December 08 - a few babies under the tree still need unwrapping!

[EffiePerine]

New thread ladies. I have a feeling I will be talking to myself a lot

poison ahh thanks that is so kind of you ! It took 10 days but we got there in the end ! It makes the latching on pain more bearable as I know it is preferable to feeling as rubbish as I did when BF was not working.

trace {{{hugs}}} I have no advice as DS is our first child but I reckon the one on one time sounds like a great idea if you can manage it. I really feel for you missus, sounds so difficult xx

Rosmerta - we found with Phoebe that she just would not settle in her basket so we put her in her big cot in a gro-bag and she is much better. Still stays awake between some feeds (grizzly, pukey) but is settling well between others. I'm on the spare bed in the room with her. Because we did the big cot thing and the gro-bag at the same time, I'm not sure which one helped, but the combination is working better than the basket so we're sticking with it. As for routine, I try to put her 'to bed' at about 8ish or whatever feed comes nearest to that, and all feeds after that are done in the dark with very little interaction. Then whatever feed comes around 7am I count as day, so we go downstairs into the light and i talk to her etc, to try to get a day + night thing going. She feeds 2hrly round the clock so not sure if it's making any difference to anything, but a bit of a plan/routine helps me feel better!
thanks everyone for the advice about 1 on 1 time with Lucy. It's hard when you're BF on demand so have to be 'on call' for dd2, but i should try to be more creative with my time i think.

Arti it must have been my pep talk! We had a fab night too. Have been struggling to get L into her moses basket at night, but last night fed her at 12 and then cuddled her until she went to sleep, put her in the basket and she didn't wake until 5.30am, fed for half an hour then went back to sleep in the basket until 9.30am, yay! I'm sure it was a one off, and she has been giving us hell today with constant feeding, wind etc but am ever hopeful. Hope everyone has a good night.X

Hello just a quick post here.

I am understanding the dreading the night ahead. We went to visit my grandparents today and it's a 3 hour journey each way and DS2 slept all the way there and back. So I am expecting him to be up all night.

Hope we all have good nights.

devil child is upon us again...

another one joining the night shift... she went happily to sleep at 11, then woke herself up with some massive farts and painful wind at about 12 - tried rubbing her tmmy and all the tricks but at some point tummy pain evidently turned into hunger as when i finally thought she might at least get some comfort from the boob, she stuck on and feed for half an hour... then dozed off, woke up aain, dozed, hungry and fed again, dozed, grizzled and apparently hungry again meanwhile dh manages to sleep through all her noises and crying which worries me a bit - if we ever go for me getting a night's sleep in the spare room and him feeding ebm, will he ever wake up?

effie great birth story despite te scary bit at the end, sounds like you realy love g&a! and getting your pic in the paper too

pd thanks for the brilliant post, those vids are erally helpful. at the mo dd seems to be feeding so often there's no time for the boobs to fill up on between so i'm assuming she's finished if she moves on from the vigorous guzzling to the nibbling sort of phase.

arti re keeping awake in the daytime, i was told that if a baby sleeps a lot in the day then generally they6'll seleep well at night too - but if they don't get enough naps in the day they're harder to settle at night so i#m very of people who can get their dcs to settle, dd hardly sleeps during the day (only when we're around other people ) so nigthts are a bit gruesome at the mo.

verso/rosmerta i know what you mean about rage - i get very cross with dh when he manages to sleep through dds upsetness, i know he's not doing it on purpose and not is she but it feels ever so lonely in the dark with an unhappy baby and no help. (i could wake him up to try to settle her but what's the point in both opf us being knackered? i thonk i'm mostly jealous of his ability to fall asleep really quickly...)

she's finished feeding and seems to be asleep so i'll try heading back to nbed and please god she won't want another feed for a while... in the meantime for all of us who feel we're not achieving anything or not doing the best we can for our dcs, i recommensd this book heartily, makes me realise it really is all worth it
What mothers do

kayzr how was your night in the end? I hope it went ok - and wg and jj. JJ either you or someone else mentioned that book ages ago and I sent off for it from Amazon. It's brilliant! I love it. There are a couple of others I've read which really expressed some of the overwhelming sense of responsibility which none of the pregnancy books warn you about - Life After Birth by Kate Figes and The Best Friend's Guide to Surviving the First Year (which I read when pg with DD1 and got really upset about - I couldn't believe looking after a baby could be that dreadful. Phoned my closest friend - mum of two - to ask her about it and she was so... diplomatic... that I got the message - and got scared!)

Well, I feel like a new woman today - ish. Finally had the night nanny here for one shift and it was amazing handing over responsibility for one night. Thing is, I only got five hours sleep in the end because I'm breastfeeding and DH has a slight cold dengue fever. At the start of the night I fed DD2 - finished feeding at 10:45 and went to bed. DH then woke me up at 4am by blowing his nose v v v loudly .

HE went to bed at 9pm - so he's had a gorgeous night of sleep .

Mind you, the positive from all of this is that apparently DD2 slept from midnight to 5:30am - had 90ml of expressed milk and has been asleep again ever since. Crikey! Also it reassures me that the nanny found her unsettled from 10:45-midnight... so it's not just us!

(By the way I hope it's not tactless of me to have posted about the nanny on here when so many of us are struggling with difficult nights. I realise I must sound like a spoilt cow, but I am trying to prevent myself getting PND again so am spending our savings on sleep with profligate abandon...)

Morning,

It wasn't too bad in the end with DS2, I suppose like JJ said maybe because he slept well during the day he slept well at night. But DS1 was up loads of times. He kept saying he wasn't tired as he had slept most of the way there and back too. So it was still a night of not much sleep. But at least DH couldn't use the excuse of BF to not get up.

Verso You should get a water pistol and squirt DH everytime you wake up. I'm glad you had a decent amount of sleep last night. I think it is a good idea having a nanny if you think it will help you avoid PND.

Morning all, hope everyone had a better night

trace thanks for the tips about the cot & grobag. I think that's definitely worth a try.

Verso definitely not tactless to post about your nanny but you might get a lot of !

jump sympathies re dh. My dh can also sleep through ds2 waking up but I have found in the past with ds1 that if I need him to get up then he will wake up. I guess if they know they've got the responsibility then they will be aware iyswim.

I also recommend What Mothers Do & Life after Birth. That reminds me, I need to order the Babyproofing your Marriage book still!

she's only coming one night a week - apparently some people hire them seven nights and have a day nanny as well!

babyproofing your marriage eh? sounds like one i should read!!

Hello ladies I only seem to manage to catch up post then don't get on until this time the following day then do the same catch up then quick post but it is still nice to feel like I am semi in touch with you all. We are also having the night time screamers, Jordy gets himself completely worked up. It started at midnight but has slowly crept up until tonight it was 9.30pm that he let off. It's not as long as some of you have but he screams so desperately that it just rips my heart in two. All I can do is hold him until he finally settles down. I originally thought it was wind but I'm starting to think he is desperately trying to get himself to sleep. I'm thinking I might start to give him some sort of bed time routine and actually put him to bed rather than keep him with us til we go to bed. With ds1 we did put him in his cot around 8 and we never had this screaming session with him so it's worth a try I guess.

Trace your positive suggestion is such a good one. I swear jordy has been not just smiling but giggling too. Dh was playing with him the other day and he was def smiling big style and making a funny giggly noise. I know they are not supposed to at this age but it wasn't wind I'm sure. And anyway if they can frown now surely they can smile too.

Trace my ds1 is also talking back and acting differently his nanna is here at the moment so he is getting enough attention but he's just not my boy anymore not like he used to be and I miss that so much. I think once my mum goes home I'll get dh to watch jordy between feeds and ds1 and I will do some painting together or something.

Also the poor cat is feeling very neglected twice now we have forgotten to feed him. He didn't have to wait too long but we feel bad about it.

So jealous that you lot are organising meet up I wonder if I will ever manage to meet any of you.

Better get some sleep before I'm woken for a feed, poor dh the past couple of nights had actually had to wake me to tell me to feed him. I don't seem to have that mothers instinct thing where I will instantly wake when my child crys. Luckily dh is a light sleeper.

I actually wrote all that at 11pm last night but our Internet wasn't working so I couldn't send it. Now I need to read back.

DH and I just had a huge row . He won't promise to do any night shifts on a regular basis - says he doesn't want to promise and then let me down because he isn't feeling up to it on the night. Says he has been looking into places he can take the girls and leave . Am devastated. All I wanted was a bit of support and turns out he's been planning to leave.

I think it will be ok in the end - but was a horrible row and has left me feeling very very alone and sad. Hey ho. Best get me off to the GP this week for valium or something similar I suppose. I guess a drugged up but un-confrontational spouse would be an improvement for everyone .

Oh verso, I wish I knew what to say, huge [hugs] to you. This isn't your fault, he is their father & should be involved, as my dh says 'we're in this together'. We're here if you need to talk more.

Managed to get about 3 hours sleep in the end before dd woke up for another feed, then dh took her at 8 so I got another couple of hours then - apparently she fell asleep pretty much as soon as she came downstairs then came back at about 10 for another one, and fell asleep curled up on my chest [bliss] WG hope you got some rest you poor love

It's amazing how this whole sleep/crying thing seems so much worse at night - almost a case of "I can laugh about it now but at the time it was terrible". And the oddest thing is that when she's crying I love her even more because she's in pain or upset and she can't tell us what the problem is and it's my responsibility to help her, it makes me want to hold her all the more even though she's got blimming strong lungs and screams right in my ear.

verso - no need to apologise about having a night nurse, I bet you every single one of us would love to have that kind of help if we could! I'm having our doula come round next week for some help so while it's not night time, it will be great to have someone help out with changing, keeping her occupied etc.

kayz glad at least one of your dcs got some sleep... not that that really helps you much [hugs]

I should have shared a bit of good news last night rather than just ranting on - yesterday we had an hour and a half of freedom! Went to visit a couple of mates and she fell asleep in the car seat, they said Go and do your shopping, we'll phone if she wakes up and screams for more than a few minutes. It was completely weird - the first time we'd not had her with one of us. The most efficient shopping trip in about 5 months as I wasn't huge and waddling!

Oh and another thing - I've discovered that three sets of mates Gina Forded their babies and they're all now entirely sensible kids of 5-7. So maybe by reading all this stiuff about attachment parenting and co-sleeping etc I'm making.... a rod for my own back! I dunno. As another friend said, if it's your back and your rod, then it's your business

verso sorry darling cross posted with you. Does he mean leave permanently or just to get a break for a night? He really needs to be helping you in the night times, you don't have any choice if you don't feel up to it so neither does he.

Do you have any mates nearby you can go to just now? You shouldn't be on your own if you're feeling down. And while ADs might be the answer in the long term, a more helpful DH would certainly be a better first step. Golly, I could give him a kicking for being so unhelpful. [hugs]

Oh Verso you poor thing. Like JJ I am not slear whether your DH means he wants to leave permanently or just for a break. Either way he is a b*stard for not being more supportive when you are so recently post-natal and have a history of PND. I really think he has a duty to support you more and take an equal role in parenting. Can you try Relate or something to try and get him to be more senstive to your needs?

Verso I am so sorry. He really needs to be helping you more. Will he not even agree to 1 night a week. Doesn't matter which night just 1 would do.

Hugs

oops that wasn't meant to be a link.

Hi all, just catching up... be back soon with a proper post - it's been a crazy few days. Hope everyone is ok. xxx

verso sorry to hear your situation I too am confused if you meant he wants to leave permanently? Or was it just for the night? Was it something he may have said in the heat of an argument? I can visit you sometime if you are not far from me

I think he said it in the heat of the argument - but it was still horrible, and unexpected. I went out and took both DDs with me so he could do his marking before tomorrow. Was the best thing I could have done as we both got some breathing space and while I was out I got some lovely text messages from him. Still no promises to help but I think he realised he does actually quite like us after all!

So glad to hear the air's at least a bit cleared verso. The heat of an argument is such a bad place, we all say things we don't really mean that get taken so much to heart. Well done for getting out of the house, hope the fresh air helped you all feel a bit better.

Would it be a good opportunity to talk things over with him a bit more calmly - to remind him that you both made the baby so you both need to look after her together? Fingers crossed for you all. [hug]

Verso I'm glad you have cleared things up now but that was a horrible thing for him to do and it has made me really angry that he could even think of saying something like that. Esp with you history of pnd and you are still recovering from big op and well you are in a vulnerable place right now I really don't know how you do it all with all this extra stress.

I love the what mothers do book and will have a look at that life after birth book.

JJ ds1 is a instinctive attachment parenting co sleeping child and he is a well mannered helpful lovely and non attention seeking boy. Kids turn out the way they should as long as the parents are doing what they feel comfortable with. I think a little less judgement and little more comeraderie from parents would be helpful. JJ read the 'Continuum concept' you would like that.