Join the campaigns to BF in Public and stop Formula advertising!!!!!!

[Difers]

I got this e-mail today and thought that some of you may be interested in supporting these campaigns

Dear Friend,

We have a short, but important window of opportunity to influence policy and implement two of the Breastfeeding Manifesto?s objectives. As a supporter of The Breastfeeding Manifesto I am writing to ask for your urgent help to influence two important proposed laws which could see the implementation of objective 5 and 7 of the Manifesto- if you act now. Visit www.breastfeedingmanifesto.org.uk and send the emails to the government ministers on the ?How You Can Help? page. It?s quick and easy!

Objective 5-Breastfeeding in public

Objective 5 of the Manifesto is: ?Develop policy and practice to support breastfeeding in public places.? The UK government has released The Single Equality Bill for consultation. This means that everyone including organizations and members of the public can submit their comments on this proposed new law. The Single Equality Bill covers a range of issues but one of its aims is to stop the discrimination against breastfeeding mothers in public. We are delighted that the government is finally addressing this issue. However, we feel that the bill as it currently stand is worrying; it only provides protection for those mothers who are breastfeeding a child up to the age of 12 months. By only protecting Mothers breastfeeding children under the age of 12 months the UK government is sending out a message that it is unacceptable to breastfeed a child over the age of one and therefore suggesting it is acceptable to discriminate against them. The World Health Organization recommends that babies are breastfed for two years or beyond and so we believe that the cap on 12 months could be damaging to children?s health. We need you to send the email at the bottom of this pagewww.breastfeedingmanifesto.org.uk/make_your_voice_heard_1.php to ask the government to change the proposed law to ensure all women are fully protected to feed their babies in public beyond their first birthday.

Objective 7- Advertising of Formula Milk

Objective 7 of the Manifesto is: ?Adopt the World Health Organization International Code of Marketing of Breast Milk Substitutes and subsequent relevant Resolutions.? The Food Standards Agency is currently consulting regulations for the advertising and promotion of formula milk. You may have read the recent press coverage and out cry surrounding OK, the model Jordan and SMA formula milk. It is this kind of promotion which we want to stop. However the proposed regulations would not cover this kind of promotion and so the regulations are inadequate for protecting parents and babies from the influence of formula-milk promotion. Parents need reliable information based on evidence, not commercial pressure from baby milk companies. Non commerical, independent information will benefit all parents including those who bottle feed. However, the proposed regulations are inadequate for the job of protecting parents and babies from the influence of formula promotion. Objective 7 of the Manifesto calls for the implementation of The WHO Code on the Marketing of Breast Milk Substitutes and it provides an excellent model for the law that is required. We need you to send the email at www.breastfeedingmanifesto.org.uk/make_your_voice_heard_2.php asking the Foood Standards Agenncy to go further than they propose to go.

It is only with your help and when we work together that we will be be able to influence the government and have lasting affect on children?s health.

I urge you to please visit this website and send the emails, your voice really matters.

Best Wishes

Alison Baum

Co-Founder and Spokesperson, The Breastfeeding Manifesto Coalition

Whatever anyone thinks about breastfeeding, a woman who is breastfeeding her baby should never be asked to move on/leave. IMO it is as simple as that.

Not all of it Desi. Just the first bits.

I do like you Desi, really. You make me larf. I do think you are intelligent, and you do yourself down with your flippant comments on such serious issues sometimes.

Pannacotta - keep checking this thread - i'll get back to you.

B&f it's not about making people like it, it's about making them realise that it's their problem if they don't.

Changing attitudes is a long-term process and legislation is part of it.

no.

Wasnt implying that bfing mothers should be asked to move on either though

Just saying that bfing generally provokes a strong instinctive reaction in people - either 'I want to do it/I have to do it' or 'I cant do it/dont want to do it' (obviously not including people who literally cant do it for physical reasons) Those instincts cant be dictated to by law.

So a law can protect the right to bf in public but cant change a how a person instinctively feels about it.

Thats all.

No but a law is part of changing attitudes b&f.

Once again I return to this analogy, but 40 years ago many white english people had an "instinctive" recoil to the idea of sitting next to a black person on a bus, or in a restaurant.

Only mad people now have that sort of recoil. "Instinctive" responses are often learned, not instinctive at all.

disagree with the terminology 'its their problem' - it isnt 'a problem' - it is just their instinct doesnt match those of a woman who wishes to breastfeed.

binkle - that is true.

But, the more b/feeding is re-normalised, then the more that people wont see it as something weird.

It's largely folk that havent been exposed to positive b/feeding scenarios that find it peculiar.

The more positive b/feeding scenarios there are.....and so on and so forth.

disagree completely LittlBella.

The urge to breastfeed (or not) is a physical, emotional thing - cant be compared to learned racism.

it isn't an instinct to recoil from breastfeeding. it is social conditioning!

If you want to see instinct, check this out....true instinct

The horror of breastfeeding is most certainly learned, b&f, just as racism is.

It's seen to be instinctive as long as it is normalised.

No-one in a primitive society has an "instinctive" recoil at the idea of bf. No-one. It's learned.

I disagree.

In fact I think it's a little condescending to suggest that a woman's instinctive urge to breastfeed (or not) doesnt exist in her own make-up - it is all down to social conditioning.

What you are saying (and what most pro-bfing mums state is that there was no question for them - the urge to feed their baby was all comsuming) is that those who do have the 'right' instincts are the pro-bfers and those who dont are being social conditioned not to want to.

Doesnt seem a very balanced view. Can you accept that some women's urge NOT to bf may be as instinctively, naturally storng as a woman who does?

I think instinct probably means something different to you as it does to me.

perhaps - I'm just trying to use a word to mean 'what comes naturally' I guess.

Like I say, agree with the law - but the emotional attachment to it cant be enforced into people's psyche imho

But some of the fear of how other people can treat you if you do can be...

I'm not talking about women who don't want to bf their own baby, there are myriad reasons why they might feel that way.

I'm talking about other members of society who are so horrified by the idea of breastfeeding that they are embarrassed/ angry/ disgusted by the sight of it.

That is not instinctive, it is learned. If only a tiny minority of eccentrics felt like that, then yes, I suppose ti might be instinctive. But for a whole society to be embracing that anti-life position, sorry, it's impossible to believe that is instinctive. That society would have died out if it were. (It simply wouldn't have been able to feed its young.)

Anyway I should have been in bed an hour ago.

Good night all.

Then clearly the whole of society hasnt embrace anti-life because here we are.

I dont agree on all points but I respect your opinions, thanks for the debate and night night

Desiderata, the 'drawing the line at a year' proposed limit was nothing to do with compromise. My understanding is that is was because the proposal was to include breastfeeding in existing legislation that protects certain maternity rights which currently extend to a year (such as right to free prescriptions and dental care).

I don't understand the need to not sound political, because some people think it means you have dirty toenails.

The issue is political - it calls for a change in the law. The word we use in English for a political 'wish list' or policy is 'manifesto'.

A group of different organisations coming together on a political issue, rather like a club, is called a 'coalition'.

I can't think of a name which would express it differently, and be as clear.

We have to have 'breastfeeding' there somewhere.

Breastfeeding wish-list club? I don't think so.

BIkle, instincts...well...sadly when the social conditioning works so against human nature, then instincts can not always be trusted, tbh.....
women do not decide against bf because of nstinct, they do decide agaisnt it, because of whatever reason, has cnditioned them to feel against it...and that sadly has a lot to do with the normalisation of FF and all that...
Instinct is to nourish your Baby, and well, usually that would mean breastfeeding...well...as nature intendet and all that....
a lot of people in the western societies are also conditioned to use lots of gadgets for their Baby's ratehr then using the real traditional method of keeping a Baby on them (carrying them around) and sharing the sleeping place, etc...rather then using the own cot/room...
a lot of people in the western soceities are conditioned to believe that they need to be in Hospital to give birth, where as natural instinct would probably be not too....etc....societies conditioning can not be underestimated....

Just to add - we need to law that prevents anyone from harrassing a mother for bf, without a limit.

3andnomore. YOUR instinct is to bf your babies, not everyone has that instinct, just as not every woman has what we call 'maternal' instinct and doesnt desire children. What are they? Less womanly or in the wrong than those who are very maternal? Seems like what you believe is natural instinct when bringing up baby should be the model for all mankind - it sounds a little bit egotistical tbh.

It wont come as shock I know, but I didnt breastfeed - BECAUSE I HAD NO YEARNING, NO COMPULSION, NO INSTINCT TO DO IT.

If I didnt feel that natural pull inside me, what are you saying, I'd been brainwashed? Rubbish I'm afraid.

Give women some credit for knowing their own minds and bodies, that's all I ask.

Surely if the law protects the right to breastfeed babies up to a year then people will take that to mean it's not acceptable to bf in public after that, and it is acceptable to ask a bf woman to move on.
Whereas at the moment people see it as a grey area. So although it would help women bf babies, it would actually make the situation 10x worse for a woman bf a child over a year old?

binkle, I agree with you that it's over-stating the case to say that if women don't have an 'instinctive' desire to feed their babies, they have been somehow conditioned out of it. I don't know how we can be sure - after all, some women don't want to have children, and the urge to reproduce (we are told) is one of the most basic. I don't think we can be certain that conditioning has made them feel differently. That's just the way they are. In the historic past, these might have been the women who opted out of marriage/partnerships, because hooking up with a man would inevitably mean pregnancy and motherhood.

I have come across women who don't feel an 'urge' to breastfeed, and they decide to do it after considering the options, and choosing the one that seems to them to have the greater benefits for their babies. (Some of these women are then struck by the strength of wanting to do it, and they enjoy it; others remain pretty neutral).

You're implying that mothers need to feel a 'yearning' to breastfeed, and when they don't have it, they don't do it. This is just as prescriptive as saying all women who don't want to breastfeed have been conditioned against it!

The truth is that mothers don't need the 'yearning' to breastfeed. They just do it, in the same way as we don't have a 'yearning' to do lots of things but make a reasoned decision to do them anyway.

i dont see why we need a campaign to bf in public - my great granny and all the women in the family since then have done it without a problem. also dont see why ff advertising needs to be banned, there are people like myself who need the second best.