Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

New Mum - desparate for help...

57 replies

TrixieVix · 13/12/2006 21:13

Joseph is nearly 2 weeks old, and was 9lbs 3oz when born. He now weighs 9lbs 7oz.

I'm finding BF difficult as Joe seems to want feeding several times an hour. Sometimes he feeds well for 20 minutes or so, then drops off to sleep. I try waking him up, winding him, and changing him if necessary, then putting him back on my breast to make sure he's full, but very often he doesn't want any more. Then, if I put him down, he starts screaming, and can only be quietened by feeding him again. I feel like I'm constantly feeding him, and am beginning to crack because of the lack of sleep. I get no longer than an hours sleep at any one time. We had to call my mum at 2am last night to come and deal with Joe as we were at the end of our teathers. He often feeds to much that he makes himself sick, and that coupled with his weight gain makes me sure he's getting enough milk.

Please help - any advice would be greatly appreciated

OP posts:
JackieNoHoHo · 13/12/2006 21:22

TrixieVix, sounds like you're doing very well in very tough circumstances - I'm afraid I can't suggest anything, but this will bump your thread up to the top and maybe someone else will be able to help. Didn't want it to go unanswered.

snugglebumnappies · 13/12/2006 21:22

Hi Trixie, it's not unusual and it's only early days, but exhausting all the same, get as much help as you can, if DP is off work, sleep in shifts so he can have DS after a feed so you can get a couple of hours rest. Will Ds settle with others if he is being held? If so a sling may be a good idea, let DP or parents take him out for a walk while you get some rest.

JackieNoHoHo · 13/12/2006 21:35

The other thing (and I know this is a very personal thing and not what everyone would recommend) might be to try a dummy.

Definitely second trying a sling, so at least you have your hands free. Sounds like he's putting on weight really well. Some babies just do feed quickly. My DS only ever fed for 10 minutes at a time, and was fine on that. Maybe if he falls asleep after feeding, try not waking him, and see how that goes.

Hope things start to settle down for you soon.

Rochwen · 13/12/2006 21:35

Try not to let him fall asleep during the feed. Undress him, stroke his wee hands and talk to him. Make sure he has a full feed. Also, try implementing some sort of routine, say a feed every 3 hours during the day and 4 hours during the night, so he doesn't expect a feed everytime he wakes up. Give him a dummy if you suspect that he just wants to suckle, some babies are really sucky and used your breast as a dummy.

Also, try expressing some milk and get him used to a bottle NOW, if you wait to long he might reject a bottle. If he takes some expressed milk in a bottle your partner can feed him and you can get some sleep.

Good Luck ! These first few weeks suck but it will get much better very soon.

Original poster
TrixieVix · 13/12/2006 21:42

Thanks for all your replies - it helps to know I'm not alone!

We have tried a dummy with him, but he rejects if after only a couple of seconds. DP help it loosely in his mouth for 10 minutes in the night, which kept him quiet for that time, but as soon as he let go, Joe spat it out and started screaming again.

I started expressing at the beginning of last week (which I think was too soon, as it affected the supply and demand of my milk, and only made Joe hungrier. We seemed to get on with that better, and he slept for longer, but wasn't sustainable, as I began to prefer expressing to BF as Joe slept for longer once he'd had an expressed bottle.

I want to continue BF, but am on the verge of giving up as I'm exhausted.

Are the night times worse for everyone? Is there anything I can do to help get Joe off to sleep at night time better?

OP posts:
JackieNoHoHo · 13/12/2006 21:47

Are you swaddling him at night? It can help them feel more secure, and help stop them doing that thing where they flail their arms about and wake themselves up. I used to make sure all feeds at night were done in very low light, so that there was a clear difference between night time and day time.

You're doing really well. It can be very difficult at first, and yes I think the nights feel more difficult as you really just want to get some sleep yourself. Take it a day at a time, even a feed at a time.

Rochwen · 13/12/2006 21:47

Ah there is a trick to dummys. Offer it to your son when he is fully awake and play with it. Whenever he starts to suck it pull it slightly away, that will make him suck it harder. Make it a fun game and he'll soon accept it.

Persist with the breastfeeding. Expressing will not make you have less milk but it will make you produce more as you are upping your demand (your boob won't know whether it's the baby or the pump wanting milk). Expressed milk is liquid gold as it translates into sleep. Keep expressing until you have a full bottle, give it to hubby and then SLEEP. You need the rest !

Good Luck !

Tentun · 13/12/2006 21:50

Hello there
This all sounds very familiar. My little one is well and truely into toddlerhood now but when he was little he was a devil for being on the breast for hours. The times that were worst for us were in the evenings from about 6pm right up to around 11pm. He would cry and cry and cry - not colic, just unsettled and he wouldn't calm down unless he was on the breast. It was a very tiring time but there is definitely a light at the end of the tunnel and it does end (although it might not seem like it now). We didn't try and put him into any routine, I just basically went with the flow and listened to his needs and if he needed feeding/sucking, I'd stick him on the breast and sit my bum on the sofa and watch TV (I got really familiar with all kinds of rubbish day-time tele). Now I can look back at that time and laugh but at the time it was a real struggle so hats off to you for breastfeeding and sticking to it and hang in there. It's not easy but you sound like you're doing a brilliant job already.

Tentun · 13/12/2006 21:53

Oh, just wanted to add: We tried our lo on a dummy but he wouldn't accept it at all. We used the special, orthodontic type and he just wouldn't take to it. Eventually after trying a few other types of dummy we bought the MAM ones and he took that first time brilliantly.

olittletownofberolina · 13/12/2006 21:58

It's not a good idea to impose a routine when establishing bf, as it can interfere with the establishment of supply. I know (I have been there) it's desperately hard when you are sleep deprived, but it really is worth persisting with demand feeding. Introducing a bottle this early can also sometimes lead babies to reject your breast, but not necessarily. Express after feeds and don't worry if you don't get too much - it is not a reliable guide to how much milk you have.

A sling is fantastic. Sleep whenever your ds sleeps! Enlist friends/GPs/dp to take him for a walk (well wrapped up in the pram) to give you a break. Housework is not a priority at this stage!

Is your ds actually vomiting or just sicking up a bit? my ds was sicky for months - but it was just bringing up a bit of milk.

You will be glad you persevered if you do - we had terrible trouble the first 4 weeks bf, but now ds is 19mo and still bf, and it's so wonderful to have such a source of closeness and comfort 'on hand.

olittletownofberolina · 13/12/2006 21:59

(Oh yes, I agree with Tentun - take the opportunity during long feeds to sit and watch telly/read/MN while you can! Now I sometimes long for a bit of peace to do the above )

fishie · 13/12/2006 22:08

see here for bf information.

night feedings are really essential to establishing supply. in general it is best to snuggle up and not worry about anything. and certainly don't do anything in the house for at least 6 weeks if you can possibly avoid it.

Rochwen · 13/12/2006 22:08

See, I'm a total fan of routines as the baby learns to when to expect milk and thus you will more likely know why he is crying and you get a bit of shape into your day.

Please do NOT wait to introduce bottles as there is a danger that your baby won't accept it if you wait to long. Then you are really stuck ! If you only use one or two bottles a day it will not confuse your baby as the majority of feeds are still breastfeeds. Baby's will always prefer the breast to the bottle, I think more often a bottle is rejected than the breast.

chubbleigh · 13/12/2006 22:09

Just to answer very generally, I have known quite a few new mums who have had a bit of a crisis in the early stages with breast feeding. If you get past this tough few weeks with out giving up bfing you will sail into much calmer waters and really start to get the hang of it. Try everything you and anyone else can think of like keeping him awake to feed, burping him after a short while and then continuing the feed etc.

Also, very importantly don't feel under pressure to carry on as normal in the day, if he sleeps try and get a nap yourself. You've got to really look after yourself in these early days.

fishie · 13/12/2006 22:19

rochwen i am surprised and a little concerned that you are advising routine, dummies and bottles for a baby that is less than two weeks old. i do not believe that this is a good idea.

tiktok · 13/12/2006 22:20

Awww.....Trixie you sound very pressured.

I am not going to add anything to the thread - some of what is said here is confusing and unhelpful to you, though all of it is well-meaning. Instead I do suggest you talk to someone who will listen to you and will help you decide among your options without telling you what to do, or being certain that what they did will work for you.

Call one of the volunteer helplines (eg NCT 0870 444 8708) and speak to someone tomorrow....this is better than posting to a talk board (IMO) when things are confusing and when you are tired.

Judy1234 · 13/12/2006 22:23

That's normal. Virtually all my 5 children wanted feeding like that.

It is the hardest few weeks of your life. It gets better and breastfeeding is much easier then than bottle feeding. I found the first baby by far the worst. The later ones you've got used to it all.

He probably doesn't need feeding that much but wants to be held. What about feed him on both sides. Then set a time after that not to feed so you get a break in the day, say an hour or 2 hours and in that time put him in a sling and hoover the house or go on a walk. He's up against your body so has the warmth but not feeding as such. Then if he cries just let him have that body motion rather than a feed to give your body a rest. Another time put him in the car seat and go on an hour's drive - the car can help them sleep. Another time leave him with someone else for an hour. Also if you're boith exhausted try sleeping in separate rooms so at least one of you is getting some sleep at least some nights. Also try sleeping with him next to youi so you hardly wake when he wakes to feed at night. Graudally feed less often. He should not need feeding more than 2 hourly and most babies cry for long periods of the day and feeindg and sucking is what they like best so they'd probably choose to do it 20 hours a day if they had a choice. You are doing great.

tiktok · 13/12/2006 22:33

you see, this is what doesn't help.....Xenia, everything you say about the baby needing to be close is fine, but then you go and say he shouldn't need feeding more than 2 hourly.

Some babies certainly do feed more often than this especially at first. There's nothing 'should' or 'shouldn't' about it!

It is not true that 'most' babies cry for long periods of the day.

mummypig · 13/12/2006 22:33

Trixie a sling is a really good idea in the daytime, and sleeping with him is great in the nighttime (and not as risky as everyone thinks, see here and the links at the bottom of the page.

The first few weeks or even months with a new baby are really tough, especially if you are breastfeeding and have little support. There's a bit about it here on kellymom.com and the kellymom.com site also has articles about normal infant sleep (basically they sleep for far less than we think they should ).

However, I'm also wondering if he might have reflux? Reflux is when the stomach contents come back up the oesophagus, and because they are acidic it can hurt a lot, hence the screaming. It's a bit like really bad heartburn, all the time. It's the screaming when you put him down, and the sicking up, which makes me wonder. I know he's gaining weight well, but not all reflux babies have low weight gain, some feed loads because they find it comforting. There's a list of symptoms here and some more information on reflux here on kellymom.com although I don't agree completely with everything on the page.

Anyway, if he is refluxing, then there's loads of good info on the internet, starting with the advice on the pollywogbaby.com site, and you can try searching the mumsnet archives too.

thinking of you during this tiring time

mummypig · 13/12/2006 22:38

ps I have just seen tiktok's post and agree with her, it's probably best if you call a breastfeeding helpline as they can talk you through your own situation without making assumptions as we are all doing here.

so you don't have to read my previous post but do read tiktoks (she knows what she's talking about) and try to find a moment to call someone tomorrow. Best wishes

Lio · 13/12/2006 22:47

HI Trixie, tiktok is right, your best bet is to get your midwife or health visitor to put you in touch with a breastfeeding counsellor who will watch you and Joe for a whole feed. There's no substitute for this, although it's always nice to have MN support as an on-line back-up. It is really really hard getting over this 'hump' but with the right help it WILL happen and it will be worth it. GOOD LUCK xxx

Judy1234 · 13/12/2006 22:53

Well my babies cried for ages lots of the time but perhaps I was unlucky. Actually at 2 weeks they slept a lot so I might just be remembering wrongly.
On feeding more than 2 hours I said that because I don't think it would be harmed by a 2 hour gap and if she's exhausted then having that break won't kill the baby and might help the mother a lot. I would often feed what felt like most of the time. I wasn't trying to say anything against demand feeding which I always did and certainly at 2 weeks.

Rochwen · 14/12/2006 14:49

tiktok said: 'some of what is said here is confusing and unhelpful to you' Ouch that hurt. None of us in this thread have proclaimed to be experts, as far as I have read all the posts everyone just speaks from experience. TrixiVix asked for our help and experience and we have shared them. Different things worked for different people and we have shared what worked for us personally. By giving her different ideas perhaps by picking and choosing she finds something that works for her.

I agree with you totally that Trixi should get in touch with her midwife and healthvisitor but if she asks us surely we can offer her our advice.

Anyway, Trixi, this is what I think. Babies aren't born with an expectation of how the world works. Every baby is different in its needs and desires and so is every mother. You each have to get to know each other and find ways of living together that works for all of you. There is no one way that works for all of us.

Personally I think that it is a lot of ask of a mother to be available to feed her baby round the clock. That is bound to exhaust the mother and is not really realistic, IMHO, as for example it means you can never go anywhere without the baby as you never know when the baby will next 'demand' a feed. Even in hospital they give you some sort of routine, e.g. feed the baby every 3 to 4 hours. Unless the baby has special needs I was told that this is enough. There is a real danger that if the mother is worn out by continuous 24 hour breastfeeding she might just crack and give it up completely (and I wouldn't blame her), surely it's better if she feeds the odd bottle than gives up breastfeeding altogether, no?

I know that not everybody will agree with this and that's really ok with me.

moondog · 14/12/2006 15:14

I don't agree with you at all Rochwen.
It is also inaccurate.
What hospitals do you frequent that advocate feeding routines?

Trixie,it's bloody hard isn't it but you sound like you have gold top milk.
The secret is to accept that,if you decide to breastfeed,you also have to understand that for a short time,it is pretty much a full time job.
You cannot do it and do everything else.
Someone else needs to deal with the house,the food,the shopping and so on.

If in doubt,listen to Tiktok alone.
She knows more about breastfeeding than the rest of us put together.

Another good helpline is Assoc. for Breastfeeding Mothers

0870 401 7711

Rochwen · 14/12/2006 15:23

My Baby was born in Aberdeen Royal Infirmary the biggest hospital in the North East of Scotland. Both the midwifes and the paediatrician said to feed my dd every 3 to 4 hours. My health visitor then advised me to give her a dummy when she woke up more frequently rather than feeding her constantly. I never had any problems with my milk production and once I had expressed enough for a bottle I got sleep I found that I coped much much better.

...and why can it be only one or the other? What's wrong with mixed feeding? It worked beautifully for myself and three of my close friends. The best of both worlds in my opinion, the advantages of breastmilk for the baby and sleep and cinema for me. Brilliant !

Really it's not about doing it the 'right' way, it's about coping. Whatever works, do it !