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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

Newborn has lost more than 10% of birth weight - we have til Monday

197 replies

FingonTheValiant · 15/10/2010 21:14

I've posted a few times about 5 day old DS who is really not feeding well. He was weighed today and he's lost 380g since Sunday. The midwife said she wasn't going to "rush me through a&e to the paediatricians just yet", but said she'll come back on Monday pm to reweigh him, and if he hasn't gained enough he'll be hospitalised, and that the paeds will then insist he has formula top ups :(

I'm desperate to avoid this, but I'm now stressed beyond rational thought.

Also, he's refusing one breast completely (screams, flails, kicks etc) and I'm in agony on the other side. I know that that means he's latching badly, but he is drinking, and with a weight gain ultimatum I don't want to interrupt the feeding he's actually doing.

They've told me to wake him and feed him every two hours. But he spends the first 30-40 mins of that fussing/screaming and not feeding, and by the time I've calmed him and got him on and fed I only have 40 mins before we're meant to start again.

They also said I have to top him up with a cup after each feed, so I've bought an electric pump to help with that. But he wont cup feed properly - he doesn't stick out his tongue, he just gulps at it and hits the cup, and half of it is wasted.

How do I fix this mess? I just want to curl up with my baby and cry forever :(

OP posts:
Guacamole · 22/10/2010 21:29

Thank you sophable...
I think the OP is doing brilliantly. I just want to let her know that if she ends up topping up with formula it doesn't mean she's failed in anyway and in my experience it didn't effect my breastmilk supply and I am happily still breastfeeding now.
Good luck OP, I know exactly what you're going through and you're doing really well.

Original poster
FingonTheValiant · 22/10/2010 21:33

He breastfeeds loads anyway, he's been cluster feeding in the evening and normally is on the breast for between 20 and 60 mins the rest of the time. He's feeding enough that he empties and comes off the breast himself and goes to sleep.

I have tons of milk, it's literally pouring out (I often wake up on a wet patch). And his latch no longer hurts when he's feeding, so that's much better- although his comfort sucking does hurt.

So they (the midwives, paeds and the breastfeeding adviser at the hospital all agree on this one) want me to give him three bottles of EBM so that I can guarantee that he's having X amount a certain number of times a day. So yes, it's the classic "don't trust how much he's getting".

OP posts:
Original poster
FingonTheValiant · 22/10/2010 21:37

Guacamole, thanks for posting about your DS, it's great to know that it can work out well. Glad to hear he's doing so well.

He's doing 4-5 pooey nappies a day and loads of wet ones, and the midwife says he's not dehydrated, so all signs, bar weight, point to him being ok. It's so frustrating.

OP posts:
RubyBuckleberry · 22/10/2010 21:42

it sounds like you are doing fantastically well and yes, it does sound like it is the classic "don't trust how much he is getting" thing. is he getting the same amount of milk than from a bottle of EBM, even if it takes him longer. is he feeding well? is he drinking the milk? does he get a good bellyfull do you think? can you hear him swallowing?

apart from someone who knows what they are talking about helping you out in RL, these are the things he needs. he needs milk, and lots of it, so he can grow. (i'm sure you know this, sorry!)

anyway, fwiw, my DS had a bottle of EBM every other feed for about a week and i am happily bfing him at 12months. Just give him the expressed milk, feed him when he wants it but if he falls off, satisfied, and goes to sleep, that is great! if he passes out because he is not getting any milk and is getting tired and is trying to conserve energy, that is a worry. i'm sure you will be able to tell by looking at him. hang in there!

RubyBuckleberry · 22/10/2010 21:44

"He's doing 4-5 pooey nappies a day and loads of wet ones, and the midwife says he's not dehydrated, so all signs, bar weight, point to him being ok."

You are doing absolutely fine, just hang in there!!!

RubyBuckleberry · 22/10/2010 21:44

he's busy feeding and growing, it sounds like!

gaelicsheep · 22/10/2010 21:44

I agree ruby, if Fingon's DS was too sleepy to feed properly, creating a vicious cycle, then I could see where they're coming from. But he sounds happy and healthy so I'm Confused. Anyhow, Fingon, I don't want to make you feel even worse. I'm very sad and frustrated for you. Sad

gaelicsheep · 22/10/2010 21:49

x posted Smile

crikeybadger · 22/10/2010 21:50

How annoying and upsetting Fingon- it sounds like everything had improved and DS is clearly ticking all the boxes of being a healthy baby (except for the weight one).

The deadline to reach birthweight by Monday must just put extra pressure on you which you don't need.

On the plus side, your milk supply sounds plentiful and it's good that you have no pain when feeding.

If you do end up back at the hospital I'd be interested to hear what they recommend. It sounds like you are doing everything you can-lots of frequent feedings and skin to skin. Maybe he's just a little slow to gain weight?

Keep us posted won't you. Smile

Original poster
FingonTheValiant · 22/10/2010 21:50

He's feeding well, I can hear him swallowing yes. I'm fairly certain he's full as he's lying here awake next to my breast and not doing any rooting etc even though he has the energy to have a wriggle. He's got lots of energy and he's really strong, so I'm sure he's not trying to conserve it.

I let him feed whenever he wants, but he only roots etc about every 3 hours, he's just not interested any more often than that. We co-sleep skin to skin, and although he wont feed lying down at the mo, he still doesn't seem to be hungry any more often than 3 hourly.

Glad your DS is still bf now Ruby, even with ever other feed being bottle. DS has been having two bottles a day for the past week and still latches, so I'm hoping one more a day wont be a problem.

Thanks for all your encouragement :)

OP posts:
RubyBuckleberry · 22/10/2010 21:52

i know Confused a bit too! keep going fingon. breastfeeding can be such a leap of faith sometimes and they do have to be careful with members of the public lolol a few days of expressed bottles and lots of feeding will do no harm only good anyway... expressing will remove the milk and encourage production and lots of suckling will encourage production too. good luck!

gaelicsheep · 22/10/2010 21:54

My DD had one, two, occasionally three bottles (of formula) a day (including at night) for 12 weeks! We've been EBF for the past six weeks. Hang in there!

RubyBuckleberry · 22/10/2010 21:56

absolutely fingon, no problem with my ds at all. he was milk tongue tie, i was cracked, i had to let it heal for a week and then had to be really strict with the latching on. he just got bigger and stronger and then it wasn't a problem, and i just stopped the bottles. he just carried on bfing. as soon as the nipple healed we just bfed normally.

you are doing so well it sounds like - awake and having a wriggle, co-sleeping. he must be getting a good bellyfull to be going three hours. he's probably gearing up and will gain momentum and before you know it, it will be a total growth spurt!

RubyBuckleberry · 22/10/2010 21:56

milk tongue tie?? mild tongue tied

Original poster
FingonTheValiant · 22/10/2010 21:56

x-posted with lots of you, sorry!

He's definitely not too sleepy to feed, he's really bright when he's awake, and practically launched himself at me from dh's arm earlier he was so excited.

The deadline is a total joke, there's no way he'll gain 295g in a few days, even the mw said it was impossible. I cant imagine what they'll tell me to do differently in hospital.

My cousin came to see us today and she's a paediatric nurse at GOSH. She actually laughed out loud when I told her they wanted to hospitalise him, she said he looks completely fine to her. Gah, bloody weight issues! If he'd just gain some we'd be sorted.

OP posts:
gaelicsheep · 22/10/2010 22:01

How old is he now?

RubyBuckleberry · 22/10/2010 22:03

also for the midwife to say he has to gain 295grams by monday is a bit ridiculous. you want to see a firm increase in weight gain surely but she is asking him to put on way above the average for those babies that gain loads anyway which is possible but unlikely and totally unrealistic Hmm

i've just worked out she is asking him to put on 10oz by monday - did she actually say that?

RubyBuckleberry · 22/10/2010 22:04

x posted

RubyBuckleberry · 22/10/2010 22:05

what a bloody nightmare, you poor thing. its bonkers isn't it!

Original poster
FingonTheValiant · 22/10/2010 22:08

I really hope that's the case Ruby - fingers crossed!

It's doubly annoying as there was some debate about whether his birth weight was actually right (he was a HB and weighed on old fashioned stork scales), but just when they were starting to say that possibly he hadn't actually lost as much as they thought, they now have proof that he's gaining too slowly and we're back under pressure :(

You've reassured me hugely about the bottles Ruby and g-Gaelic, thank you.

OP posts:
Original poster
FingonTheValiant · 22/10/2010 22:11

Gah, x posted again.

The paeds said 295g by Monday, although I don't think they actually worked it out, I think they arbitrarily decided he needed to be back at birth weight by Monday. I'm hoping we'll get away with just weight gain, rather than the full amount.

He'll be two weeks on Sunday.

OP posts:
mamatomany · 22/10/2010 22:11

I got told a similar load of rubbish that we'd have to got to hospital if my DD hadn't reached a certain weight by x date. We got there and the hospital asked if she was weeing and pooing, we said yes and then got sent home like we were the idiots who wanted to come in.
You realise you don't have to do anything don't you ?
I wish I'd told my HV to get stuffed in the nicest possible way.

Original poster
FingonTheValiant · 22/10/2010 22:15

I know, but I feel like they have me over a barrel. If I refuse to take him to hospital they'll make me feel like I'm endangering him, even though I'm fairly certain he's just off to a slow start. My cousin said that if we took him to GOSH and said we were worried they'd laugh us back out the front door...

I wish he was my second or third, then I'd have the balls to tell them to get stuffed.

OP posts:
FrozenNorth · 22/10/2010 22:20

Sorry if this question has been answered already but have the hospital done pre and post-feed weigh-ins? Has all the weighing been done on the same set of scales? If so, how recently were the scales calibrated? The last couple of questions are worth asking because the margin of error for the scales they use, as a percentage of a young baby's birthweight, is actually quite large. DOI: I weigh children as part of my research and calibrate every week. My health visitor's scales hadn't been calibrated for over a year when she gravely informed me that DD1 hadn't gained in a week. Turned out she'd gained 6 ounces when weighed on an appropriately accurate set of scales.

mamatomany · 22/10/2010 22:21

Nobody can make you feel like anything, you are his mother and more to the point your qualified cousin has seen him, bring that up on Monday if they start pushing you towards the hospital. Or could you say fine the hospital we are going to is GOSH to see my cousin ?
My worry as yours probably is the moment you walk into hospital they start warming the bottle of formula.