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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Our TikTok - Famous :)

50 replies

organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 17:53

At the UNICEF conference you were mentioned as "MN's resident BFC" by Carrie of Mumsnet in her (awful) talk about "What Mothers are Talking About". She was very complimentary about you.

:) :)

motherpanda had a few quotes up as well!!

OP posts:
belgo · 26/11/2011 17:56

Very good. Do you have a link to this 'awful' talk?

organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 18:11

No, but I will see if they have published the slides when I get around to working through my stuff.

She spent half the time promoting Mumsnet, and nearly the other half talking about her own personal experiences, making comments that were just wrong about breastfeeding (to several hundred BFCs, IBCLCs, breastfeeding leads etc - many raised eyebrows). "What Mothers are talking about" was reduced to 6 or 7 slides of quotes plus some research which seemed to have been done some years ago which was just a MN survey. I think that 20 or 30 quotes, plus explanations of common threads and themes would have been extremely valuable to the HCPs there, would have been fantastic. I was so disappointed as I was really looking forward to that speaker.

When she was there answering questions the first question was why, if MN follow the WHO code, they have a bottle in their logo. She couldn't answer it - best she came up with was that it was a bottle of expressed milk. I thought she was going to get booed or slow hand clapped at that point. It was awful. If she'd not lost everyone before that, unfortunately she did with that question (and I'd heard lots of whispers from people around me during her talk pointing out the bottle on the logo so it seemed to be something that really bothered people).

Lots of complaints about it afterwards, with people saying that a company shouldn't have been allowed to promote themselves like she did in that forum. Personally I was just really sad that it was such an amazing opportunity, missed. Hundreds of HCPs who could have learnt what women REALLY are saying. And instead of them now recognising MN as a brilliant resource for them to learn from, the apparent mood was just animosity towards MN.

(You reading this, Carrie? You let MN down badly I'm afraid and it was a terrible shame as you could have done SO much good. And I'd still like a better answer to the logo question!!!).

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thebigkahuna · 26/11/2011 18:23

VERY surprised to here MNHQ referring to tiktok as "our resident breastfeeding councillor" given the revjustabout debacle and the recent DBF stuff.

tiktok · 26/11/2011 18:34

Hmmmm.....I was not there though I know plenty of other bfcs would be and other people from the bf world. Glad she said nice things about me :) but that is one scary audience to share anything about bf with, and you absolutely have to know your stuff. There will be people who are highly suspicious of the internet and its influence. Mumsnet is actually very good (I think) on bf and bf support, and refuse to take any formula ads, so I hope she mentioned this. But the response 'it's expressed milk in the bottle' is so not the point, and that audience will have thought it was a naive answer :(

Carrie did ask MN a week or so ago for some ideas about 'what women are saying' so she may have got recent ideas....but that audience already know what women are saying - the Baby Friendly Initiative was set up 15 years ago in order to improve HCP practice and consistency and anything that comes up on these boards is not really new to them. It may have been a crap idea for a talk in fact, and I had been Carrie, I would have asked for a different title!

A better title, and one Carrie could have spoken knowledgably on, would have been 'how women seek help with early parenting in an internet age' and she could be focussed on infant feeding issues in discussing this.

She could have said (maybe she did?) that women are using their iPhones and their lap tops hours after giving birth, in maternity wards staffed by midwives, saying 'please help me breastfeed'. She could have explained how quickly women do get help from an internet forum, at all times of the day and night; how women support each other; how the emotions embedded into infant feeding spill out into mumsnet bun fights...and so on.

That would have been better than what women are saying about bf, I think....

tiktok · 26/11/2011 18:37

I don't know about the revjustabout stuff and the DBF debacle....????

I am of course not a 'resident breastfeeding counsellor' really....I mean I am not on the payroll (!!) or anything, and I have no contract and I am free to disappear tomorrow :)

Happily, I could do so, 'cos I am far from the only person responding to bf stuff.

thebigkahuna · 26/11/2011 18:41

I think MN is a great resource for b/fing advice, mainly because of you tiktok. So I'm in no way casting aspersions on you by saying that.

I could exlain all the rev and DBF stuff, but it would take forever. Basically - MN have said on a few threads that no one here is a resident expert on anything, and that all posters are equal, even if someone is a professional in a certain area they aren't MN's official representative for it.

So I'm very surprised that MNHQ have used terminology that basically seems to contradict that stance.

As I say, absolutley no comment or criticism of anything you've ever done or said Tiktok, I'm just surprised as that statement jars with things they've said, some of it recently (banning of dogsbestfriend who is a bit of a dog expert)

MotherPanda · 26/11/2011 18:42

Me? Famous, awww....

What did I say?

rocksandhardplaces · 26/11/2011 18:44

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 18:47

Oh, she made it clear that you were not associated with Mumsnet, or paid by them, and that you were "simply" a passionate volunteer. It was very nicely put with complete clarity.

"Mumsnet is actually very good (I think) on bf and bf support, and refuse to take any formula ads, so I hope she mentioned this. But the response 'it's expressed milk in the bottle' is so not the point, and that audience will have thought it was a naive answer"

Yes, she did say that they didn't take formula ads, and discussed the history of this including where they DID take an ad in the early days but haven't done since. I think the problem was her claim to therefore be WHO compliant backfired with the logo query. Naive? That's putting it mildly TBH. People were CROSS.

"'how women seek help with early parenting in an internet age" yeah - well - actually I'd expected it to be this, and talking to people afterwards I was urging them to come on here and take a look around. I think it could be really valuable to them to understand better what's going on.

"She could have said (maybe she did?) that women are using their iPhones and their lap tops hours after giving birth, in maternity wards staffed by midwives, saying 'please help me breastfeed'. She could have explained how quickly women do get help from an internet forum, at all times of the day and night; how women support each other; how the emotions embedded into infant feeding spill out into mumsnet bun fights...and so on."

No, not at all, which is what I think would have really been better.

But "what women are saying", by picking some of the really common themes on here, could have clearly shown that EVERY DAY women are being let down in the same ways, all the time. This information would surely have been really useful to take back as evidence to commissioners.

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tiktok · 26/11/2011 18:48

Ah, I see....thanks for explanation :)

While absolutely not being 'resident expert' Carrie and the team do know who I am in RL and my credentials and have done for some time, so they know I am genuine....maybe the 'resident expert' line was a sort of throwaway quip??

organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 18:49

"So I'm very surprised that MNHQ have used terminology that basically seems to contradict that stance."

kahuna no, that's me not explaining what she said clearly, sorry. She was very clear that this wasn't the case. In fact she was questioned about whether we should have a paid BFing supporter here, given the importance (!) of infant feeding, and she replied that MNers don't want that, and it's not what MN is about.

Why did they ban the dog expert?

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pooka · 26/11/2011 18:50

???? rocksandhardplaces

Never seen anything remotely antagonistic or aggressive posted by tiktok. some other posters, yes (not sure if any are still around). But tiktok, no.

tiktok · 26/11/2011 18:51

rocks - I know who you are, we went through that at the time :( :(

Your distressed state was horrible for you, but I was not responsible for it.

PosiesOfPoinsettia · 26/11/2011 18:52

This is uncomfortable reading, carrie is lovely. For christ's sake be kind without her there would be no mumsnet.

organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 18:52

Or, she may not have used that phrase exactly... it was one of the first talks in two days of them so I can't remember the exact words!!

BUT, TT was mentioned as an expert who came onto these boards, was very well thought of, very helpful to women, could be trusted, was a volunteer and nothing to do with MN per se... that sort of thing!!

(aarrghh Grin)

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organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 18:54

posies sorry if you feel that. However, for whatever reason it was, the talk was as it was and the reaction was what it was. It was, like I said, a real missed opportunity, and she didn't do herself any favours at all. I'm sure I won't be the only one to give her that feedback given the general discussions afterwards. :(

I'm a big MN fan. I wish it had been better as I was really looking forward to people recognising how immensely useful it could be to HCPs.

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thebigkahuna · 26/11/2011 18:54

Oh I don't want to bring all the dog expert stuff up again - she was banned for breaching the talk policy as far as I know, not for being or presenting herself as an expert. It's just that that 'no resident experts stuff' was brought up by MNHQ on that thread very recently. But wasn't the core issue as far as I know.

Thanks for clarifying, I was just perplexed by the wording.

PosiesOfPoinsettia · 26/11/2011 18:55

Well As long as the criticism comes from a warm placeSmile.

CupOfGoodCheer · 26/11/2011 18:57

ouch, OP!

stillorsparkling · 26/11/2011 18:58

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 18:58

motherpanda A couple of quotes from you but I can't remember what exactly. Just normal posts quoted, nothing controversial!! I just recognised your username.

Interesting link because unless I totally misunderstood (which I could well have done) she was saying that the survey was from some years ago. Somewhat confusing!

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PosiesOfPoinsettia · 26/11/2011 18:59

Yy.

MerryMarigold · 26/11/2011 18:59

Tiktok is the reason I came to MN (in 2006). I had oversupply issues and when I googled it, MN came up. So I came on and asked about it...

Thanks Tiktok. I wouldn't be an addict without you!

PosiesOfPoinsettia · 26/11/2011 19:00

Yy to still.

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