Is breastfeeding seen as a middle class thing?

[Thandeka]

Am genuinely curious. Just heard a local children's centre in a deprived area refused to have a breastfeeding support group in it because only the middle class mums would go.

eh?
And I have heard elsewhere that breastfeeding levels are much higher in the middle classes,
Could it linked with education levels?

I have a feeling in other countries people of all classes breastfeed so why not in this country?

Am not posting this to be controversial or anything and apologies if it has been done to death already- I couldn't find anything before but I just wondered if mumsnetters thought it was a middle class thing? and know any reasons why this is?

I was born into a working class family Although now I believe most people would consider me middle class due to my previous ocction and dp's occupation. My mum was very pro beastfeeding and I bf both my dc for varying amounts of time. My motivation was of course the benefits to my and my children's health but it was also financial. Formula is expensive.

I am sure that there is a small minority of working class who don't bother to bf as they know they get their formula free.

Sorry if I offend anyone with that.

bertie-yes, did no-one tell you that!!

here is a paper which shows gastroenteritis infant mortality rates in the UK. FF infants are at significantly higher risk of gastroenteritis.

kingsroadies I'm so sorry it all went wrong for you, I had similar experience in hospital trying to get the support even in a ward setting was extremely difficult. The midwives simply didn't have the time to get help baby latched on and stay on it took a midwife friend one day to sit with me all day getting my positioning right.

Are there any figures comparing bf rates between hospital unit vs Midwife/community hospitals?

My HV told me that since they have started the promotion of BF and non promotion of FF they have had an increase in gastroenteritis in newborns because people aren't being shown how to sterilise properly because it is seen as "promotion" of FF.

I think your HV is making an excuse for poor practice and poor support 8Ace - and that's a disgrace if babies are becoming ill as a result.

There are no official guidelines anywhere that say anything other than ff parents should be supported to ff safely, inc advice on sterilising and preparing bottle feeds.

This is quite clear in UNICEF Baby Friendly guidance and they have low cost/free illustrated sheets that explain the how-to, which HCPs are intended to go through with parents.

It is part of a midwife/HV's job to ensure ff parents know how to do this - if they're not doing this, then quite simply they are not doing their jobs properly.

It makes me cross to hear this, because good education and information about formula feeding is not 'promoting' it, and it does not undermine breastfeeding. I think it's one Big Excuse for sloppy working, in fact.

Timeforabiscuit - Yes it was a shame - on the plus side I did get a good night's sleep when she was a few weeks old as I could leave her wth my parents overnight (we were there too - it was Christmas) - but I do understand that the midwives are totally run off their feet and the wards understaffed so someone having trouble breastfeeding is just not as important as someone who is in agony having had a forceps delivery and massive episiotomy for eg. In a way am not so sure why that is the case as if formula weren't available then it would be a matter of life and death for the baby - perhaps then it would be a bigger priority...? But anyway formula is available luckily for me!

The night midwife spent hours with me - she just didn't want to latch even though when she did apparently it was correct (although it really really hurt the whole time so am not so sure but about 6 different midwives insisted the latch was fine ovr the corse of 7 days). And the midwives who came to my house were also very good and spent a lot of time with me. But I was just quite shocked when they "discharged" me at 10 days even when they knew I had just been told I had thrush etc. I called them to ask what to do and who I could talk to and they just said "HV". I suppose it's bureaucracy and they didn't have much chioice but it was still a bit sad.

Yes I wonder if a birth centre would be better for BF support. I was midwife led only at C&W but it is obv a proper hospital, probably with more people.

Foreverastudent

Hmmm sorry to side track but I am not convinced that the paper which refers to gastro mortality rates in 1983 (which are minute), shows that my baby is at higher risk of death as formula fed.

It makes no reference to ff or bf in the paper. It also refers to other european countries who have similar mortality rates in 1983 whom I believe are more centred around bf'ing

As it does not distinguish between ff/bf then we cannot determine from this whether ff babies suffered the more serious bouts of gastro problems or not. We know nothing about any underlying causes any of the babies may have had

I agree entirely that in developing countries bf is by far the safer way to feed as sterilization is more difficult and the water used not safe.

And in answer to your question I can catergorically state that no HV, Dr or MW told me my baby was at greater risk of dying because I was ff'ing

However, this is not the point of the thread, and I'm sorry to have gone off on a tangent. Perhaps this is an issue for another thread, although goodness knows there are enough on bf'ing - which ever "class" is doing it

From the baby milk action website=

"The cost of bottle feeding to the NHS

Gastro-enteritis is up to 10 times more common among bottle-fed babies. The hospitalisation of one infant with gastro-enteritis costs between £500 and £1000. The hospital mentioned above was out of pocket after 4 babies returned for treatment of gastro-enteritis. Department of Health statistics reveal that 11,554 babies were hospitalised with gastro-enteritis in the UK in 1992. This cost the NHS aprox £12 million. Cases of gastro-enteritis treated by GPs cost the NHS a further £6 million. Breastfed babies are rarely hospitalised for gastro-enteritis.

Breastfeeding also protects against many other diseases and infections all of which incur costs to the NHS and distress to families. For example, bottle fed babies are twice as likely to suffer from respiratory infections. 49,000 babies were hospitalised with respiratory infections in 1992. Source: Protective effect of breastfeeding against infection. Howie et al., BMJ 1990 336"

I only showed the other study before because I assumed you would know that ff babies were at increased risk of gastroenteritis. I thought I only needed to show that UK babies die from it.

It's not any ff mother's fault for not knowing this. Where were the midwives and GPs to distribute this important information?

Again this is descending into a bf vs ff.

But maybe that is the point, why are wc parents apparently turning more towards ff? What is their prejudice against bf.

Feeding your baby is always going to be a vs battle, even if you bf totally.

Generally ff is a safe and viable option, and much better then it was when it was introduced last century. Unfortunately you can't control what is in it, like the scandal in China where they had thinned the formula then added a whitener which made babies and children ill. Or opening a tin of milk and finding bugs or foreign objects in it.

Sorry if I make anyone feel bad for feeding formula but if you make the active choice to never bf then you are choosing to give them something you have little control over. And yes I do feed my children convenience foods which I have no control over. If I could cook better and grow my own food then I would.

Fio, clinics have not supplied formula milk for several years now - there may be a handful of them who still do, perhaps in rural areas where there are few shops to supply it, but good practice has been not to have it there for a long, long time.

You're right about the rationale for it, when it did happen, though. The idea was that it would somehow attract parents to stay in touch with the clinic.

The Welfare foods scheme began long before the 1970s - without checking, I think it would be the 1950s. It remained a milk only thing ('milk tokens') until about 7 years ago (again, haven't checked) when it became Healthy Start and other foods were permitted in exchange for the vouchers.

tiktok interesting to know that it is now considered good practice for health clinics NOT to supply formula milk.

It was sold in my GP surgery (and very prominent signs were up in the reception area to advertise this) where I used to and this was in an urban deprived area, with a Co-op about 20 yards up the street, certainly no more than 8 years ago.

More an income than a class thing (and they are different IMO) but from observing my friends who have breastfed (most of them- out of about 12, only one didnt EBF to 6 months), one of the things they had in common was being able to pay for private support.

Get home from hospital, having problems, dial for private midwife or maternity nurse to stay for a few days/weeks and help them out.

This would presumably be a fairly big factor. Makes it a lot easier in those first few weeks when someone is bringing you the baby, getting you settled, getting the latch right etc.

Again, maybe I was just very fortunate in my experience of bf-ing, but why on earth do people need to be able to pay for private support just to be able to breastfeed? Why do you need someone to "bring you the baby"? Unless you are totally incapacitated of course, but how many women are? I had a forceps and episiotomy and although I was sore I was perfectly capable of walking about. Friends who had a CS likewise.

I can see that it might be useful to have some sort of general home help if you already have children at home, and you can afford it (mainly to look after home and kids while you get on with newborn).

Out of my NCT class we all breastfed with very few problems until at least 6 months. I have lots of other friends too, all of whom breastfed without much trouble.

I really think it gets worked up in people's minds into something which is going to be incredibly challenging, and this is not helpful to a new mum.

I found bf-ing a doddle and so convenient. I kept waiting for the nightmares of mastitis, DD losing weight, infections, etc to start - they never did.

I am certainly not alone amongst all my acquaintances at being surprised at how straightforward it was.

I expect the Gods will gloat reading this and send me a bf-ing nightmare with DC 2 ....

Bumpsadaisie - you were lucky - I wish my BFing experience could have been easy, but it wasn't. I have few friends who have babies but those who do are a mixture of BF being easy and it being a total nightmare (as was the case for me). Perhaps if the thrush had gone away I could have started BFing again if I had had the support and I think the only way I would have had the support I needed would have been paying for it, which we could have done, so I do agree with baggedandtagged about that. It's a shame that we don't feel there is enough support from the NHS etc but sometimes unfortunately that is the case.

Also, perhaps lucky is the wrong word - fornuate, as you said, may be better.

I am middle class and university educated and chose to bottle feed my two children. They suffered no allergies, no infections, no gastro enteritis, have never been overweight. But of course I was utterly scrupulous about sterilising etc, and making up the formula correctly.

My reasons: Bottle feeding meant that I could get DH to help with the feeding at least at the weekend. I had absolutely no family near me (all 250 miles away) and therefore it was important to me not to become too exhausted - my kids being ff slept really well and from 7-7 by the age of 12 weeks. I am the sort of person that likes routine, and did not want to be sitting around feeding on demand all day.

Who gets formula for free (other than prescribed?)

amothersplace it is unhelpful to suggest ebf requires "sitting around feeding on demand all day". I can't help but think that this attitude perpetuates the myth that bf is only for mc sahm. This is a myth, as you can see from earlier posts.

Did you not find that you were tied to the kettle and steriliser in order to be "scrupulous" in making up feeds? Perhaps you can afford to buy lots of cartons though many can not afford this luxury.

here

is a study from which I quote the following:

"In particular, breast-feeding is associated with ... lower incidence of inflammatory bowel diseases, type 2 diabetes and obesity later in life."

amother- your DCs might not have had health implications from ff yet but that doesn't mean they're not going to suffer for it later in life.

I wouldnt say i was middle class but then what is that defied as nowadays. Me and my partner both work but we can't afford luxuries holidays car etc etc but i solely bf my baby no problems. I am the only one of my friends that do and we all have babys of similar ages. None of my friends had problems bf but chose formula as they liked the freedom of going out when they wanted and not having to worry about feeding and they didnt like feeding there baby all day.
I do envy this sometimes but i can't be bothered to heat up a bottle of expressed milk let alone make up a bottle of formula.
Whatever you choose is fine aslong as you love your baby and dont see it as a inconvienence like i see alot in the very middle/high class hotel i work in.

ps) breastfeeding vests reduced to £5 on www.bloomingmarvellous.co.uk