challenging illegal formula packaging - sorry if this has already been posted but this is from the CEO of the NCT

[harpsichordcuddler]

"The NCT has been given a clear view from LACORS (the Local Authorities Coordinators of Regulatory Services that some infant formula packaging currently on store shelves is illegal under current regulations.

In order for it to be removed from sale there needs to be a prosecution or threatened prosecution. Local Trading Standards Officers are the people who would bring a prosecution, but to do this they need to receive large numbers of complaints from across the UK.

Would you help? This is your chance to make a real difference.

Next time you are in a supermarket or chemist, check out the infant formula packs (this formula is labelled as ?suitable from birth?) and read the wording.

The wording we are informed is illegal is

? Formulated to be nutritionally close to breastmilk
? With omega 3 LCP,s
? Closer Than Ever to Breastmilk
? Inspired by breastmilk

You may find other wording which is similar.

Send photos or a description to your trading standards office (you can locate your nearest using this link)

Scotland www.scotss.org.uk/scotss2.htm

England www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/consumers/clegis.cfm

Wales www.wrexham.gov.uk/english/env_services/tradingstandards/

N Ireland www.detini.gov.uk/cgi-bin/get_builder_page?page=61&site=9&parent=110

Channel islands www.gov.je/EconomicDevelopment/TradingStandards/

With a note to say

?These packs were on display in my local xxxxxxx on date xxxxx and I believe them to be illegal under current legislation because of the wording on the packs.
Please note the words

[INSERT WORDING ON PACK]

My information is that this wording is likely to be illegal. Please would you follow this up for me and let me know the outcome. ?

They will do the rest. You don?t need to explain why you think it is illegal or comment any further ? just report it. The body from whom local TSOs take their lead has already advised us that this packaging is illegal. Your letter will push them to act."

But isn't the reality that there isn't one formula that is better than any others? they are all a substitute for breast milk - an inferior substitute probably but not an inherently dangerous one (though nobody mentions studies showing heavy metal etc pollution in breast milk which presumably would not be in the ff). So what does it matter what crap they put on the labels? It is a choice (if you're lucky) between exclusive bf, mixed or exclusive ff - whichever colour packet, isn't it? i.e you don't decide to feed your baby Aptamil instead of breastmilk, you decide to feed him formula instead of breastmilk and then it is just the usual bullshit marketing between brands, like whether to buy kellogs Cornflakes or Sainsbury's own brand.

Why does formula kill babies in the third world btw? is it because it is mixed with contaminated water? I can see why people are pissed off with this but surely this is an educational problem that the formula companies should address - or not market in countries without a clean water supply, it is not the formula per se that kills is it? I know about the obesity link and bf for a year. I just don't quite understand the vitriol against formula. Noone would really think it was exactly the same as breast milk surely, but clearly it is an adequate, if not ideal substitute.

"i.e you don't decide to feed your baby Aptamil instead of breastmilk, you decide to feed him formula instead of breastmilk and then it is just the usual bullshit marketing between brands, like whether to buy kellogs Cornflakes or Sainsbury's own brand."

I agree actually Barbamama, though I agree with others that formula should ideally be unbranded to cut out all the bullshit (and price markups).

Good point Twinkle - unbranded would be a good way to go whilst still leaving the consumer choice.

maybe I am being naive, apparently some study said that 30% women in the Uk believe ff is the same as bm - I just find that astounding. I was very clear that bf was the ideal, on balance, but was glad to have the option to mix feed now and again. I agree we shouldn't be misled or lied to but it is the same with all consumer products, I just assume people are capable of making informed choices.

When I reluctantly decided to mix feed at 5 months I am sure I knew that all ff was much of a muchness i.e none was nutritionally superior or the same as breastmilk, I think I chose Aptamil because I hated the smell of SMA Gold and it held bad memories of the hospital midwives trying to force me to use it.

Hmmmmmmmm

barbamama - just posting briefly in answer to your query about formula in developing countries:

The mortality rate is much higher in ff babies in developing countries, and some of those deaths are down to dirty water but not all.

There's a huge immunological protective effect in breastfeeding and this is most noticeable in the most vulnerable babies - ie babies born to poorly nourished mums, exposed to lots of bugs, and with no access to medical care if they should become ill.

Babies in industrialised nations like the UK are generally absolutely fine with ff, because there are all those other factors protecting them. Even so, ff babies in the UK have higher rates of chest infections (for example).

This is really important because formula companies heavily emphasise the hygiene aspect of formula deaths and ignore the immunity aspect, suggesting (more or less in so many words) that if mums in developing countries could just be bothered to boil their water, their babies would be fine.

It's a lie.

barbamama, the reason why (or one of the reasons why) one third of women in the UK think formula is the same as bm is to do with formula promotion. including just the sort of phrases considered illegal.
and no it isn't just about contaminated water or sterilisation in this country or elsewhere. even if you take out the risks of contamination, and not making up the formula properly, there are still significant health effects in terms of infection and longer term diseases (on a statistical basis of course).
I just am not too keen on women being misled in an illegal way. I really can't see that is too controversial

desiderata, fair enough.
maybe now we can all get on with feeding our babies without other people belittling our choices then

"I agree actually Barbamama, though I agree with others that formula should ideally be unbranded to cut out all the bullshit (and price markups)."

ermm - I don't - DS3 reacted horribly to on brand of formula but gets on just fine with another.....if they all looked the same gawd knows what grief I'd put the poor little mite through!

"ie babies born to poorly nourished mums, exposed to lots of bugs, and with no access to medical care if they should become ill. "

so perhaps we should be spending our time adn money campainging for people all across the world to have the same sort of standard of medical care, food and sanitation as we in the Western world do.

breastmilk is protective against infections of all kinds, no matter where you are in the world.

oh so we just carry on letting millions of children die (1 a minute) (oh and lets not forget 1 woman dying, from causes of pregnancy and birth, a minute too) (and we're talking breast and bottlefed) because it's more important to stop the FF ones dying because of dodgy labels on formula tins??

Oh yes I forgot - we're doing alright here in the West - lets just leave the developing world to continue to suffer from MUCH more than the consequences of FFing because we MUST concentrate on that . Never mind the 2.6 billion who don't have access to basic sanitation.

As much as I understand BMA's stance I'd rather be spending my time making Poverty History so that ALL mothers around the world truly can choose which way they want to feed their children.......

fannyannie, it isn't an either/or thing. who is suggesting we don't care about santiation? poverty?
encouraging breastfeeding is a way to save more lives, more quickly than fixing the fucked up economics of the developing world.

more lives would be saved by getting rid of poverty and improving sannitation.....and is it really going to be quicker......when did the WHO code of marketing come into play? And how many years have BMA been telling us 1.5 million babies die a year "because of formula"???

Meanwhile Wateraid has had over 7.5 million people gain access to clean water..........

Sorry, may have missed this somewhere, but is there any evidence that the wording on formula tins has any impact on whether or not women bfeed? Who reads formula tins - honestly?

Seems like such a pointless thing to focus on when surely supporting/promoting bfeeding would have more of an effect on whether or not women bfeed?

Anyway, for the VAST MAJORITY of women who ffeed their child as an alternative to bfeeding (for whatever reason) why should they not have information about how similar that milk is to breast milk and what aspects of breast milk it has in it. It is after all a substitute for breast milk.

I really can't see what the problem is here.

i do, scooby, and i did. and it influenced me in the choice i made and cost me more money as a result. as i mentioned below. tbh, anyone who says that advertising/branding doesn't affect them isn't really thinking things through.

Hi Aitch!
I'm not saying branding/advertising has no impact on what formula you buy, what I'm saying is does it really have an impact on whether or not or for how long you bfeed?

Your point is it influenced your choice of formula, I don't see a problem with that?

Thanks for the tip-off ladies. I've just bought two extra cartons of formula milk and some "ready mades" to make sure that if the local supermarket's shelves are temporarily cleared (which I very much doubt but I'm taking no chances), ds2 will continue to get his "fix" of a substance that it appears some would like to make illegal except in cases of proven medical need. (based on recent postings on other threads calling for formula to be available on prescription only)

If we really care about the number of infants dying due to being artificially fed and want to tackle it in a meaningful way, wouldn't it be better to target the situations in the countries around the world where infant mortality rates, caused by artificial feeding, are the highest.

Plus if certain RL ladies are going to bang on about their refusal to use nestle coffee, I'd be grateful if they'd research their facts on which expensive beauty products and other stuff they should be avoiding too.

i do. because it said it was 'closer to bm', medics told me it was better and so i spent £1.50 more per tin than i needed to.
and the medics realistically only told me that because they'd been marketed to, not because it was intrinsically different.
i think it's taking advantage of very vulnerable women, gutted by not being able to bf and wanting to provide something 'close' to the natural experience.

lolololol fedupwasherwoman... a bit of an over-reaction i think.

okay so to sum up breastmilk is the best thing for your baby, as it contains no nasties whatsoever ( apart from all the chemicals and pollutants each adult inhales and carries around in their bodies or does this not pass on) Formula is not as good as breastmilk ( as it is made from cows milk and loads of other stuff that has been tested nine million times etc etc)...come on we are all grown women with brains we can make our own decisions for us and our children, no woman has wandered around a supermarket and then decided to feed her baby on formula because what of it says on a tin..(and if she has , she prob got pregnant by running 3 times round the brownie hut at midnight!)
You can feed your baby organic veg (grown in soil fertilised by ground up organic pig bones, sprayed with natural organic pesticides made from extracts of chrysanthemum..who says thats good for you?) feed your child sugar free sweets (they use saccharin instead..is that better?)
at some point in it's life before it hits 18 it might have something that is not 100% wholesome .....they will survive it ..CHILL!
Sure formula companies are out to make money THEY ARE A BUSINESS just like the breastmilk counsellors who also get paid, and the breat pump manufacturers who also make money from babies .....thats what makes the world go round.

bf counsellors are volunteers.

No response to the question

IS THERE ANY EVIDENCE THAT CHANGING FORMULA TINS (as opposed to changing general marketing practices such as those carried out in 3world countries) WOULD MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE TO DECISIONS TO BFEED OR NOT?

If not, then god aren't you wasting a lot of pointless energy on this? And isn't it really about you hating formula/formula companies when in fact they are a necessity for the vast majority of babies in this country?

Aitch - the issue of whether Aptimil really is in fact closer to bm than other formulas is surely an issue of false advertising if it is simply not true? If it is true then what's the problem?

There is evidence that phrases and marketing on tins of formula sway parents towards using them. As evidenced by the survey that harpsi has mentioned where it was found that 30% of mothers thought bm was the same as formula in content.

The fact is, by inferring this, they are capturing a market that is going to earn them profit. That is all they care about.

As for third world countries, its not just dirty water - its the selling of formula as best for the baby, and selling it at £2 a tin, knowing that the average weekly wage out there is £6 a week. Lack of information on the tin, and education means that parents often water the formula down to make it last longer. The Health Professionals are bribed and given incentives to push formula over and above b/milk. Once you start using formula, within in a matter of weeks - or less - there is No Going Back. So parents have to pay a third of their income in order to feed their baby over what should, in reality, be at least a year. The average annual earnings of a Londoner is what, £27,000 pa? Can you even begin to imagine spending £9,000 a year on milk for your baby, having been told its better, when in fact you neednt spend that at all? (And of course, we all know, that b/milk is the ideal food for babies).

I object to formula companies praying on a mother's insecurities and doubts that are undoubtedly, in most cases, already there when choosing a formula to give their baby.

These words that you dont think are important - you are so wrong. Marketing is a Multi-billion pound industry in the UK. These 'tricks' they are using to sway choice from one brand to another, by implying they make your child brainier, develop better, have a better immune system. It's all bullshit and you know it. Just like "Bifidus Digestivum" or "pentapeptides" or "boswollox" ffs.

lol at bf counsellors being a profit making exercise
bf counsellors are volunteers and they go through difficult and lengthy training to be given the privilege of helping women for free.
they are not often seen lounging on private beaches drinking away the profits made on their lucrative bf counselling enterprises