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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

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Original poster

New Mum - desparate for help...

57 replies

TrixieVix · 13/12/2006 21:13

Joseph is nearly 2 weeks old, and was 9lbs 3oz when born. He now weighs 9lbs 7oz.

I'm finding BF difficult as Joe seems to want feeding several times an hour. Sometimes he feeds well for 20 minutes or so, then drops off to sleep. I try waking him up, winding him, and changing him if necessary, then putting him back on my breast to make sure he's full, but very often he doesn't want any more. Then, if I put him down, he starts screaming, and can only be quietened by feeding him again. I feel like I'm constantly feeding him, and am beginning to crack because of the lack of sleep. I get no longer than an hours sleep at any one time. We had to call my mum at 2am last night to come and deal with Joe as we were at the end of our teathers. He often feeds to much that he makes himself sick, and that coupled with his weight gain makes me sure he's getting enough milk.

Please help - any advice would be greatly appreciated

OP posts:

ska · 14/12/2006 15:38

I only have one natural child (+ 2 steps) and mine was 4 weeks prem, but normalish birth weight. She fed all the time for the first few weeks and it was hell! I got mastitis and sore/cracked nipple/no sleep. Terrible now i think back on it. What I did (and may be no help to you at all) was this:
slept topless and put her on top of duvet between me and dh and she got herself to the breast during the night (honestly! - advised by fab midwife);
sat propped up in bed (terrible sticthing wound, another story) during 1st 2 weeks and had a V shaped pillow across my belly and she lay on it and fed on and off. Later on transfered to the sofa and did the same, this time with books, mags, TV a remote control and telephone! my life was on that sofa.
husband did all chores/cooked/fed me/took baby out for little walks in a sling
after a couple of weeks started expressing milk from 'other' breast while she fed. seemed to give me more milk. froze it and used it to 'top her up'.
went to bf clinic run by fab NCT bunch near me but needed ferrying there and back (couldn't drive, stiches too sore) just 2 times and it sorted it out. Put her on the breast in a 'rugby tackle' kind of way - held her flat across one side and brought her flat to the other breast. not a good description but she got a full mouth of breast better.
just kind of got resigned to the exhaustion and slept whenever there was a chance.
at 12 weeks she seemd to sort herself out and started sleeping through the night. At 5 months I wnet back to work and she rejected the breast. Awful then, felt bereft but there was nothing doing. She then had formula. But I got her to that point most proudly!

good luck, feeding your baby is lovely if you can do it - and take heart, a really good friend of mine was fine with kids 1 & 2 and had to go to a BF clinic with no 3. I don't think experience necessarily comes into it. They are all different and you do what you can to get through the day/night - don't beat yourself up about it. Make the most of the closeness, it's a joy.

moondog · 14/12/2006 17:25

You were lucky it worked out Rochwen because they were talking through their arses.

Don't assume MWs and paediatricians know about b/feeding.
They don't.
Best bet is a lactation consultant or b/f counsellor.

suedonim · 14/12/2006 22:48

ARI has a terrible reputation for bfing. A BFC friend worked with them to raise bf rates but it was an uphill struggle to get them to take even the smallest bf-friendly action. A midwife who tell a mother that it's made the mw's life easier now that she has switched to formula is not to be encouraged, imo.

MKGnearlyimmaculateconception · 15/12/2006 01:22

I'm not going to offer any help about routines, or breastfeeding because every baby is different, and I have no clue what normal is, because my normal is not your normal.
All I'm going to say is that the early weeks are the toughest, but in a few months after everything settles you will look back and miss them terribly. Your ds will eventually fall into his own routine, it may not be what you think of as the ideal routine, but you'll learn to manage it.
When my ds was born he slept on my chest in a reclining chair for the first three weeks. Sometimes they do just want to be close, sometimes the just want to feed. Your ds will sort himself out, he just needs to get used to the world first.

Good luck.

Rochwen · 15/12/2006 20:23

Sorry to go OT, TrixyVix.

Actually I thouhgt they were really helpful at ARI. My dd was born six weeks premature and I had a c/s but I was determined to breastfeed, so they sent in a lactation specialist to explain everything to me. Then whenever it was feeding time one of the midwives would come into my room and help me latch my wee one on(which was not easy as she was still very weak). She stayed with me until we were both happy that dd was drinking well. They were very helpful and extremely supportive, even when the paediatrician suggested to top dd up with formula (which I didn't want) the midwives helped me express enough so that she could be topped up with breastmilk. I successfully fed dd until she was 7 months old and I never had any problems with milk production, feeding problems or nipple confusion on dd part.

So, from my experience I can really commend ARI for helping me breastfeed successfully. In general I noticed that they were very pro-breastfeeding, so Sue, I don't know ARI have gotten the bad reputation.

Rochwen · 15/12/2006 20:25

....and Trixi, how is it going? Are you getting anymore sleep?

moondog · 15/12/2006 21:02

i fail to see that this hospital can be described as supportive of breastfeeding when the paediatrician suggested formula top ups which at this stage,more often than not,are the kiss of death to breastfeeding.

Rochwen · 15/12/2006 21:33

Moondog, I honestly think that without the support of the midwifes at ARI I would have been able to successfully breastfeed my dd. They were as determined as I was to make it work although it wasn't easy as a) dd was very weak because of being prem and her suck reflex wasn't properly developed and b) my milk took a long time to come in. They tried and tried and found ways to overcome both to make breastfeeding happen for both of us. Left to my own devices I would have orobably just given up. So, I really don't think they staff could not be called breastfeeding friendly.

....and if we can't trust the medical experts then who can we trust. If a paediatrician says my baby needs top ups then she needs top ups. Who am I to contradict him/her. I am not an expert in infant health.

Also, firstly I wonder why you think that feeding top ups is 'a kiss of death' to breastfeeding and secondly, (I might have misunderstood you there) as passionate as I am about breastfeeding I don't think that it's breastfeeding at all costs. If it works fine, if not fine too. There are plenty healthy babies raised on bottles (including myself).

moondog · 15/12/2006 21:38

Neither is the paediatrician, more's the pity.

That's what is so rotten about the whole set up.The people we trust generally know feck all about breast feeding.

moondog · 15/12/2006 21:40

Rochwen,we have discussed this stuff on MN over and over (do you join in) and people who really know their stuff like Tiktok and Mears have consistently pointed the way to accurate and up to date research that proves this to be the case time and again.

Check out the archives if interested.

moondog · 15/12/2006 21:41

And if the MWs (who sound great) helped you express enough for top ups,then obviously you didn't need the formula did you?

Also,I wonder why they didn't just suggest putting the baby to the breast more often?

Rochwen · 15/12/2006 21:47

I will try and find those threads, moondog, but for myself personally I have found this not to be true. I have breastfed and given the odd bottle of breastmilk to dd and it certainly didn't end the breastfeeding for me, in fact, if I hadn't had the chance to give the odd bottle I don't think I would have continued breastfeeding as I really did need sleep and the odd break from my dd.

As I've said before I have three other friends who did mixed feeding and all three of them fed until very recently and it worked for them, surely the four of us aren't exceptions.

I really think that there isn't only way to do things. Different things work for different babies and mothers.

Sorry Trixi for highjacking your thread. Do let us know how you are getting on.

dingdonglapinroseonhigh · 15/12/2006 21:48

Moondog/Rochwen (with apols for hijack) I had the pretty crappy experience of having my bf ruined by the hospital I was in, paeds saying top up with formula, MWs waking me and DTs though the night to feed (they were 5 wks early, we were in for a week) criticising me for formula top up that wasn't my decision & making me feel crap that I couldn't express as much as they wanted less than 24 hrs after the birth. I think some hospitals have a lot to answer for.

DizzyBinterWonderland · 15/12/2006 21:53

rochwen calm down. i think (though i could be wrong!) that moondog is talking about formula top ups not the odd bottle of ebm. formula top ups do affect bm supply because bf relies on supply and demand.

Rochwen · 15/12/2006 21:55

We cross posted. No I didn't give her formula as we have allergies in our family and I'd rather she just had breastmilk.

The mw's actually suggested expressing to up my milk supply as dd was very sleepy and we had a hard enough time to wake her up every 3 hours. I don't think we could have kept her awake to let her feed more often. After we came out of hospital we were in this 3 - 4 hour routine and it worked very well for us even when she 'woke up'.

You know I often wondered whether the fact that I was on morphine (lovely stuff) contributed to her being so sleepy. I wonder if she got some of it through my milk.

moondog · 15/12/2006 21:56

Dingdong,you aren't hijacking.Discussion is open to all.

Your experience is exactly what i am talking about.

Utter shambles.

No coghesion in approach.

It's a bloody disgrace.

Rochwen,it worked for you and that's great.It's brillliant that you are happy with your choices.But the advice was not optimal and would probably scupper things for someone else.

Newborn babies need unlimited access to the breast to encourage latching and get the whole supply/demand thing up and running.

This is an indisputable fact.

moondog · 15/12/2006 21:57

(And I understand rationale for expressing now Roch.)

dingdonglapinroseonhigh · 15/12/2006 22:00

You're right Moondog it is a bloody disgrace and I still feel angry about it 3 yrs later. Its about time docs and mws spoke to each other - they even f**ked up my discharge, with mw saying DTs and I were ok to leave and ped saying no, result- I discharged myself knowing only too well that I would be better off looking after them at home where I could eat properly and sleep when it suited me and them, rather than when the mws saw fit to let us. My notes read like the I'm some mad loony militant, I'm not, honest

moondog · 15/12/2006 22:03

We shouldn't feel like nutters for wanting what we deserve.
Dingdong,have you seen the archives?
Fantastic stuff in there,especially form Mears and Tiktok the resident gurus.

Do yuo/have you posted on these threads before?

Rochwen · 15/12/2006 22:05

'formula top ups do affect bm supply because bf relies on supply and demand' Yes, that certainly makes sense.

I do think that breast are very clever though. Mine always had milk at feeding time but were not engorged at the 'bottle slot'. Brilliant design.

dingdonglapinroseonhigh · 15/12/2006 22:07

No I tend to stay well clear of these particular discussions but I saw what you had said about hosp support and top ups and couldn't resist...I am newish to mn and wish I had been a member 3 yrs ago when it might have helped me. FWIW I persevered with alternate bf/formula to alternate twin IYSWIM for about 2 months but stopped bf after along time spent bf 1 to find they were still hungry even after an hour

moondog · 15/12/2006 22:11

Sounds like you made a valiant effort in the face of much adversity Dingdong,and you did manage to breastfeed them.

I so admire people like you.

dingdonglapinroseonhigh · 15/12/2006 22:13

I dare say that if they hadn't been my first I would have found bf easier, I guess that to have twins as your first (and only) is hard, but still had always intended to bf - when the hosp asked which formula I wanted to use to top up I had no idea, had never even contemplated using it.

dingdonglapinroseonhigh · 15/12/2006 22:14

x post - thanks moondog

fishie · 15/12/2006 22:17

that is very sad dingdong. i was also 'helped' with formula in hospital, but was lucky enough to have mn and a really good bf counsellor. and not twins either

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