Tongue tie. Very upset. Please help me get through the next week

[GoodVibrations]

DD2 5 days old has tongue tie. My nipples looks like they have been slashed with knives and are full of scabs (that fall off and make feeding even more excrutiating). We have an appointment to have it snipped next week but I am going mad with pain and tiredness.

Latch is initially really good (I bf DD1 until 22 months, plus have had lactation consultant helping me this time) but then DD2 slips off/ chews nipple. Taking her off (finger in corner of mouth to release suction) is even more painful.

We are trying & failing to syringe feed. DD obviously hates it and spits it out/ cries. It also gives her terrible wind so she cries most of the time. Cup feeding did not work either. Have now been told I may have to use teats but really worried this will impact breastfeeding.

I have had 10 hours of very broken sleep in 6 nights. I haven't left the house since the birth. I spend all day with my baps out to get air to the nipples to help them heal. I'm using vaseline and rubbing nips with milk after a feed/ express.

Currently expressing every 3 hours and trying to bfeed when I feel brave enough.

Now I've typed all that I'm not sure what help I want . I suppose any advice on cup/ syringe feeding, impact of bottle feeding and some general kind words to help me get through :)

That's great about the cancellation GoodVibrations - good luck.

Maybe this is something else Mumsnet should run a campaign on!

My daughter was tongue-tied. None of the NHS staff noticed it (even when specifically looking for one) as it was posterior. A lactation consultant from LLL diagnosed it, and it was divided at 10 weeks.

For the first week I expressed and cup fed as she couldn't latch at all, then after that she was very inefficient and I was in pain. One week her latch was so bad (particularly at night) I sat there and screamed/cried/swore through several hour-and-a-half-long night feeds as it hurt so much. You'd have thought it would put her off, but no, she just kept on chewing...

All better now though, so look forward to Friday :)

There are many previous threads about tongue tie and some of the stories are awful.

I read somewhere that some doctors regard snipping a tongue tie as a cosmetic procedure and therefore will not do it. If it interferes with BF then they consider using a bottle as a good alternative ( which it is)

But stories like Kestryn's show it is indeed about 'more than feeding'

Hang in there goodvibrations, I know it's tough when BF is not going well. I would say don't worry too much about nipple confusion, just do what you need to survive and stay sane until then. Don't worry about leaving the house - just rest rest rest if you can. We had to bottlefeed our DD EBM and formula and a BFing clinic advised using a slowflot teat and putting DD on her side to feed (lie baby on a pillow - on your lap - on her side, put a cloth underneath her face to catch dribble, and put the bottle in sideways, tilting the bottle - not her - as she drinks). Maybe ask the midwife or a BFing counsellor about this? Supposedly it's a way to bottle feed that doesn't interfere with BFing (because of the positioning?).

Hope the TT snip makes a difference :) (and yes, it's over in seconds and she'll be fine - just don't look!)

Hi, I was another mummy of a tongue-tied baby!

Well done on getting the cancellation, that's great news :)

DS couldn't latch on at all until his had been snipped, so you are doing incredibly well. I expressed like a crazy woman and could only bottle feed him expressed breast milk until he was a week old, but we still managed to establish breastfeeding in the end.

For the pain, I recommend warm baths with lavender oil (helps other bits as well!), blow drying nipples with a cool hairdryer (seriously) and applying lansonil. Done as soon after feed as possible so there's time to dry properly before the next one (she says optimistically). If no time for a bath, a towel soaked in warm water and lavender oil instead... again followed by hairdryer and lansonil. Soluble panadol safe while bf and I always found it quick and effective.

Prolonged feeding with a poor latch can cause more serious problems, so don't feel like it's some sort of resilience test - watch out for any lumps or red patches and give a bottle feed if you feel it's right. My tough time was later on but if I could go back and do it again, I'd stop beating myself up about it and replace the endless evening feed with a bottle to give myself a break. It's important that you look after yourself too. The pain might not get better immediately after the snip, but feeding should improve straight away, particularly if you've got support from a lactation consultant.

I'm sending a huge hug even though it's not really done on here.... there were times when I thought I would pass out from the pain but I wanted to keep feeding my baby and it was just horrible.

I agree with ASAP. Both my ds2 and ds3 were tt. Ds2 was done after 3 days, no issues, bf happily til 15 months. Ds3 couldn't get appt til 3 weeks and it has been a nightmare. Have had to pretty much switch to formula now at 7m as he was dropping off the lowest percentile. They should do it at the bloody postnatal check!

Dont worry, just get it done aspa and will be fine, good luck!

Glad you've got a cancellation, the improvement is immediate in my experience!

I used a mixture of nipple shields, expressed milk in bottles and screaming to get through my 2 week wait. No nipple confusion with my little one.

Have just realised that my advice contradicts truthsweet 's.... I was under the impression that they needed to dry but it makes sense about the scabs.

Ugh it's grim isn't it, good luck for Friday, it will get better!

noisylurker - that's fine it worked for you and you were passing your tip on. It's what MN is best at

In general though keeping nipples dry is good if they are 'just' sore but not if they are shredded/open cracks/wounds they need the moist wound healing to help stop scabs forming.

Normally scabs are absolutely fine to form over a wound, they help to protect the skin underneath from bacteria and to help promote skin formation. Luckily breastmilk contains both an anti-microbial protein (Lactoferrin) and also contains Epidermal Growth Factors which have been attributed in helping the nipple to repair itself.

Don't give up! Dd had tongue tie that was snipped at 5 weeks. Before that really struggled with the pain and everything. Found the avent nipple shields were brilliant, didn't affect my milk supply at all and now 11 months later still bf. I would give them a try if I were you, for me it was the difference between giving up bf and succeeding. Good luck, hope you can get the procedure done before too long! Xoxo

Very very glad to hear you've got a cancellation.

At the risk of stating the obvious - Friday is still a lot of feeds away - so please please don't feel like you have to endure this. Express and bottle feed as much as you can, or use nipple shields - its really important to minimise the damage so you can have the best chance of recovery and successful bf afterwards.

Good luck.

own tongue at the sheer arrogance of doctors who assume this isn't something that needs to be checked for

eek, not sure what happened there

meant to type

Just to let you know that we had the tongue tie snipped today. The change to her tongue movement was amazing! First couple of feeds were so much better.

Unfortunately now she is coming on and off the breast constantly and is really fretful. Noticed she has white spots on the roof of her mouth, so it seems we now have thrush to deal with. As it's weekend now we can't even get to the docs until next week. Am gutted. I know it's only a small hurdle but I am so fed up with being in pain and just want to feed my baby :(

Fantastic news (first bit)

Re the thrush - have you got a walk in clinic or a HV you can call? Failing that I think an out of hours gp visit wouldn't be unreasonable, given what you're having to deal with?

Out of hours GP would be good or can hospital help? Midwife? NHS Direct might be able to advise you.

How rotten, you must be exhausted.

So glad there is an improvement :) I would definitely try the out of hours doc (you can get the number by calling your normal GP - the number should be on their answering machine).

Alternatively, as your DD is still so young, are you still under a midwife's care? If so, can you call them or your local maternity unit?

Really brilliant that you're over the first hurdle though. Just hope you get the thrush sorted quickly.

glad the tongue tie has been snipped :)

Def go to OOH, or are you still able to go back to the antenatal ward where you had her (if in hospital). I was able to do that - can't remember what they called it - for one month after my baby was born and they would help me. They can also do prescriptions when other places would be shut iyswim

oh sorry, see I have just repeated everyone else
Having got through tongue tie and noticed an improvement it would be such a shame if your thrush couldn't be treated

Thrush being treated but I now have mastitis. Had a bad couple of days where I felt really ill but on anti-biotics now so hoping to see an improvement soon. All of these problems seem to have been triggered by the tongue tie, as my nipple was so badly damaged it was open to infection, plus I was expressing which has led to an oversupply/ engorgement. All could have been avoided if the tongue tie was snipped at birth.

I have managed to get through this week though so think I can handle anything after this!! Thanks for all your support.

You poor thing. I had a similar situation, but it all happened later for me because we were using nipple shields at first (the only way he could latch).

I cannot recommend trying them strongly enough at this stage. It can prevent reinfection of the thrush, allowing that to heal (you'll be sterilising them), will give your nipples a chance to mend, and reduces the effects of a bad latch therefore reducing the chances of mastitis.

Honestly, I know how exhausting and emotional and bloody painful it is and you have my sympathy. Hopefully things have improved in the last couple of days.

My baby is 10 days old and had his tongue tie snipped on day 3 thanks to a very good midwife arranging it at a local cottage hospital. We spoon fed until then which our baby didn't mind though was very messy. We give him maybe 2/3 bottles too, one of which was after the procedure as he was learning how to latch. I found the bottles may have been beneficial after the procedure in teaching him how to suck which I don't think he knew how to before. It was if he was just chomping and grinding on my nipple, very painful. Also, he hardly opened his mouth to be able to take my nipple.

Now, it is much better, I've not given him a bottle since and he is a master feeder! I do still have some discomfort as my milk is still coming in but hopefully we'll ride it through. Good luck, hopefully you'll find things much easier soon.

Just to add my little bit to the pot, not sure if anyone else mentioned it but when I had my daughter, my mum gave me these nipple shields made of silver (I know it's weird but hang in there), not sure if they are available in the UK, maybe online, but the bottom line is that by keeping them on day and night (with some boob-airing in between), my cracked nipple healed in two days, and I had spent three weeks applying lanoline and st john's wort oil religiously after each feed to no avail. I passed them on to my friend and she can't sing their praises enough. It's like a miracle. I think the silver deflames and disinfects, and also it offers a nice protection against the rubbing of the breast pads. Hope this helps a bit, good luck x

lou - were they [http://www.breastfeedingheaven.co.uk/breastfeeding-products/silverette-healing-cups/prod_138.html these]]?

Sorry these