Where in the country is there a lack of support for breastfeeding ?

[smallvoice]

Can I just ask where those who say there is no support for breastfeeding live ?

From the moment I walked into my dr's surgery bottle feeding was never mentioned as an option. When it really mattered (ie not when I was watching eastenders or playing with my dolls-see threads surrounding the Milupa debate), there was an overwhelming amount of information available about breastfeeding. I never asked about bottlefeeding but a friend of mine in a different area who has very valid psychological reasons for actively deciding to bottlefeed was told by her antenatal midwife that she was not allowed to provide any information or give any advice re bottle feeding.

As it happened after the birth I was severely anaemic, with no energy or physical resources to draw on, and had a baby with a tongue tie who found it difficult to get milk from me and therefore did not stimulate my low production. Breastfeeding was incredibly difficult. I made the decision to bottlefeed with no support or information. I found this lack of support on such an emotional issue very difficult. In the breastfeeding debate it is often said that every woman is free to make her own decision as long as its informed. In fact as its almost impossible to make an informed decision as, at a time when women aren't free to do lots of their own research, there is a distinct lack of any information...When I asked questions not one professional could give me any actual figures or refer me to any material about the options I was trying to weigh up - they could only repeat the generalisations re breastfeeding which I could see on any poster. I assume these are based on studies and statistical facts but I wasn't able to assess any of the risks.

If I had been absolutely determined to breastfeed I could have turned to midwives, the health vistors, workshops, drop in clinics, helplines, books, mumsnet, plus any of the women I met in my antenatel/post natal groups who, with one exception, are all breastfeeding.

Instead whenever I walked into the drs surgery, had a conversation with a health visitor, logged onto mumsnet or even picked up the box of formula I was reminded that breast is best. I don't have a problem with any of this and I plan on trying again next time but do wonder where those who complain that there is no support for breastfeeding live and does anyone agree that in this debate some of the statistical back should be more readily available through health professionals?

PS 3 months on I'm very confident about my decision and its just one of many I will make as a parent...sometimes I'll fall on the right side of the statistical probabilities and sometimes not.

Message withdrawn

I had excellent support in Scotland, but that was part of a drive as the ocal rates of bf were so poor. I did bf, at leats in part for 4 months but had major problems with supply

In the east midlands with ds things did not seem to be as good, but that could have been because I was a second time mum and resources were concentrated on first time mums. I also bf him is part of 4 months and had major problems with supply

I had dd in Pontefract (West Yorks) but actually lived in Wakefield (still same county).

I had no support with BF. A BF counsellor came in to help me after the birth for around 10 mins but was called away as the Labour ward was very busy that night. I was really struggling with it and sadly I never saw the BF counsellor again.
Anyway, I was given the ultimatum of either BF or bottle otherwise until you've shown us that your baby will feed you shan't be leaving hospital. Needless to say I made the desicion to bottle feed.
When I got home I was given no other support with it, it was never mentioned again by the Midwives or HV's.
I was happy with my desicion and I never regretted it.

However, we have now moved to Barnsley in South Yorks, so it's only 15 miles from our old home.
The last time I had been to the GP's there was a poster advertising a BF support group which was held every week at 2 different parts of our village. It was even advertised in our local mini supermarket.
I was so gobsmacked and very pleased that support was offered.

When I do eventually have No.2 I will seriously consider BF as I know that this time there will be more support for me.

When I was pregnant with DS, I went to NHS antenatal classes (this was Feb 2004). They covered breast and bottlefeeding in a very non-threatening, impartial way. The midwife taking the class was excellent, really friendly, approachable, etc. She said it was silly to deny people information about bottlefeeding, even though "the NHS" recognised that breastfeeding was best.

When I had DS, not one of the hospital's "supporting breastfeeding practices" was followed. I know this because six months after I had him, I went back to the hospital to talk to the head of midwifery and the midwives manager about their lamentable lack of support. I had my own experience, that of a close relative and numerous people I'd met since I'd had DS to draw from. My relative's little boy was bottlefed after being given bottles on the postnatal ward, totally unnecessarily, since he was a very good weight, totally healthy and just a bit sleepy post-delivery.

With DS, I was left to get on with it. After he was born and I was still on the labour ward, I was not helped to position him (as the hospital states I should have been). In fact, I was not told anything about breastfeeding him (as the hospital stated I should have been). It was all over my notes that I wanted to breastfeed, but nobody mentioned it to me.

In fact, the day I spent on the postnatal ward was totally vile. I was shouted at by one midwife who had left her keys on my table (I'd not noticed them, she thought I should have done as she'd been looking for them...!), and everyone else but one midwives assistant ignored my requests for help with feeding DS. And that assistant simply shoved my boob in DS's mouth and told me that was how you did it (it wasn't!).

The head of midwifery looked down the list of staff who had attended me (in the hope that some were agency staff) - but they weren't. They decided to have a reflective session where they talked about proper breastfeeding support for women. And they acknowledged that women post-delivery wouldn't be happy to stand in a corridor and read posters about breastfeeding (which they had been very proud of having, until I asked how they were really any use...! I asked politely, of course!).

Since DS was born, I have had a number of health professionals express surprise, disdain and concern that I am breastfeeding. Now, I don't want to be patted on the back for it, but when presented with a smiley, thriving, healthy baby, who happens to be a little on the light side (even though chubby and bonny - not quite sure how DS manages that!), why do HVs frown and fret so much?

I have had top-ups and mixed feeding suggested to me on various occasions and one GP was horrified I was still breastfeeding a one-year-old (when I told him the WHO recommended at least two, he was incredulous and said, "But...they bite, you know!").

I never spoke to a breastfeeding counsellor while I was struggling in the first couple of months. This was not because I was unaware of their presence, it was because I am bloody stubborn and wanted to learn how to do it myself. For stubborn, read stupid, I suppose...!

As far as being reminded constantly that breast is best, if you are in the thick of baby things, this will be the case. Should it not be?

Dammit, knew I'd forget something!

The hospital I had DS in wants to employ an infant feeding specialist - who will be able to offer unbiased advice about breast and bottlefeeding to new mums. Unfortunately the powers that be won't fund the post, because it's not a priority

I'm in Dorset. My support on the post-natal ward was the night nurse getting the hump with me because I'd dragged her away from the internet, grabbing dd's head and my boob and shoving the two together, before turning on her heels to get back to the nurses station.

In the community, the midwife told me everything was fine, dd was feeding. Yet she was loosing weight rapidly and didn't stop crying. I telephoned the on-call midwife who didn't visit, but gave telephone advice which was to expect to be like an animal and lie in bed all day and feed.

By day 5 I was at my wits end. I'd hardly had any sleep since before going into labour, it felt like dd had cried constantly since she was born, the midwife was concerned about her weight and I was wishing I hadn't had her. The midwife suggested formula and I have never felt such relief.

Maybe if I'd had mumsnet then I may not have given up so early, I might have gone and sought out the support I needed, although I still have no idea whether we have counsellors, etc around here. Certainly none of the professionals gave us information about them.

Very good support here in Weymouth from health visitors, midwifes and GPs but still come across a few that are unsupportive. Not health visitors or midwives but a couple of GPs and two of the breast consultants I had to c after having an abscess. You would think that breast consultants would know there stuff and be supportive but out of the three I saw only one of them was kind, understanding and supportive! I wish that all areas of the country had the kind of support that Ive had access to, it is vital when dealing with such a personal thing

Surfermum where abouts in Dorset are you? I have to say when I was on the maternity ward the support wasnt as good but has been excellent in the community!My problem in hospital was everyone decided to go into labour at the same time!!!!I am sorry you had a bad experience

Smallvoice, I think it's pretty difficult to get that kind of detailed, specialist information out of frontline health professionals on a lot of topics, including pregnancy and birth. It's out there on the internet, but you aren't likely to get it off your HV.

I'm just thinking a little more about the 'lack of information re bottlefeeding' train of thought.

Every ante-natal book,magazine or NHS document I was given listed the pros and cons of each.

'As far as being reminded constantly that breast is best, if you are in the thick of baby things, this will be the case. Should it not be?'

Yes definately Hunkermunker I agree - I did say I didn't have a problem with this at all. I fully hope to bf next time and part of my problem was not even looking into the debate when I was pregnant as I had no intention to bottlefeed which is why I was at such a loss when it came to making a decision whislt experiencing the most confusing mess of emotions I've had in my life. Sometimes people assume that once you start bottle feeding you're on easy street but I'm sure like me many women are still in lots of turmoil (took me a good few weeks to look back and feel confident that I'd done the best thing in the circumstances). I was just suprised to see so many posts in the last few days re lack of support for breast feeding when my experience was that in my area (SW London) there seems to be good support but a great big barrier when you start asking questions about bottle feeding. It seems from these messages that the NHS is far from consistent throughout the country.

My own midwives and hv were fab when I was trying to breastfeed and I have no complaint with them..My problem wasn't technique as such..in the first 2 or 3 days we were fine. I was very weak but the midwives showed me a lying down position that worked but when my son started to become properly hungry I had very little supply and then his tongue tie was making it difficult for him to get milk easily so he was not stimulating my supply at all and wanted to feed literally constantly. He found it easiest if I stayed lying down and I started to get spasm-like pains from being in the same position for so long and things just deteriorated. I started expressing but wasn't producing enough and was meanwhile feeling physically worse to the point where they wanted me back in hospital. The midwives never once suggested formula, helped me with expressing and were reassuring about his weightloss (they only told me later that they had set a deadline for him to start gaining..they didn't want to panic me into stopping while I was still trying).

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I got so much support it was untrue. I really wish everybody could have the experience I did. I never considered formula as an option despite the fact it was very tough at the beginning. My midwives and hv in particular were fantastic but so were the helplines I rang and the local breastfeeding mums group. Stockport has definitely (in my experience anyway!) got the right idea.

lucky you small voice. I have to say all the b/f support I had from h/v and local surestart was crap. One told me to top up with formula at 2 wks because I had flu and the other told me to top up with formula at 7 wks because baby was - i now realise - at the tetchy and colicy at 7 wks and I couldn't understand what was the matter

all I learnt at the b/f seminar (2.5 hrs) what was latch, how to hold the baby and watched a video about problems that could arise.

Thinking back, it was like a swimming lesson on a bench (tummy down and show them how to flail arms and legs....)

Meant to say - I'm in west London, so not that far geographically from the excellent bfeeding support you talk about, smallvoice...just worls away in reality

I have to say that even when you are a member of the NCT it doens't mean that you get the bf support that you assume that you will get.
After having dd by c/s I struggled to get her to latch on at all. The midwives in the hospital all tried and all thought that we had got it. The question that they all asked was "it just feels right doesn't it?" I thought it did at the time but lets face it I was a first time mum - how was I supposed to know??
After being at home with a screaming baby for 3 days who clearly was hungry I was at my wits end and constantly in tears at not being able to bf. I rang the NCT counsellor and the response that I got was ' it is natural and should come naturally' and this is when I am in tears to her on the phone ffs!!

Luckily I had the most sensilble community midwife who suggested that it was getting to the point where dd would be dehydrated and pretty much starving (day 7!!) that I may want to look at bottlefeeding. I did. And although the midwife never suggested a formula, I have never been so grateful to someone to offering me a solution to my dds misery. the relief me and dh felt when we saw her down 5oz at the first attempt was wonderful and she was a changed baby.
Again at my midwifes encouragement I mix fed (ebm) for the first 5 months as I never got her to latch on.

I have to say that up until the midwife suggested the formula I was determined to breastfeed as I honestly thought that formula feeding meant that I had failed as a mother. Now I know that this is not the case, but given the advice from the NCT counsellor and the lack of information about bottle feeding I really thought it was.

Sorry just realised this has turned into a long one

sorry - I am in surrey by the way

Bloody hell, Bellie! You can report NCT counsellors, btw. They like to know when one's handing out shite advice

Now I am much more sane about the whole experience I will do hm as at the time I was out of my mind with worry and probably would not have made any sense to anyone...!

Bellie, totally understandable.

I'm in co. durham

When ds was born (1999) i had a lot of pain whenever he latched on. I kept trying to reposition but still the pain came.

All the midwives in hospital said the latch looked ok, but they weren't experts. Apparently in this large teaching hospital (QMC in Nottingham) there was only ONE TRAINED BREASTFEEDING EXPERT who might be able to advise me, and she was having a day off.

I never got to see her. Back home I rang the local NCT branch (they said they could only help members). I rang the Breastfeeding Network (a lovely counsellor dragger herself out of sickbed to talk to me on phone, but I culdn't ask more of her). No decent branch of LaLecheLeague nearby. All the community MWs were supportive of the idea of breastfeeding, but none could figure out what was causing the pain.

I decided that the baby was feeding/growing well and doing no damage, so I lied to the MWs about the pain, say that it had gone away (it didn't go away until he was 8 weeks old). Otherwise the MWs would have kept trying to fix the problem and that was about as annoying as the pain itself.

I know that if I hadn't been so stubborn about breastfeeding I would have given up because of the pain; I think many women would. So, yeah, there is support everywhere for the idea of breastfeeding, but support for solving the problems that can arise when breastfeeding is pretty piss poor... ime.

And as for the concept of extended breastfeeding (past 10 months), don't get me started on the lack of support there.

(I have still left, and will not talk about bf, but need to correct something here!)

fqueenzebra, it is not true NCT only helps members....as if. Whoever told you that has either garbled their words so you didn't understand properly, or else you have asked someone who for some reason doesn't know. You need to contact whoever you rang before and tell them they are wrong, or else call NCT UK Office enquiries 0870 444 8707 and make a complaint.

Bellie, same goes for you. No NCT counsellor should say what they said to you, and the person who did can be tracked down, with enough information.

This is the point of training people within organisations, as they can be held accountable for what they say and do.

Just seen fqz is talking about 1999 - could be hard to track someone down at this distance, but they were still wrong!