10 weeks in - time to give up?

[Iggly]

I'm getting increasingly desperate and despondent about DD's BF issues that i want to stop. However we've got a history of reflux and dairy intolerance in our family (DS has it too), that I don't dare switch to FF.

DD suffers from terrible wind. It's fucking ridiculous. I think the biggest problem is an overactive letdown so she just Will Not Latch properly. I've been to a bf group and had a lactation consultant over to help. I know how she should latch on but as soon as she does, she slips back. Takes down loads of air then bam unsettled for ages.

She also has a Tongue tie. Bf group and LC weren't sure if it affected her feeding because it seems that she can extend it but given my letdown and oversupply, she doesn't need to as milk is not hard to come by. So I'm at a complete loss as to whether to get it snipped.

DD reacts to things in my diet. After I'd had chilli, she spent the early hours of the morning dry heaving and crying. Same with soy. Dairy, very windy.

Every night is spent wrestling with her between the hours of 1 and 6am as she wriggles, roots for milk, burps, farts (incredibly long loud ones) etc etc. He wakes every 90 mins, sometimes every 20 mins wanting a feed. Which she cannot stay still for let alone latch properly for, takes down shit loads of air and so it begins again.

Her latest thing is clamping down on my nipple and bending/twisting her head with nipple in mouth. She also rejected one boob for a bit - lord knows why. My right boob (her favourite) - the nipple feels bruised and battered the last couple of days from DD pulling etc etc.

I has no nipple pain when DD started feeding so didn't realise anything was up. She cried from birth, cried after latching on for the first time, never seemed satisfied (couldn't put her down in the hospital).

She always always is unsettled after every single feed without fail. She always takes down air.

I dont know what to do anymore. I don't get any sleep from 1am and I have a 2 year old so day sleep is not an option. I've cut things from my diet, I try every feed to latch her properly, I wind, she's on reflux meds. I've sought practical help... And it's just getting worse.

I don't expect anyone will have a magic answer - the LC didn't seem to know where to begin although help with the latch was useful to get so I know what to aim for. I don't know whether to get DS's tie snipped because no-one cam tell me if it's the problem. I worry that if I do and it doesn't work, I'll be gutted.

At this rate I'm hurtling towards PND if I havent got it already. I find myself dreading every feed and not wanting to feed DD as my boobs are doing so much harm. FF seems like the answer but I know DD will react to it and I'll have to fight for hypo allergenic stuff. After weeks of running between the GP, LC and bf group I don't have the energy for the fight.

Thanks for listening.

Im so sorry you are having such a shit time. Im not an expert, but hopefully one will come alomg soon to advise you

difficult one - one thing I would say, is that if you have oversupply, you can pump maybe and give her BM in a bottle, if all else fails? Get a hospital grade pump.

you don't HAVE to give formula, if you are still lactating and she will take a bottle.

does she take a bottle at all?

oh and {{{hugs}}}

its tough

You poor thing! Defo defo get Tongue tie snipped as it may help her latch properly and reduce the air intake. Have you tried feeding in the jockey position? May help (especially with fast letdown if you recline bit to slow the flow) Are you using colief? Infacol? Gripe water? To help bring up the wind? Bicycling legs alot? Baby massage for windy babies (think it's on google). Sorry if you tried all these suggestions just throwing them out there. Sounds very hard but doesn't sound like formula is the answer either. Is she any better at taking milk from a bottle? Breastflow bottles are fab -no nipple confusion and virtually no air intake. Good luck with it all.

Couldn't not post you sound like you're at the end of your tether.

Well done for lasting ten weeks though- dd1 was awful at feeding & I only lasted ten days!

I know what you mean re fighting for the hypoallergenic formula it took almost 8 months of dd2 with horrific excema before they said it was diet related & put her on nutramigen (still have two spare tins if you randomly live near me)

I was going to say the same about expressing if only to give yourself a break in the night maybe ?

Totally feel your pain I have a ten wk old & between night feeds & night wakings with the other 3 there has been several times where ive started my day at 2am on about two hours sleep..

I'm no expert but I seem to remember there is a bf position that is meant to really help with oversupply. I'll try andfind it but on my phone

Took so long someone else has suggest it.

don't know if you've tried this?

Firstly you've done bloody well to get to where you are

Soundss very hard - any one around to help at all? Tale older one out?

Thanks all I've tried everything except a bottle. DS had issues feeding and a bottle made his latch worse so I've held off for now with DD but we bought some yesterday so I'll try expressing and feeding that way.

I'm going to phone another lactation consultant to get DD's tie checked again. I think I'm going to just have to bite that bullet and get it snipped.

Luckily I've got help with my older one! Dh is off today thank god.

Some nights I think it's not so bad but waking up this morning, it feels all too much.

Bumping for the day shift experts

Have you excluded dairy from your diet. I know that this is controversial and some people say it works wonders and others that it is a load of rubbish, but it may be worth a try?

My DS had tongue tie that wasn't noticed. I only noticed it at about 6 months and was told he was too old for it to be snipped without a general anasthetic (spelling?) at that age. He had trouble latching and had terrible wind, but fed tonnes and grew like mad. I used infacol too. Now that I know he has lots of allergies I do wonder if my diet had any affect on him. With DD I was then told to avoid everything DS was allergic to while feeding her just in case. I did for 6 months and then on the advice of the DS's pead , re-introduced everything slowly again. I have no idea if it helped but she had no problems feeding and has no allergies.

can i suggest you see a cranial osteopath.

my baby was like that... she fed / cried / fussed / farted / slept looking uncomfy almost 24/7

the cranial osteopath said her gut was twisted or something form her birth... worked the magic and she is a different child... the most chilled / relaxed / easy to feed ever.

Having just had ds1's tt done at age 6yo, I would really urge you to consider getting it done now. There's nothing to lose really.

I didn't know for sure if he was tongue tied until fairly recently. We had problems feeding in the early days, if he wasn't latched on, he would cry. I think if we had had good help, the problems would have been less obvious, but nobody checked for tongue tie, and I had never heard of it until later.

He could extend his tongue and to the untrained eye, it wouldn't have looked tied at all. Somebody recently said to me "it's not what the tongue looks like, it's how it behaves". (pics on profile, although I appreciate a 6yo tongue looks different!!)

We got it operated on a few weeks ago and ds1 has come off his reflux medication and is basically a different child. I really wish that we had had the chance to get it done as a baby.

Milk matters has some really good info on this to help you decide

I can't offer much advice except to say my DD was very similar as a newborn ( no tongue tie though). She was screaming when she was born and continued almost constantly for the three days and nights we were in hospital. My DH and I spent her first week home taking it in turns staying awake at night holding her (she's my 6th baby, so no PFB either!) as it was the only way she'd sleep. I used to hold her for every sleep and not let anyone else take her as I was terrified she'd wake and the screaming/fussing/burping/farting would all start again. She wouldn't even go in her pram until about 3 mOnths old. She just 'grew out of it' all and is much easier now.

I'm not saying you have no problems, clearly you do and you've done incredibly well to get to ten weeks. Just that some of what you are experiencing can be normal newborn behaviour too. I hope you can get things sorted out.

Thank you again. maw I had a look at your sons Tongue - DD def has a tie and I'll have a proper look once she's awake to look again!
midori, yes I hold DD all night pretty much and she's jn the sling all day. I know that some behaviour is because she's tiny but some is just ridiculous. The wind she had last night - shocking.

I have cut out dairy (did the same for ds) and soya. Plus chilli makes DD very unhappy!

People have suggested cranial osteopathy before - thanks nanny

Thank you Kristina for bumping :)

I've phoned up the lactation consultant who specialises in Tongue tie so hoping to get her over ASAP. Bit nervous but I think I'll get it snipped anyway.

And thanks to the earlier posters - sorry I havent name checked - was a bit blurry earlier (still am!)

Some good advice here and don't have anything to add except to wish you luck as it sounds like you need a break.

My DS (3rd) is 16 weeks and the early weeks were tough as he has reflux and had to be held so much. He still has it but seems to do better at night now. Just wanted to let you know that things can improve fairly quickly and you get through - hang in there!

It really sounds like the TT is affecting baby and bfing. If you can get through to the LC and get an appointment to get it snipped things may well turn a corner (it might not be immediate though as she will have to relearn how to move her tongue).

Mawbroon - The pic of DS1's palate looks just like DD1/2/3's!! But they have a dip too....

Hi Truth I think you alerted me to the TT being a problem Oban earlier thread! Am hoping the LC can come quickly. However I was quite upset and annoyed by the last LC who came over and didn't seem to know if it was causing a problem and didn't consider my over supply as well. DD won't latch properly for she'll drown (although I've noticed my milk supply seems to be calming down - another worry as DD will now have to work hard for it which she isn't used to!)

Well what did the last LC think the wind, breast refusal, clamping down, v v frequent feeds, inability to stay latched on for the whole feed, slipping off during feeds, inability to be satisfied after a feed, etc, etc are due to??

It really sounds like TT snip and some time with an LC who can help you get baby to latch on and teach you the tongue exercises to get baby working her tongue will be a good thing. Fingers crossed you get seen very soon.

She thought it might be poor positioning and attachment. Or the tie. She said it was complicated. Yes DD didn't latch properly so she showed me how but DD would slip off even with the LC there. She wasn't sure if it was def the tie or my supply. By the end we agreed I'd work on positioning etc for a week then decide. I've been tackling the over supply alone with no advice. This is why I'm finding it hard because I don't know what I'm doing and I've not yet found the right solution(s)

Sounds like you're having a tough time of it!

Others have given you good advice which I hope helps. DD really benefited from infacol with her wind problems...might be worth a try?

Are you only feeding one side per feed? This is supposed to be best for over supply I think.

Yeah only one side for nearly all feeds Jnice. I tried one side per feed, DD still struggled. Then she went off one boob completely (although can sometimes get her back on and I express too to keep up supply).

Booboosto we've tried gripe but not infacol. Didn't work with DS so that's why but worth a shot hey! How long did it take to work?