Urgent help please

[mandler]

All the helplines are busy and I need advice quick. Just had health visitor round who looked at screaming colicky baby (who has been on and off boob all day) and told me to top him up wth formula. She then goes off and speaks to her colleagues who look at his weight gain (he is three weeks and on 25th centile) and decide that I am not producing enough and definitely need to top up.
I am so upset, crying my eyes out as I have been made to feel like I am starving my baby. The same health visitors have watch me feed and checked his weight all along and have never had a problem. What the hell do I do? I feel so guilty as he lies here screaming that I have a bottle of formula here and ready to give him.
Help!!

oh mandler I really feel for you. I can´t believe how quickly time has gone since I was were you are (ds is now 6mo). My ds was/ is a really really sucky baby and I was forever having to ignore people telling me he ´looked hungry´. Cos newborns have such a range of facial expressions

Just try to be strong and have faith in your ability. Your baby is putting on weight, he´s having wet nappies. I´m not vastly experienced but it sounds positive. My ds regained his birth weight really fast and he was at about the 70th percentile or something and then it just tailed right off and he´s been following the 25th percentile very happily since. We had a few weeks where they made us go back weekly to weigh him and were threatening me with supplementing etc and even dh chimed in that ´if he hasn´t gained this week we might need to put him on formula´(thanks hun ). It was really hard but I just knew I knew best on this occasion, I fed and fed and fed him and it all sorted itself out.

Don´t give in to her if it´s not what you want or what you feel is right!

Best advice MN has given me was to learn to feed lying down. It didn´t come naturally to me at all and I had to try and try again but it was a godsend and meant he could take his time, come on or off as he wanted and I could doze, watch tv, read a book (!).. everyone is happy

But listen, I had a couple of really low points where it was all so hard and I did get dh to give him a bottle. I cried about it, I felt awful about it, some people on here said even with only a couple ´the damage was done´ (among other encouraging advice I hasten to add), but whatever, it means that at 6 months he´s still breastfed and if it weren´t for those 2 or 3 bottles he wouldn´t be. Trust your instincts, really, really.

no more advice, but i was wondering if you;d had your baby, congratulations

listen to hunker & haprsi

mandler, something I always ask on these threads, how are you sleeping?? is tiredness a factor in how worried you are?? remember with as little sleep as you are getting it is easy to get over-anxious especially with idiot HV's giving crap advice.

What Maveta said about learning to feed laying down is good advice, especially if sleep is a big part of the problem, it can help co-sleeping which can in turn, help you get some of that much needed energy back.

If you do decide to co-sleep (you may be already and know all the guidelines etc) don't hesitate to ask for advice, it is safe, done properly.

mandler - as a HV myself I have to say that your HV sounds woefully misinformed about breastfeeding. (as are far too many HVs)

As other people here have said - it's your decision and not hers. From reading through this thread your DS sounds healthy and thriving and I cannot understand why your HV would think there is any problem.

The centile charts are not the be all and end all. TBH they are a complete pain because too many HP only look at the chart and NOT at the baby. They then compound this by not talking to the Mum.

Your HVs comment about the calorie content of your breastmilk has left me speechless quite frankly.

Stay with MN - you're more likely to get better BF advice here than from your HV - and you don't have to see a HV or get your DS weighed by her if you don't want to. If you have a set of scales weigh him on those and plot the weight yourself.

Thanks for all the advice and kind words. It is DH's first day back at work today which hasn;t helped my tearfulness, and yes sleeping is an issue - not matter how hard I try I can't get to rest during the day.
Will try harder tomorrow!
DS is fast asleep now so will have a healthy dinner and take him to bed

And thanks lulumama - will tell you my birth story some day!

i hope is was not as bad as you had feared

lulumama 21 @ hotmail. com

or CAT me

am always here

QUOTE Her issue seems to be the calorie content of my milk rather than the quantity...UNQUOTE

Maybe this might help this shows that human breastmilk has more calories than forumla, hence if she wants more calories in your baby...more breastmilk would have more calories than equal amounts of formula
Milk Calories

Here is an interesting article on fat in breastmilk Article

Have nothing much new to add, except still agree with all of the below.

Congratulations on your baby as well.

Should also let you know that my DS was very similar, except that his crying/screaming/hungry signs were there pretty much since he was born. The midwives in hospital were telling me to give him "top-ups", even though they could see that I had colostrum, and then milk. Yes, family members and doctors chimed in as well to say he should be on formula.

Well, he regained his birthweight fine (was on 50th centile), then tailed off a bit (dropped to 9th / 25th centile) and is now steadily on 25th centile. Has been consistently solely breastfed (apart from a couple of times when I was nervous enough to try the formula).

He did have very bad colic, which thankfully lasted only a few weeks, and then reflux, which I assume was another cause of his crying. And he can't tolerate milk proteins so I had to stop eating dairy. I tried many things - some colic remedies, a cranial osteopath, my GP, a gastroenterologist. Luckily, has pretty much sorted itself out now and he is a totally different baby (well, the same one actually, but ykwim)..

One thing I am sure of (and luckily, apart from the early suggetions of fomula, i have had the support of doctors and HVs since then) is that I am absolutely sure I did and am doing the right thing by continuing to solely breastfeed. For one thing, the formula surely would have made my DS worse as they contain cow's milk.

Suffice it to say - all babies are different, and you won't know what exactly is the problem with yours, but it's unlikely to be that you don't have enough milk if he is putting on weight, not drastically dropping centiles, and is producing lots of wet and dirty nappies.

Actually makes me quite angry to read that they are saying this to you.

mandler, you need a proper dialogue with someone so I hope the helplines manage to come up with a good response.

This thread has some very good info on it - main points

• your HV has truly given the game away (of her lack of knowledge) in two ways i) your baby 'looks' hungry (eh?) ii) the calorie content of your milk being an issue. Calorie content of your milk will vary with the amount of milk in your breast - the link to kellymom explains how - and you do not need to worry about it 'cos it sorts itself out!

• if there is any concern about your baby's weight (and I can't see why - seems spot on to me) then all you would need to do to get more nutrition into him would be to feed more often

• undermining you and upsetting you like this is cruel and unkind

Make a note of what happened, and then when you feel better, complain

Hang on in there - you're doing everything right, despite the real prob of the casts and hosp trips.

BF is hard, it took me 6 long hard painful weeks to get going properly, and I am so glad I did, still doing so and wee one is 7 months now. HV talk s**t sometimes. I do agree with others not to give in to formula feeds,your milk will drop off if you do....good luck

Just a quick update - baby has put on 200g in a week. Not bad certainly not anything to panic over (I don't think).
I still want to make sure I am getting the best out of breastfeeding though, I am desperately trying to find someone to come to the house to help me (NOT a HV or midwife) but none of the usual organisations say they offer that service here (hackney in London)

mandler, i just wanted to add my voice of support. My DD went through a huge growth spurt at three weeks and was almost permanently attached for 12 hours. It was draining, but it does settle down and we got through it.

Listen to the advice on here and don't let your HV undermine you . Thanks to MN I'm still going strong at 22 weeks.

Is there a Baby Cafe near you? They are drop in centres and there is a trained BF counsellor on hand, and other mums to share your experience with.

I also recommend a babymoon. Take yourself off to bed with your DS for the day and just let him feed as and when.

Good luck with the feeding and I hope his feet are OK!

another avenue might be sure start as they usually run BF groups too. There's bound to be a centre near you.

Tuesday
10-12noon @ St. Saviour's Priory
18 Queensbridge Road, Hackney E8

you could try this. i just found it on the web and understand it's run by Breastfeeding network. I can't 100% guarantee the info is current though, but hopefully it would be on if it's not too far from you.

I can guarantee 2 really great groups in Highbury/Holloway with an amazing supportive BF Counsellor.

1-3pm FRidays, Highbury Grange Clinic, 1-5 Highbury Grange, N5

or 1.30-3.30pm Mondays, HOlloway Parents Centre, 38 Mayton Street N7

hth

your local surestart centres

Mandler, your baby is clearly thriving. 200g in a week is not what 'hungry' babies do

I hope you get lots of support at a group, and don't forget to tell whoever is running it about your bad experience with the HV.

You can also complain more formally if you want to.

I was told by HV today that the centile chart in my childs health record book, refers to FF babies, that there isn't one for BF!!!!! This may be the same in your area?

katpotat according to tiktok, that's not the case, the charts are based on all babies, feeding method not specified.
My HV told me that the other day though as well

katpotat, charts are not the issue. The chart used all over the UK is based on results from a no. of studies (totalling thousands of babies) whose feeding is not differentiated. Many of them, of course, will have been formula fed.

WHO growth charts are based on a sample of breastfed babies and their results confirm previous studies, that bf babies tend to gain weight rather more quickly than ff babies at first; the slower growth of bf babies does not beging to show on the charts until after the first few months.

HVs routinely get this wrong.

So no surprise there.