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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Positive vibes thread for mums with BF problems

66 replies

Zara1984 · 02/11/2012 18:24

Hi all

My DS is 6 days old and BF is not going great. Having difficulty getting him to latch, he's on expressed breast milk. The immediate fog of distress has lifted but I'm still sometimes feeling confident I'll be able to get him on the boob, but other times feeling like a failure :( like right now :(

I thought I would start a positive vibes thread for other ladies who are having problems. Like listing stuff we are doing that is awesome. Here is my pathetic list:

  • despite a rough start my DS is now giving lots of wet dirty nappies from all the expressed milk I'm giving him
  • my DS looks at me with so much I love I know he really doesn't care how I feed him, he just wants to be close to me all the time
  • I had a shower and brushed my hair today
  • he managed to latch and suck for 30 minutes today with mw help!!
  • I sent a super-positive pep talk/confidence boosting text to my boss whose wife had a cs today and I know would be feeling terrified.

Sorry my list is not very long... but you get the idea....

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Zara1984 · 05/11/2012 12:15

Feeling really down this morning Sad he really does prefer the bottle I think Sad - was in tears saying to DMIL and DH I can't do this anymore but they said I need to keep going for another week at least like the midwife said.

Breaks my heart when he cries at my boob, then I have to give him to someone else to feed (he happily slurps away on bottle) and I get left with a breast pump to hold instead of my baby Sad I ask DMIL and DH to sit next to me while they feed him otherwise I just feel so lonely.

Am grateful that the sun is shining today. And that DS got sent a nice bunny rattle from my friends in NZ Smile

I am in Republic of Ireland so not sure if their guidelines on feeding with cup/syringe are same as NHS.

Just spoke to health visitor who is coming out to see me tomorrow. She said it could take 6 weeks but went quiet when I said I need to get him on the boob 100% by the end of this month as I am flying to NZ Sad

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Curtsey · 05/11/2012 13:11

Hi Zara,

Sorry to pop in and be nosey.
As you know ROI is not the most breastfeeding friendly country right now. Things are improving all the time but we're not at UK/NHS levels at all yet. Your PHN could be fabulously well informed (mine was pretty good) but there's a chance she might not really be that up-to-date on cup feeding etc. Please do keep posting here and seek out local LLL support if it's very important to you to keep baby on the boob. (There's also a good on breastfeeding board on the ROI site www.rollercoaster.ie - the posters there might have useful local info.)

You're doing brilliantly and the sun is shining :)

Londonmrss · 05/11/2012 13:28

Zara, my midwife gave me some tiny tubes to do finger feeding. You tape the tube to your finger and put the other end in the bottle, then the baby can suckle on your finger. It basically means they do the same action on your finger as your nip and teaches them that they have to work for their milk.
It's really no good for us yet because we still just have to get the milk into her to clear out the nasty jaundice (10 days old and she still looks like an oompa loompa) and the finger feeding is quite slow and labourious. Worth trying though.
Another 15 minute latch today with the nipple shield.
I am finding now that my nipples feel quite sore even with a correct (shield-based) latch. I think it's because I've been expressing so much and so regularly. Any advice for that? I think I'm going to try expressing smaller amounts more often maybe.

Zara1984 · 05/11/2012 13:41

Ok going to try something new - lactation consultant is going to send me out a supplemental nursing system, I should have it by tomorrow. Anyone have any experience of these???

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Welovecouscous · 05/11/2012 14:15

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Londonmrss · 05/11/2012 18:54

We've managed to latch a few more times today, still with the nipple shield. Only for 5-10 minutes at a time, then she gets a bit sleepy and I have to force the bottle on her, but still really happy with progress- we've gone from nothing to proper feeding in the space of 24 hours.
It is slightly more difficult now to be in control of exactly how much she feeds- we still need to get enough in her to clear the jaundice and it's hard to tell how much she gets at the boob. Will see how she weighs at the midwife tomorrow.
Let us know how the supplement thingy goes, Zara.

Zara1984 · 05/11/2012 20:55

Am so pleased to hear about your progress londonmrs - cheering for you here!!!!

Today was a hard day. Begged a few times to DH to let me give up. Will try again tomorrow. Need to detach myself from the rejection/blackness I automatically feel when DS doesn't latch Sad

Today I am also grateful for mod cons - take a bow dishwasher, microwave, washing machine & dryer!!! Grin

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makachu · 05/11/2012 23:00

Well done to everyone with small, monumental successes and hugs and tea to everyone having problems.

I really feel for everyone who's in the same position I was not even a couple of weeks a go! I want to offer a bit of hope for the future and a bit of hindsight.

Zara, Cast out all feelings of rejection. He isn't rejecting you at all even though it feels that way. He is hungry, he wants food, he knows it's there but he can't get it. He is crying because he wants to eat, not because he doesn't want to breast feed. The advice I was given was to keep on trying to latch him on over and over again. Looking back I think that doing this built up my baby's frustration and did not help him learn how to feed. If you think about it from your baby's point of view, he is hungry, his dinner is there, but it keeps being taken away from him. For him to be able to learn to feed properly he needs to be hungry enough to want to feed but not so ravenous that he's frantic and he needs to be reasonably calm and not screaming. If he's screaming at your breast, I wouldn't put yourself and him through the trauma, just stop! My DS only latched after I had actually given up and stopped trying so hard. Give yourself a break for a day or so!

I think what helped for me was getting him sucking my thumb for comfort. He then got more used to having something fleshy in his mouth, rather than a plastic thing. Once he was sucking my thumb for comfort lots of the time I'd express a tiny bit at a time and let him suck it off. Then once he was calmer I would swap for a nipple, having um got things started a bit. You need to break the association of your breast with stress and hunger and work on him associating it with comfort, even when not latched on. You need lots and lots of cuddles with your baby on your chest. Don't let your family hog them all!

It helps if you stimulate your nipple so that it's the right sort of shape for him to latch on to- erect, not flat otherwise he'll just find himself with a mouthful of flesh rather than a teat that he can suck from. Rather than trying to latch him on, if there's a bit of milk on your nipple he can lick it and get the idea that it's there. You could try stroking his lips up and down which stimulates the rooting reflex. (you can supposedly stroke their cheeks too, but that made my baby shake his head franticly which was no good.)

You can see if you can get him to do this with your thumb and with a bottle too, don't give him the milk unless he has opened his mouth for it. Your baby needs to make a bit of effort in feeding instead of simply having something put in his mouth for him.

I also think time was important. It sounds a bit silly, but I genuinely think that for the first month or so my baby's mouth was too little to cope with a big mouthful of areola, which is what they need to be able to feed correctly. I also found that once my supply settled down a bit he got the hang of latching on to a softer breast that I could manipulate more than a round hard one full of milk.

Do you think there are any physiological things that might be making it hard to feed? Look at the breastfeeding videos and see how you compare. Do you have small nipples, flat nipples or really big ones that might be causing your baby problems?

I think it's important to let go of any hangups about the way that you feed your baby. In some respects, the want to breastfeed can end up being sort of selfish, rather than in the baby's interests. Yes it's 100% the best thing for your baby nutritionally speaking, but don't put yourself and your child through hell to get there. Take each day as it comes, get breast milk into your baby in a bottle if that's what they need. Sometimes what they need isn't what all the information you're bombarded with tells you is the best thing for them. When that's the case you just have to be strong, practical and suppress your own feelings of guilt, put aside your expectations and play it by ear. Listen to what your baby is telling you, not what your leaflets are telling you. They will need a strong mummy who will do what's best for them, not a stressed grieving mum. The stress and heart ache will not help supply. He might latch on, hopefully he will, but you need to be able to seal with it if he can't/won't. Getting him feeding from the breast is the best scenario yes, but it's also not the end of the world if he doesn't. You will feed him and do what's best for him no matter what. If it's anyone failing at this breast feeding lark, it's him not you!

Babies eh, it's meant to be the most natural thing in the world, you stick your boob in, the milk comes out! If only it could be that simple!

makachu · 05/11/2012 23:21

Another positive, after having such a hard time I am actually really grateful that feeding methods have ended up quite flexible for me. I really appreciate that my baby will take a bottle as well as a breast feed so that I can sometimes manage to sleep for an hour longer while my DP feeds my baby. It's loads easier to go out and be confident that he's had enough, because I can breast feed him for half an hour over a coffee then top him up with a bottle more efficiently. If I couldn't do that I'd have to feed him for a whole hour or so, then he'd only want to feed even more. It's an unexpected advantage that came from all the problems :D

Zara1984 · 06/11/2012 02:30

Your post is wonderful makachu, thank you so much, it made a world of difference to me and DH after a truly rotten day Thanks

Lots of what you said made sense to me. My boobs are huge (size G) with very large nipples and he is smallish (7 lb 4). My DH the engineer is convinced mechanically there are problems on that front, and he thinks that mws saying it isn't an issue is bullshit.

The advice to try latch for 10-20 mins before feeding is definitely making him frantic very quickly. What is invariably happening is that he is screaming his head off before his bottle is even warm. Sad I think I will try feed him from the bottle straight off then try on the boob after a bit. Ie "let's make friends with booby" rather than (as mw said) "let him know its business time/no messing around".

What I don't get is that on Sunday he latched SIX times no bother but yesterday (and now) he has zero interest and just screams Confused and will happily guzzle the bottle.

Had a bit of a firm pep talk with myself tonight. At the end of the day, I have a happy healthy baby who is 100% chilled and easy about everything else really. My angst at not being able to breastfeed and its impact on me and my expectations of motherhood is a bit of a first world problem, really.

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makachu · 06/11/2012 09:54

I'm glad your feeling a bit better! If he managed to latch on Sunday I think it's really optimistic that he'll do it again! Keep up your supply and eventually he might surprise you :)

This time two weeks ago I had a very distressed baby shouting at my breast all tense and thrashing around, now I'm looking down at him feeding away happily, he is taking bottles for top ups but still wants to breastfeed to sleep afterwards even when he's full. It was worth waiting it out, it should never feel like a fight. Fall in love with each other and see how it goes. In a few weeks time he will be so much more interactive and it will be easier to tell what the hell it is he actually wants.

Londonmrss · 07/11/2012 11:14

Just thought of something I'm bloody grateful for. Towards the end of pregnancy (in fact really for most of pregnancy) I slightly lost control of my bladder- I was just constantly leaking a little bit. Immediately after birth, I regained total control of it! Just noticed that even though we were up every 3 hours with the baby, I only did one wee last night! Looks like all those pelvic floor exercises paid off.
In other news, we're managing to latch for around 10-15 minutes at a time (still with shield, but my nips are a bit flat so want to give her all the help I can) at the start of every feed, then topping up with expressed- so gradually increasing. I'm hoping that in a couple of weeks, when the nasty jaundice is all gone and we've had a bt more practice I won't have to express too much at all.
Hugs.

ThreeWheelsGood · 07/11/2012 15:34

This is such a good thread. I've been up and down all over the place already this week, almost decided to give up and use formula, then had really successful breastfeeding support session at hospital this morning.

Feeling motivated by midwife reassurance that practice makes perfect - some feeds will be better than others - and it's about how it feels not how it looks. if it doesn't hurt and baby is filling nappies, and putting on weight, then all is fine.

Good luck with it all everyone, it's so good to know i'm not the only one going through this, but I do feel for everyone having a hard time of it.

Orenishii · 07/11/2012 18:36

Hi all, there sounds like so many little victories lately, y'all should be very proud of yourselves :)

Can I ask for a little positivity...or reassurance...or something, feeling very low. I posted a thread because my confidence is shredded. MW came today to weigh DS at 11 days old...I've managed to EBF him for the last four days or so and he's only gained 20g. The MW gave no reassurance or help, except to express in addition to BFing. I feel like the success of EBF is very short lived...clearly he wasn't getting enough from me. Today he's fed nearly hourly instead of every two hours but I'm only able to express about 30ml in 30 minutes. I've cried a lot today, the MW just seems to be concerned with her charts and percentages though she did concede he looks well, has lots of wet and pooey nappies, his urine is clear and he is alert when awake.

We're going back to the BF clinic tomorrow as we can get the referral for the tongue tie, and get some actual reassurance/information that it's the tongue tie/latching issues that's maybe preventing him from gaining a lot of weight. Sometimes he rolls of the nipple with milk dripping from his mouth - hence I think he is getting some milk. Other times he just seems to suckle, and on the right nipple specifically he seems to only latch onto half of the actual nipple.

Zara1984 · 07/11/2012 19:42

orenishii I am sending lots and lots of hugs and hand holding your way. The important things for you to think of today are:

  • you have a PLAN - you are going to the clinic and you are getting a referral. Beats sitting around at home feeling sad, eh???
  • your baby looks well and happy! And acts happy! It's just the weight that's out of sync.
  • you love your baby and your baby loves you. Everything is going to be ok Smile
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Zara1984 · 07/11/2012 19:44

londonmrs that is a very worthwhile thing to be grateful for!!! Smile

I'm errr looser in that department since the birth...

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