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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

Our TikTok - Famous :)

50 replies

organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 17:53

At the UNICEF conference you were mentioned as "MN's resident BFC" by Carrie of Mumsnet in her (awful) talk about "What Mothers are Talking About". She was very complimentary about you.

:) :)

motherpanda had a few quotes up as well!!

OP posts:
thebigkahuna · 26/11/2011 19:00

Eeek.

Getting out of here before it kicks off.

Original poster
organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 19:05

still It could be interpreted that way. It CAN be really hard to counter individual complaints/criticisms of specific small and in themselves minor things. But it's cumulative I guess, and every part counts. The image was less important than the answer which was not good and caused ripples. :( I do agree with you that this is a real risk (of perception).

It WAS an ouch moment, cup. I'm just telling it like it is, at least from what I saw and people I spoke to. I am frustrated because I really, really thought it could be good.

OP posts:
MotherPanda · 26/11/2011 19:07

Organiccarrotcake - But perhaps it will still encourage those who were at the conference to come and have a peek at the board, and they will find out what we are all talking about.

Original poster
organiccarrotcake · 26/11/2011 19:11

panda I really hope so. I was doing my best to encourage people afterwards, and explaining a bit more about what they might find here, and how useful they might find it.

OP posts:
champagnesupernova · 26/11/2011 19:23

I wasn't there but i have heard Carrie speak about family friendly stuff and she does not strike me as someone who was wanting to push MN first and foremost.
Is it possible she was poorly briefed about the event?

Eglu · 26/11/2011 19:56

Did she not mention you OCC. I would say you are up there with tiktok. Both of you have helped me in the last few months.

rocksandhardplaces · 26/11/2011 20:15

"rocks - I know who you are, we went through that at the time

Your distressed state was horrible for you, but I was not responsible for it."

Classic.

You took absolutely no responsibility for some of your posting at that time. Yes, my distress was horrible for me and no, I haven't held you responsible for it. However, it is factually accurate to say that your words practically left me suicidal because you ill-advisedly mentioned serious consequences in a way that no professional ever would as you were piqued with some imagined insult to yourself in my "tone". You were then terribly affronted by my reaction and showed no empathy even when it was really clear that I was in serious real-life distress.

Many posters messaged me then and afterwards to say it was a dark hour for MN.

I simply said I am not surprised that there was a poor reaction to corporate adulation of an anonymous cyberfairy giving advice in an authoritative, professional way without knowing the full history of an individual. I don't agree with it. I know on another section of this board there was a complaint made about a midwife doing similar. I think Mumsnet should be mothers advising as mothers and not as specialists and I would be annoyed at hearing that anyone giving "specialist" advice was being used to advertise the site in this way.

However, that's not your responsibility either. Words on a screen and all of that.

coldcomfortHeart · 26/11/2011 21:32

Bit confused by the rocks and tiktok stuff, must have missed that one Confused

But what a pity that Carrie/MN missed a real opportunity. The bottle logo bothers me too (it's not a small up-arsey thing either) and I'm surprised she didn't see that question coming.

HCP are very suspicious of the internet and I think the advice on this board is on the whole very good, balanced, evidence based... and tiktok and organiccarrotcake and others who know what they're talking about are (when I've read their posts) at pains to advise people to get RL support, and caution that we can't know everything about a baby/mother/situation from a post.

Strong words in the OP, occ, but good to discuss it...

crikeybadger · 26/11/2011 21:58

Yeah, I don't know either coldcomfortheart, but I don't think this is the right thread for rock to discuss it on anyway.

Thanks for the update OCC- really interesting feedback.

PosiesOfPoinsettia · 26/11/2011 22:02

I think having experts that more often than not speak as mothers but have greater knowledge is brilliant for MN.

Rocks. It is bad form to drag this up on a different thread.

tiktok · 26/11/2011 23:25

The audience at Baby Friendly is not really breastfeeding counsellors - they are part of it, but it's mainly made up of professional infant feeding advisers, midwives, strategists, researchers plus people from overseas and so on....it's a leading annual event in the calendar. I don't think it's a harsh thing to say the audience would be a tough one where speakers have to know their stuff - that would be the same in any field, surely?

When you get a tough audience, some of them will focus on a matter (bottle in the logo) which others regard as far less important - and best advice is to prepare for that with a sharp, informed response (I think, yes?). It would be the same if you were speaking anywhere else. The whole of the audience will not have thought the same way about it, and many will have resented the discussion being dominated by it (if it was - I wasn't there).

Re the bottle logo - personally I think to focus on that is to refuse to see the wood for the trees, but other people regard the routine use of iconography of that sort to be highly significant. I am sure the brains at Mumsnet could come up with a response that acknowledged that somehow without agreeing with it - to say 'it could be expressed breastmilk' is lame, sorry.

tiktok · 26/11/2011 23:33

rocks, I really don't know what to say....I could link to the thread for others to judge but that would not be right. I am human, too. I never want to hurt people and I promise I do my best to help. But 'words on a screen' don't tell me when someone who asked for information from me in a straightforward way really did not want it, and was not in an emotional state to receive it. You lambasted me at the time; you clearly don't feel you did it enough. I too got support off-forum then.

If this is something you still feel strongly about, it would be better to report it, even these years later, rather than rehash it here.

tiktok · 26/11/2011 23:45

(BTW, rocks has name changed if any one is looking for the thread in question)

Greythorne · 27/11/2011 00:08

stillorsparkling

The logo showing the bottle is significant. I think you are naive if you think that brand logos do not function on a very visceral level with consumers. I think it is also vey patronising to say, oh, the lactivists, have they got nothing better to worry about. It is an important subject which is being treated seriously. The slow handclap is a very potent way of showing someone is way off the mark. I think it is perfectly valid and I am surprised you translate this into lactivists disappearing up their own arse. Dn't you think breastfeeding is a serious topic for serious debate and considered disccourse.

I do.

entropygirl · 27/11/2011 00:53

OCC oh dear that is a shame. I personally have found mumsnet a help with BF issues and I have seen a lot of other people helped too. Regarding the bottle logo thing I had noticed it previously (in fact the first time I came on) and I didnt think much of it but actually the overall feel of MN is a little anti-BF. Most of this comes from posts though which MN cant (and shouldnt) control.

I totally agree that a list of the top 10 most common questions would be illuminating (I personally cannot believe just how many people come here with exactly the same issues - to the point that you might struggle to fill a top 20 :))

I have tremendous respect for those of you who are on here day in day out giving the same advice!

tiktok · 27/11/2011 09:34

Trouble is, the top 10 questions woudn't be illuminating to that audience - they already know the issues facing women who want to bf, and the challenges and problems that stop them....

stillorsparkling · 27/11/2011 09:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Greythorne · 27/11/2011 11:10

And talking about fundamentalism with regards to breastfeeding makes me think that you are the one taking it all a bit too seriously.

Fundamentalism?
Crazed?

coldcomfortHeart · 27/11/2011 11:56

I see your point about woods for trees tiktok, and agree that iconography isn't as important as other issues in the infant feeding world. But I'm amazed that Carrie hadn't thought ahead and prepared an answer for that question...

MN is a fantastic resource for bf mothers, but it's also a clear indicator of problems in the real world, as evidenced by posts from the postnatal ward.

entropygirl · 28/11/2011 14:11

Oh I didnt mean that it would be news to them which problems people have just that it might be news to them just how many people are getting the wrong or no advice even on the dead simple things. Maybe that also isnt news to them....

tiktok · 28/11/2011 14:21

Probably not news to them, you're right, entropygirl. The Baby Friendly Initiative is all about promoting good professional practice and offering training in it - they absolutely know that many HCPs are still not getting it right, in hospital and in the community. So the conference attenders know the top problems :(

cloudydays · 28/11/2011 22:33

Surely there's a kinder way to give constructive criticism? The wording of the OP and the second post is really unneccesarily harsh.

You reading this, Carrie? You let MN down badly I'm afraid and it was a terrible shame as you could have done SO much good.

FFS - never had a bad day at work, OP? Would be great to be publicly shamed for it at the office, wouldn't it?

shygirlinthecorner · 30/11/2011 11:39

I am of course not a 'resident breastfeeding counsellor' really....I mean I am not on the payroll (!!) or anything, and I have no contract and I am free to disappear tomorrow Happily, I could do so, 'cos I am far from the only person responding to bf stuff.

ah, but not all the advice is accurate! Mumsnet does need you!

tiktok · 30/11/2011 11:47

Kind of you to say so, but I am not infallible :) :)

RitaMorgan · 30/11/2011 12:03

Rocks I remember your original thread and am sorry you still feel upset about it. Asking a question on a forum is a bit like googling symptoms - if you are feeling fragile then it is best not to do it! Unfortunately no one can tell the mental state of another poster unless it is stated explicitly.

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