Is breastfeeding seen as a middle class thing?

[Thandeka]

Am genuinely curious. Just heard a local children's centre in a deprived area refused to have a breastfeeding support group in it because only the middle class mums would go.

eh?
And I have heard elsewhere that breastfeeding levels are much higher in the middle classes,
Could it linked with education levels?

I have a feeling in other countries people of all classes breastfeed so why not in this country?

Am not posting this to be controversial or anything and apologies if it has been done to death already- I couldn't find anything before but I just wondered if mumsnetters thought it was a middle class thing? and know any reasons why this is?

I don't think social class is that much of a factor. I have known many working class women eg my sister, my MIL who have breastfed successfully to some extent. IMO there are a lot of different factors ,such as how easy is it initially, how supportive is your husband/partner, how many other children do you have. I think there is a danger that breastfeeding may become a little bit too much of an issue. It does seem to get mixed up with a certain style of parenting and lifestyle, perhaps the message should be focussed more on how to fit breastfeeding more into other lifestyles and less 'babyled' parenting.

who

'Know bog all do I? I know enough to know that I don't want to see someone with a boob tube sitting in the middle of the shopping centre with one boob hanging out (Seen it in Ealing Broadway Centre).

You see. For the second time today I have posted this obvious thought: I don't like stuff and you don't like stuff and if we all just get quietly on with getting on and ignore anything in otehrs that is not directly ahrmful then we will all be a darn sight happier.

Your right to not look is in no way supersedes my right to feed: in fact in the most basic manner My right to feed + to my child's right to a meal = 2 rights over your one right to not see.

Except my rights don't dictate to you what you should be doing as you would aim to do to me......

That does make sense I promise even if barely coherent LOL

WC me, Dad 15th child of 16 born on a council estate set aside for particualrly problematic famillies, disabled bedridden motehr and alcoholic father, satrted work at 5, couldn't take his grammar place as coudln't afford uniform..... Mum bit mroe genteel (grammar educatio0n() but still WC council estate etc-

Breastfeeding ds4 aged 2years and 2 months (though not in public usually these days, used to a lot mind)

Ryoko absolutely has the right to go to the toilet and cover her head with a muslin if she see a woman breastfeeding.

Morloth, there's some debate about whether breastfeeding women should be exempt from, e.g. the Yom Kippur fast or not.

It seems that some rabbis have gone all evidence based and stated that a one-day fast isn't particularly going to affect your milk.

I still think bf is a middle class thing. Things will no doubt change one day: as someone else said, once bf is seen as aspirational.

And how do we make it aspirational?

By doing it in public of course.

mrsgordonfreeman can you tell I flunked R.E .

Not so sure about Judaism, but definitely Ramadan has exemptions under which a woman who is BF could choose to fall (mainstream Islam obv; as with any faith there are variations- as there would be in Judaism anyway, most Jewish people I have discussed the faith with are following Liberal Judaism)

I am not sure whether my friend is intending to fast or not, but she did say that she had the option not too, was for the one in September - I have forgotten which one it was sorry.

I think there is a break clause for BFing mums during Ramadan isn't there?

People's personal experience of class and infant feeding show that statistics and surveys can only give the big picture - they cannot predict what individuals will do.

The big survey - the one done every 5 years in the UK - shows that while the majority of women from all backgrounds initiate bf, but that there are strong regional, class, age, education, effects. These effects work on initiation, and on maintenance of breastfeeding.

This does not mean that breastfeeding is a 'middle class thing' at all - given that breastfeeding is distributed across all backgrounds. However, if a woman is middle class, she is more likely to breastfeed and to breastfeed for longer.

Nevertheless, it's only one of a number of factors.

(still waiting to be enlightened about the religion that says babies must eat in toilets)

Yes, Yom Kippur is in or around September. It all depends on how strict you are/ which shul you're a member of/ what your rabbi is like/ where you live etc. etc. I'm a, er, satellite member of the United Synagogue which falls squarely in the middle of these things usually. Bit like the CofE.

Breastfeeding mothers don't have to fast during Ramadan - I think there are a few exemptions - it's usually suggested that you fast another time instead.

slushy, I used to teach RE. Never heard of this religion that gets offended by breastfeeding though.

I think this thread reeks of smug, (ooohhh look at us so middle class) completely idiotic women trying to prove that they are 'better' by bf-ing.

This sort of post and the 'I just dont know anyone who didnt bf but i live in a middle class area' attitude makes me ill and glad I live in a world where bf-ing is preferrable but not the only thing that defines you.

Horrific post!

mrsgordon me enitehr and my degree is RE (well, Religion and Philosophy)- I know it's not Sikhism, Buddhism, Jainism, Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Confu or Hinduism- would be intrigued to know what then......

What does smug smell like? I currently smell of cheese and baby farts.

Personally I dont think class came into it. The Hospital forced us to formula feed before DD was even 24 hours old (long story). I did everything I could to express, then bf as I felt it would give the best start. V.difficult at first as latching was a problem.

Once established, I found the main thing for me was the convenience - no mixing, sterilising or heating of anything - just instant satisfaction for DD (and less dashing up and downstairs for me). Also did not cost us anything (apart from a little extra laundry powder & breast pads!).

I was surprised how many nurseries (this was 2006) refused to accept breastmilk and insisted on formula. In the event I found I the cost would exceed or take up everything I earnt and we could not pay our mortgage, so we relocated to somewhere much cheaper in order to try and manage on one income. Not everyone wants to take up that option and it was/is hard being so far from family and friends/support. After the move my milk seemed to reduce, so we did switch to formula and shortly after that we started weaning anyway (DD over 6m by that point).

I only know one person who did not try bf from the start and am sure she had her reasons (which I don't know as we haven't discussed it). Although I feel bf was the best choice for us, I wouldn't say that is the case for everyone - some really struggle with inverted nipples, latching and the like and I can understand the relief that a successful formula feed can give parents if they've had a hard time. I really don't think it's anything to do with class.

Blimey, Mindy, you are cross!

Is it not more that people are sharing their own observations, and comparing them to the statistics? So someone saying 'I bf and know no one who did not but I live in a middle class area' is simply saying 'maybe the fact I know lots of bf women reflects the statistics on this'...and not being 'smug' at all?

Maybe the WC who Bf don't bang on and on about it ...

I think that idea was floated and broadly agreed with a few pages back usualsuspect.

oh sorry must not skim read

I think breastfeeding is seen as middle class - because it's seen as an optional extra, a nice to have, something to aspire to. It's not seen as an essential or as an obvious requirement for child-rearing.

Mindy the thread is about bf. There are other threads about other things by which people might, or might not, choose to define themselves. This just happens to be the topic you have chosen to post on. You are on to a hidding to nothing if you just criticise people for describing their personal experience. It can't be wrong or right, it's just that posters personal experience.

Indeed I am tiktok.

I was a bf'er. It was great but the scientific evidence to support its superiority is flimsy at best. To imply that wc womens lack of education stops them from making good child rearing decisions is just so insulting and demeaning. I have to say I am now pulling away from Mumsnet (more of a lurker anyway) because I just think that the superiority complexes are astounding. Plus I live in Ireland where shop bought cakes, formula feeding are not a crime and Boden is very rare (thank god)

Have you read the whole thread Mindy?

Until reading on mumsnet I would never have thought class came in to it.

I thought everyone would try to bf and see how it worked for them and their child.

I breasfeed but have given both of my children a bottle of formula at night time. I feel guilty about formula ut have no idea why!!

Everyone I knew breastfed where I used to live, very trendy and m.class.

Recently moved to somewhere more rural and more diverse and find people happier to formula or mix feed. I do wonder whether there was too much pressure to breastfeed in my previous area, more to do with fashion than class maybe? It does not suit everyone. It doesnt really suit me but am making myself keep going, a week at a atime. And yes Ihave the luxury of long paid maternity leave in a job that I have worked very hard for. and at the moment i have the luxury of my 2 year old going to nursery 3 days a week whilst I focus on baby, but that wont be forever

MoonFaceMama
I am not criticising peoples experience but rather how they feel that their experience in one limited area makes them superior to others - in particular wc women. I mean isnt a lower income, life expectancy etc enough to deal with, without having bf-ing mc women looking down their noses at wc womens lack of eduction and equating this with bad parenting!
Thats what makes ne vvvvvvv upset

"I still think bf is a middle class thing. Things will no doubt change one day: as someone else said, once bf is seen as aspirational".

We shouldn't be looking at why people are doing something physiologically normal and analysing their personalities and values in relation to it. We should be asking why so many people choose to suppress lactation, which is what women are doing when they deliberately choose to thwart their baby's instinctive newborn reflex to latch on at the breast and feed. (not making any sort of moral judgement here - just pointing out that breastfeeding is the default mode for mums and babies. If someone doesn't intervene to stop a baby breastfeeding, most babies would go ahead and do it, given enough time in their mothers arms)