mums yesterday, great to get out in the fresh air, will be doing that once a week at least.

It does improve, really it does. My DH was away until DS was about 10 weeks and I was an utter zombie, and I thought it would never get better. And then all of a sudden they decide to sleep through - my god it's miraculous! - you get a bit more sleep yourself and everything is so different. You'll get there

just to let you know that some babies sleep through then later on won't. my poor friend was in shock when her 10 month old starting waking at night again.

I was in shock when my 10 month old (formula fed) STARTED sleeping through the night!

DD is 4 months excl bf and sleeps 9-7. Not trying to be smug or anything (it may all change in the blink of an eye) but just to give you a positive example that bf babies can sleep through on just BM. don't know what the trick is, just some babies do and some don't. not necessarily anything you are/aren't doing.

Try not to worry about what everyone else is doing. they may not be telling the truth either because new mums often feel that a sleeping baby is an indicator of how good a mum they are. it's not. but sleep deprivation is crap I know.

keep at it. you are doing the most wonderful thing, it's a sacrifice in some ways but if it's what you want to do keep telling yourself it's such a short time out of your life. good luck

Formula won't necessarily help your baby sleep through the night. I bf my dd exclusively and she slept through at 9 weeks, my son didn't until 4 months and was also bf. It depends on the child and, to some extent, the sleep patterns you introduce (I suspect my son took longer because I always used to jump up the moment he woke because I was so frightened that he would wake up dd). Also, if you do stop bf'ing and introduce formula, and your baby doesn't start sleeping longer it will be far more of a faff to be waking up, preparing a bottle, warming it and so on. At least with bf'ing, it was just a case of stumbling across to the cot and getting on with it half asleep.

You really have gone through the hardest bit - pretty soon, if not already, the night feeds will get fewer and at more predictable times. If you have a good milk supply then you can always express one bottle a day so that you are able to go for a really long run if you can find someone to take care of your ds.

If you want to switch to formula then you shouldn't feel you are a bad mother - you have given him an incredible start in life - but don't imagine that formula is the solution to everything. I know plenty of people whose children didn't sleep with formula and I always found, when I packed in bf'ing at about six months, the sterilizing, having to remember to take bottles and powder out with me, unblocking the teat a huge pita.

Good luck

dal21, my b/f dd started sleeping through at about 9 weeks (11-6). i know you have said that DH has started doing dream feed, but have you considered cluster feeding?

give breastfeed at 6pm, then again at 8pm the give dream feed about 11 ish, in theory baby then accumulates calories and will sleep for longer. it worked for my dd.

i am sure i dont need to tell you that the reason some ff babies sleep through is because formula is very rich and therefore takes longer to digest. it is the eqivalent of us having a really big meal and then feeling drowsy afterwards.

so other things that i tried are:
a drop of lavendar oil on your bra so that LO inhales while feeding, and also drinking camomile tea before last feed as this is then supposed to transfer to baby when feeding.

i know sleep deprivation is a bitch, but try and relax and enjoy your LO, these days will soon be over and this will be a distant memory, then you will have time to worry about your figure, social life etc.

Don't give up! FF no guarantee of sleeping thru. And there are so many great reasons to bf

You will lose baby weight quicker
Your baby less likely to get allergies
Recent research shows less likely to be obese and have a higher IQ!

Get some more help so that you can have daily naps and runs
This will make you feel better-- not giving up bf

NB Breastmilk is richer than formula in the sense it has got all the right things in it that your baby needs-- it really is the perfect food

thanks everyone - just woken up from powernap and feel more positive.

glittersparkle - yup doing the cluster feeding, thank you for suggesting. and you are right - in the big scheme of things, this isnt an age. it just feels it at in the middle of the night! and i know you have all been there.

I guess i just have to see what DS has in store for me and take it from there. I will persevere the next month at which point additional help over the following month should get me through and then weaning is not too much further away.

I just like my sleep too much. lazybones!

dal - I read your post and thought you were doing extremely well! Do try not to compare to other mums and their babies. We are all soooo different and I think efforts to make us all do the same thing - well, that way trouble lies...

Your LO sleeps "better" than my 16 weeker already, in the sense of having a longer uninterrupted stretch. My new mum pals look at me pityingly when they hear how often my dd feeds. The thing is, because I co-sleep, I barely wake at all, and by morning I feel comletely human. I know now that if she woke less, but I had to get up / sit up to feed her I'd be more knackered than now. I never intended to co-sleep, but did it once out of desperation and exhaustion, then read up on safety (and there is evidence that, with precautions it can reduce the risk of SIDS), and have never looked back. It's one of the best "mistakes" I've made so far!

You said you really want to breastfeed for 6 months - you'd be gutted if you tried formula and it didn't even achieve what you wanted it to. You have done incredibly well and have got the feeding bit sussed. You even are able to express far more successfully than many mums.

Please be really proud of what you are achieving. And read some of the sleep threads to see if there might be other ways to get better sleep.

I don't think formula sounds like the answer you're looking for.

I haven't fully read all the other replies but the suggestion that your baby may never sleep through when breast fed is nonsense.
I have 2 boys both exclusively breastfed, DS1 started sleeping 12 till 6 at 6 weeks and the second managed that at 14 weeks, by 5 months they were both sleeping 12 hours.
I am not trying to put salt into your wounds I can remember how it felt to be sleep deprived.. it is a form of torture!
What I would say is that you have to go with what you feel it right for you and your family. If you want to continue to breastfeed exclusively - you can have a couple of glasses of wine but just not get sozzled. You can do some exercise jsut not push it really hard, and in a few weeks time you will find you can go out for the evening after your little one has had the evening feeds and gone to bed - babe won't need you for a few hours.
12 weeks is a real milestone, you have had a few months to get to know your little one and they have started to understand what this whole baby thing is all about..
Chin up hon, do what you feel is right for you.

hey everyone - thanks for the responses.

littlecarrot - think you hit the nail on the head. if i tried mixed feeding and it didnt work, i would be gutted. and if it did, i would always wonder whether if he would have done it on bfeeding.

fio - you are definitely mad . at least my friends who tell me about long sleeps immediately fess up to ff'ing. and they tell me to hang in there! only problem is that i know they don't lie!

thank you all for your support and encouragement.