Due February 07 - New Thread!!

[Tommy]

there we go...... that wasn't painful at all

CurrantBun, if you want to breastfeed I would avoid using formula feed at all if you can, as it will restrict your supply. Breastfeeding is programmed to produce as much as the baby needs, but it's easier if the baby is feeding a lot as the breasts get more stimulation/messages to make more milk that way. Hope that makes sense!

On the other hand, if you want to have the option to use bottles as well as breast, make sure the baby is used to both within the first 6 weeks otherwise it will probably refuse whatever it isn't used to. I used a bottle of expressed breast milk every evening last time round - did this from week 5 so my baby would always take either breast or bottle. Very useful when I wanted a night out with the girls 2 months down the line!

Breast pumps - so many different women have different experiences about this. I used an Avent Isis manual pump and it was fine, but some women find they can only use electric pumps, and others can't express at all.

The Lansinoh cream is the best, but you have to use it with breast pads! It is very greasy and yucky, so you'll get that nasty yellow goo all over your clothes if you don't protect them with pads. And only use a tiny amount, like very expensive face cream. I used it after each feed last time, and never had any problems with mastitis or cracking, but I can't see the point of using it before the birth.

Sorry for long and bossy post, but reading yours brought back all the breastfeeding stuff!

Whoops, double post, sorry!

where can u buy these magic creams?

Hi I am still feeding my DD who is 19 months and will prob be tandem feeding when the next one comes along.
Lansinoh is great stuff, can but it from Boots, mothercare etc, but there is absolutly no point in using it unless you have cracked nipples, it promotes wet healing, like the old fashioned wet healing with bandages, i.e. it forms a protective barrier over the wound and stops a scab forming but allows skin to renew underneath. This is in complete contrast to the method of expressing some milk onto the nipple after a feed and allowing the area to air dry, in this case a scab used to form that the baby would then remove on the next feed and so the cycle continued. I have to say most of the research quoted by Lansinoh is their own, however I have seen huge sucess with it being used.
As for tender nipples, it's just good old hormones again, mine are killing when I feed DD, but I know it prob wont get any worse than this!
I also struggle using a pump, I had the most sucess with a hospitall grade one that I hired from a local breastfeeding group. When I gave that back I bought a Medela Swing that I use very sporadically now.
I don't reccomend introducing a bottle untill between 6 and 12 weeks (WHO guidelines last time I checked) prior to 6 it can disrupt establishing feeding and after 12 babies are more likely to refuse a bottle. My daugter went straight onto a cup at about 14 weeks so haven't used bottles much this time and dont expect to with this one either.
DD was my second child and having been a midwife for 10 years when she was born I still struggled with my feeding, so please don't be disheartened if it seems like such a struggle to start with, I look at her now and feel such a sense of pride that I managed to nurture her and help her grow into this lively, active toddler.

I fed DS for 11.5 months, until I was a couple of months pregnant and he rejected me and bit me at the start of every feed. In all honesty I was gutted as I wish he was still doing it. I had a tough time the first few months, as many (most?) do but I'm really glad I stuck with it and I can honestly say it was totally worth it and one of the best experiences of my life.

I'd agree with snugglebum... Lansinoh is only worth using if you have any cracking etc to let your nipples heal a bit. It is a godsend for that! But ultimately, if you have cracking or bleeding something could be improved so please seek help and don't rely on lansinoh to do all the work. You can get it from Boots - about £10 a tube I think! But it lasts ages. I recently did a breastfeeding peer support course and our tutor suggested that vaseline is a great, although less sticky and more likely to rub off, alternative to
lansinoh.

I have really sore nipples this time around, probably due to the cold. But it's a different sore than I got with breastfeeding to start with. The pain I had when starting breastfeeding was due to a milk blister and poor attachment causing cracking. But once those were rectified and healed it wasn't sore. I did have recurrent thrush... and a painful, strong letdown of milk... but I managed through those times.

I'd also agree that supplementing with formula is a bit of a vicious cycle. Until feeding and milk production is well established, formula only confuses your poor body and it hasn't a clue how much milk to make.

As for expressing... I wasn't very good at it! Although DS had an expressed bottle every night from about a month old to 7 months. Not a habit I will be repeating this time! he wouldn't take me in the evening and I was totally tied to expressing that bottle. Eventually after a week of no bottles he went back to breastfeeding in the evening - FAR easier IMO! I used a medela mini electric and a tommee tippee manual pump. I started expressing about 2 wks in when I was ready to quit and I retrospectively I think that was too early. Even though the bottle never confused DS at all (nor the dummy lol!) and we had established feeding quite well, I think the expressing gave me a huge oversupply (more than normal!) and DSs colic was worse for it.

If anyone is worried at all about breastfeeding, I would recommend asking around on the breast & bottle feeding forum on here (lifesaver!), check out www.kellymom.com for reliable, accurate advice, and perhaps get down to a local support group antenatally to get to know people. And don't necessarily trust what midwives or HVs say... their knowledge of breastfeeding is often very limited and full of old wives tales! The ladies on the forum here are far more wise . I would also suggest that if it's something you feel quite strongly about and don't want to give formula, then tell a good friend, your mum, whoever... and tell them to give you a kick up the backside as necessary! If I didn't have my DH and mum saying "you want to do this... it's important to you... just one more feed" I wouldn't have stuck at it beyond a week or two!

Sorry - a real epic! It's a topic I feel quite strongly about as there is some real lack of support out there and new babies are an emotional and knackering time as it is.

The NCT have a lovely poster about breastfeeding called Reasons to be Proud. Link Here

It really kept me going in those early weeks. I have asthma and eczema and I'm really not good with guilt so knowing I have done all I can for DS to avoid them (well, he has eczema so far..) was good for me!

Hi Suz, I once worked at a hosp where the midwives recommended vasaline, but it isn't suitable for ingestion, therefore you would have to thourghly wash nipples prior to a feed, a pain in the backside and prob very uncomforatable if they are cracked. Also meant to say that Lansinoh should be avoided if you are allergic to wool as it is lanolin based.

Hi snugglebum - yeah I meant to add that the vaseline is meant to be wiped off before feeds! Mind you, I'm allergic to lanolin but am fine with lansinoh... apparently it's more 'pure' than most lanolin... either that or I've outgrown the allergy lol!

It's amazing what emotive responses any mention of breastfeeding generate. It's a topic that seems to arouse incredibly strong feelings which is why I'm not going to continue discussing it here. I do greatly appreciate everyone's comments and suggestions but will ultimately do what I feel is right for me and my baby when the time comes, whether that be breastfeeding, formula-feeding or some combination of the two.

I take the point about Lansinoh only being worth using if nipples are already cracked though. Problem is that mine are incredibly dry at the moment and I thought it might help with that. I'm only 26 weeks but am concerned that by the time the baby arrives they will be more susceptible to cracking because they're dry.

Hi just checking in again.

Completely agree with currantbun that the most important thing is to do what feels right for mum and baby.

I bf'd DS for nine months and was really glad that I did, but it was bloomin' difficult and painful at first and I'm glad of the support I had to get me through to the fun, easy part. However, I also know plenty of mums who bottle fed, for all sorts of reasons, and at the end of the day you have to just make your own decision and get on with whatever you're doing - no sense getting guilty or stressed about it cos' there's plenty of other things you'll feel guilty and stressed about so no point in adding to them!

As for me, only got 4 and a bit more weeks at work before I finish, so things starting to feel much more real. (Still haven't actually washed, bought, planned anything yet except getting the moses basket from SIL...) I'm then using up a backlog of holiday leave before mat leave starts on 24 Jan. (I'm due 3 Feb.)

By the way, there was a debate a while ago on the other thread about how soon/otherwise to start mat leave and I meant to say then but forgot, that it's worth checking your contract to see if leave carries on building up while you're on paid maternity leave, if you get it. If it does, you may be able to take it straight after finishing mat leave and it might give you an extra few weeks off before returning.

Will shut up now!

The whole point of a forum is that we can discuss anything we like, we will all have an opinion on bf/bottle, dummies attachment parenting and a whole gammut of other emotive subjects. Parenting is an incredibly personal & emotive subject, but simply because it is doesn't make it prohibitive. We're here for support and to be supportive to each other so I don't feel that anyone needs to be 'defensive' re: this topic.
Personally I will be bf but that's because I have never had a problem that can't be sorted out and I suppose I have confidence that comes from experience. That's not to say it'll be a doddle this time tho', sod's law 'n all that.
I prefer not to express until my milk is sufficiently in to cope with demand and then I sed the isis pump to express so that dh could give the last evening feed. However, do bear in mind that at about 6 & 12 weeks baby will have a growth spurt and may well return to demand feeding. Supplementing whilst I understand the logic is imho the fastest way to lose your milk supply in the early weeks.
Can I recommend a godsend of a book called 'Best feeding', got me through a mild bout of mastitis, sore nips and a whole host of other queries.
I use Camillosan btw (with breastpads) but you could try a normal balm if they're sore now. Try Liz Earle's balm, it's absolutely fabulous stuff!

hi all - decided to change topic completely - i had my 4D scan on Sunday and it was amazing!!! actually saw his little face yawning and smiling!!!! Also had GTT on Monday - it wasn't pleasant but wasn't as bad as i had been expecting! Scan also on Monday at hospital and all is well baby growing well. Is anyone else really quite had enough of being pregnant now - i keep counting the days till maternity leave begins and counting days until due date (89 to go btw)?

Glad to hear your scan went well lucy. In all honesty, I'm fed up being pregnant pretty much as soon as I am! It does not agree with me in the slightest. But I feel horribly guilty for not enjoying it!

Sorky - I have heard wonderful things about Best Feeding. I was going to see if my local library had it. Mind you, the only homebirth book they have was written in 1979 so I'm not holding much hope!

Currantbun - I agree it is a very emotive subject - for me anyway! I have absolutely no problem with anyone wanting to feed their child whatever. My problem is that I know SO many people that have really wanted to breastfeed and haven't managed or stopped after a horrendous experience. The lack of support and relevant, accurate information they had was probably the main contributer. I think that's what makes it so emotive for me. I know that without the support of others and the proper info here on mumsnet I wouldn't have managed. And would like to reiterate to others that although it's not easy there are sources of support out there.

Sorry currantbun - meant to say about the sore nips. You're a runner aren't you? Does that make them worse? The lansinoh would encourage them to keep moist I would think. The other thought going through my head is that the little lumpy bits that appear on nipples at some point in pregnancy are designed to lubricate the nipple. So perhaps they'll be better once you have baby/get the feeding hormones?

Thanks Suzi - they're not sore at all, just very dry. I find flakes of skin inside my bra when I take it off (sorry - not a pleasant image!) I also have crusty bits on the very ends of my nipples - not sure what this is, presumably they are starting to produce something!

Sorky, agree that we should be free to discuss anything we like and of course that's the point of forums like these. I apologise if my last post came across as defensive - it wasn't meant to be; however, I have dipped into the Breast and Bottle Feeding threads and found some of the discussions there positively vitriolic, and have no wish to generate anything similar here.

I was fed up being pregnant months ago, lol!!But on saying that sometimes I find myself enjoying it too. Compared to my last two,this one's been a bumpy ride and I also feel like I'm missing out on a lot of living. My youngest is 12 so I'd pretty much had a LOT of personal freedom, and being a major social butterfly, I always made the most of it. Add to the fact that I had horrendous MS for first 3 months, and now have SPD, I feel like the Princess trapped in the tower. That said, I am REALLY looking forward to having my wee girl, and it's 85days, (allegedly), till I get to the light at the end of the tunnel.
And yes, I am counting down the days literally

Europe plays away in the background

Tlb.xx

i had my 28week appointment with the midwife today and babys lying transverse,i know i still have time for it to turn but does anyone know of anything i can do to turn the little bugger!!! i really want to try and avoid a c/s if possible. thanks

Not sure if it's the same, but I've had some handy advice on foetal positing on my thread here

positioning, that is...

Titchy, you can treat a transverese lie like a breech and try loads of different thing to get them to move, but it really is too early to be wasting energy on them now, baby has so much room at this stage they will adopt whichever position they feel most comfortable in at the moment. Around 34 weeks is a good time to try things to encourage them to turn to head down such as moxabustion, cold pack on babies head and warm pack at top of the pelvis to encourage them to move towards the pelvis, shining a torch in the direction you want them to move...honestly these things sound bizzare but I have had clients that have used them and they have worked!

thank you snuggle and moosma.

Anyone done a birth plan yet? My MW is expecting to go over mine (one for homebirth, one for hospital) tomorrow... and I haven't done it! I feel like a kid who hasn't done their homework lol. I guess I just feel that they didn't pay a whole load of attention last time and I know, and feel strongly about, what I want so I'll be sure to tell them at the time.

Still... should probably go and scribble something down

My baboo was lying tranverse too, but am just going to chill about it as it could all change from this point. Bloody uncomfy though, feel like one of the pregnant shetland ponies from the farm park I used to work on.lol.

Birth plan??Wouldn't know where to start, I'm just going to play that by ear too, what will be will be.

tlb.x

At what stage should you start discussing/preparing a birth plan? My midwife hasn't mentioned anything about this yet, but I have quite clear ideas about what I do/don't want (although appreciate the need for flexibility too as you never know what will happen on the day). I'm 26+3 so perhaps a bit early for this yet?

I was also reading up about optimal foetal positioning, but there doesn't seem much point in trying to get the baby to turn until about 35 weeks, as it may just move back again and you'll have wasted loads of energy unnecessarily, crawling round the floor! At my 25-week appointment the baby was breech, and judging by where I'm feeling its kicks it is still breech and obviously likes that position (unfortunately for me!)

How is everyone feeling at the moment? I have to say that I feel great - no different from pre-pregnancy in terms of energy levels, activity etc. Hope it stays this way although I guess I should expect to start feeling more tired from about 30 weeks.

I think that the only reason my mw wants to see my birth plans today (28wks) is that she's really busy and might not have as much time later on. I also reckon she's wanting to get pushy about a few of the homebirth things... but I won't let her lol! Most midwives want to start discussing things at about 34wks I think?

My little one is breech too and it's really stressing me! DS was head down all the time so this is all new for me! Apparently since it's my second, everything is rather 'roomy' in there so the chances of her staying head down would be slim anyway. But I'm trying to discourage her from getting too comfy head up at the moment by sitting upright etc. My DS never did engage before labour so perhaps I'm somewhat 'roomy' around the pelvis anyway!

I'm feeling crappy. Feeling really shaky and pathetic. And also starting to feel rather emotional and worried about what's about to hit in a few months! I really am worried about DS and that he'll feel that his mummy doesn't love him anymore. Although I'm trying to 'train' him to sit in his armchair for a snack so that I can get a moment to feed baby! So hopefully things like that will help.