don't read unless depressed already

[VirtualFairy]

on thursday i had my 22 week scan and all was going perfect and i found out that i was having a girl and i was so excited as i was secretly hoping i would have a girl. on tuesday i went to hospital with strange discharge and on friday i gave birth to my baby - they wouldnt give me steriods or try to save her becasue of hospital policy to not attempt to save before 24 weeks, i feel that i was so close being only 8 days off 24 weeks. i would have payed anything and i tryed everything to give my baby a chance but labour just wouldnt stop.
she was perfect and there was nothing wrong with her, i went into labour because of an infection but the infection did not seem to get better from the antibiotics i was given in hospital, i do not know what the infection was and the hospital says i may never know.
before i got pregnant i had a full once over at the clinic which gave me all clear for all std kind of infections. the hospital tell me it was probabley normal bacteria down there that changed and caused early labour.
i want to know how and why that could happen, was it stress?
i hate my body so much for pushing my baby out and killing her.
i have no idea where to go from here, it has been a week since i held her in my arms and said goodbye and i know she is still in the hospital on the 2nd floor and i can't stop thinking about her lieing there alone.

I am so sorry VF that you have had to go through such an awful time, i don't have the answers but i am sure someone will be able to help you

It is a horrific story and I hope that you get some of the answers that you need. I feel so sad for you x x x.

VirtualFairy,
I feel so sorry for you. I don't have any words of wisdom... just wanted you to know that I am thinking about you. Maybe if you feel up to it you should go to your doctor or back to the hospital and ask questions about what has happened and the way you were treated... the nurses should be more caring and supportive to you in such a terrible situation. You need to take time now and grieve for your little daughter Seven. xxx

how terrible, dont know what to say, but so so so so sorry. this happen to my cousin she is now pg again and all is ok.. not what you might want to think about, but you will be ok dont blame yourself chicken, nothing you could do. terrible the way you were made 2 feel in hospital. please ask someone for a hug, you need 2 be looked after

Virtualfairy,
I posted on the other thread , sorry if I am repeat myself.
I know how you are feeling right now. I lost my baby almost 5 weeks ago at 17 weeks. It is torture isnt it?
The first couple of weeks are the worst, and I then started to feel a bit better, I returned to work but it has all come back again. I feel I dont want to be walking around in the 'real world' and enjoying life makes me cry.
I am really about the way you were treated in hospital. My one comfort was that my hospital couldnt have been more supportive.
I have an appointment with the consultant in one months time to give me a run through of all the tests results. I think this is pretty standard practice and should be sent an appointment, If not call the hospital when you feel up to it and speak to an OBGYN.
I am desperate for my body to get back to normal so I can start trying again. Its just not happening though. I retained some tissue and am still have bleeding and am on antibiotics AGAIN>
Am now becoming worried that I am never going to be able to have any more children.
This is hell.
Any time you want to chat Mumsnet is here.

oh cori, and others.
its one big nightmare that you never wake from. i have felt like i am not in reality anymore and like i am watching myself on the bed crying. it is weird and i know many of you have and do share my pain of losing a baby.
vodka is helping me to even write this, vodka always the best healing aid of pain- well got me through last few days anyway.
i have been reading all the research on preterm labour and premature birth etc and have been quite shocked at how common it is - and how common that infection causes a large proportion of births b4 30 weeks, seems crazy how the world health organisation recomends screening for bactirial vaginosis during pregnancy, yet as yet it is not done in the nhs in britain (tell me if i am wrong) then i will just moan about my health authority!

i do not know what infection induced labour - they still cannot tell me, and say i will find out at my 6 week appointmnent- i have a whole load of questions to ask, about whats happened and about the future, i really hope they can spare half hour for someone who will not take "a normal infection" for an answer.

i do blame myself though- not doctors, athough if they had told me infection details earlier and risks and well explained what was happening to me i might have been able to choose alternative therapys for me etc.
i know to most that might sound crazy but if i had known my fanny was too akaline(bv) i would have sat in a bowl of vinegar/teetree/live yogurt whilst having my iv antibiotics.
i do not know it was bv(bacterial vaginosis) that caused this. all i know is that it could be this, it could also be a std like clamidia or gonorear etc, i had full std test august 2004 just before i concieved, but i am finding myself doubting my partner- which i really shouldn't be doing because he is not the type - i don't think.
maybe i got the infection before i concieved - like when the coil (Iud) was took out september 2004, i have read that infection can stay inside your utereus with no symtoms until around 20 weeks where membranes touch uterus and infection touches baby and caused symtoms in only 50% and preterm labour within 4 weeks.
i need to understand this all, i do not think i will rest until i do.
cori- i am sure your body will return to normal soon, your body is bound to be "a bit crappy on healing" if your mind is so depressed. my body is barely functioning myself - i am myself not doing much to ensure my body heals so advice from me is pretty pathetic, so dont lisen to a word i say.
i have lost the desire to eat- every overweights womens dream i know! but putting something tasty in my mouth makes me feel bad. i have lost a stone in weight but am not too worried as unless lose 2 stone would not be underweight. and am not doing any exercise apart from reaching for a drink.
what else is there in life, i really have lost purpose; my baby was everything, i can barely remember before.

ooooh buggarrr soz for doing an essay, mumsnet is great though, partner is too busy, mum is too sad, friends are too awkward! me and my thoughts!

I'm appalled at the way you were treated at hospital. I understand that you question why screen tests are not routine. I believe there was a nurse advocating for its introduction as a routine procedure but I may be confussed. I will try to find it for you.

Is not your fault, don't blame your self. You have gone through a very bad experience and have lost something very cherished, but you are sure that you would have done anything possible to change the outcome, haven't you? please be kind to yourself.

It is mentioned here , but I can't find a link to the publication.

VirtualFairy, like Cori I posted on your other thread, in the Pregnancy section.
I am so very sorry that little Seven died, and also very at how you have been treated by the hospital. As someone who had an induced stillbirth after her baby died at 21 weeks, I know the peculiar nightmare quality of weeks 20-24. It is a VERY weird place to be and I think a lot of health professionals don't handle it well. Not excusing them, but it was noticeable even amidst the generally very kind and respectful treatment I got in 2002. And even kind family and friends, you could tell sometimes they were thinking...did she have a miscarriage or a stillbirth?
When and if you feel strong enough, I think you should complain to the hospital about how you feel they handled the issue of Seven being born at under 24 weeks. They were extremely insensitive about this from the sound of things.
CAT me if you want to, or post as much or as long here as you feel it helps.
I put this link on my other post but you should know that SANDS is there for everyone whose baby dies after 20 weeks gestation. For them, every life, however brief, is precious and worthy of love and remembrance, and you will get the support there you need. Both now, in the early days, and as you start to come to terms with Seven's death.

I did not ask for an autopsy on the baby. I knew, without even discussing with my husband, that we would not try for another baby. BUT also, I knew that if the baby died at this stage I could not have stopped it. If I were to have another pregnancy it would be soooo hard. What decisions I probably won't have to face. I still want my baby......

Anyway. In not asking for clinical details I, a) did not want my baby cut up etc after so short an unfair beginning and b) what good would that do me. I'm grieving, if I knew exactly what was wrong, I would still be grieving. One isn't easier than the other.

My baby was induced/born with it's cord wrapped so tightly round it's neck, it also took one of it's arm and still wound round more. They did't try to undo it it was so tight. I took that as enough reason for it dying. I still wonder if there is a worse reason, that hit me this week and I feel I'm back to square one. Crying all the time. There is no WHY, it just happened. Wish it were easy to keep to that.............

crickey penpal and marina your experiences i read like a woman who does not feel the same heartache and them bang it hits me like a train again and again- every time i wake up and reach for my belly and remeber.
it's 2 weeks tonight since m baby was born, and i am so grateful to you mumsnet people who i don't know who are all over this country and all women that feel the same pain, and have given me words to continue - i know the only way to go on is to try and let time take away the pain- well the only way i see that happening is forgetting or forcing to forget - or rather not remeber, my dp says he doesnt want to talk because he gets upset about it, and i am screaming and crying on him, wishing he would listen to the nightmare again and again- but i suppose he can't cope with that - not supprising , it was tragic first time around without me wanting to talk about it, again and again.

i have been thinking about spiritualist churches etc, wondering if they can "heal" me or put my mind at rest.
my babys funeral is on monday and to tell you the truth i am dreading it, i left it all to my dp so i am of course dreading it lol - i had to pay for flowers etc today and have still to choose a "plot" for my babys ashes to be buried and then of course pay for it all which i am not rich but am lucky enough to have been really stingy on my last student loan cheque (was saving for pushchair and cot etc) so i have enough for all funeral stuff.

seems so crazy that life was taking me in the direction of real happiness- by finishing uni and then planned to have fun and do yoga and swimming, and socialise with pregnant people lol- stuff that i never had the oportunity to do when i was pregnant with my kids
they are taking it bad, my son 8 has become naughtier and i cant stop him, he has no respect for me anymore- since i became sad and my daugher is sufferning to with mummy being sad- also with baby not being a reality too as she keeps going to kiss her baby sister(my belly) and then remembers and looks sad- she is only 5 but she was so exicited about me giving her a girl to share "barbi and pink stuff" with, she was very upset and almost cryed when i told her baby had died.
still i realise i am lucky to have 2 wonderful kids, and i plan to really spend time with them not work in future. working is such a ridiculous thing asked and expected of women with children! and people wonder why kids grow up with guns in their pockets and in gang culture!

i really beleive women should be given praise and respect in this society for bringing her kids up in a way that she chooses should be repected not frowned upon- i mean as i am a student and not a working parent and partner is not the father of my 2 kids, and live in a shitty council house. but 2 weeks ago i was happiest woman alive.
oh bugger am pissed. again! well if it gets me through the next few weeks---sozzzz xxxxxx

you are s right penpal knowing what went wrong wont change anything or change how i feel, still have disire though i dont know why
my babys cord was born with cord wrapped around her neck and the rest of body, i did not see her like this(gas and air) but my husband did and cannot talk about it. i think thats what killed her in the end, which is probaly better than being born completly alive and there nothing you can do. i felt helpless enough.
all that in any way consoles me is that my baby was not here to be a life and was never meant to be a life, but only here for such a short time to maybe teach me something.

there us a sands event tommorrow its in london, i might go, its in acton. i might go but rather not go outside

been scared of going out recently and have still not been able to eat alot- have lost weight and my partner is gutted about my "no longer fat arse" bless him suppose should be well grateful of a partner who loves a fat arse!
i think i do not want to face people i know and explain what happened etc.

funny thing is i know now that losong a baby at 0 weeks - term is still as painful as ever i do know that you feel like you are watching yourself and not normal.

ooooh buggar tis 3 am -am gonna pass out now

VF, I'm sorry I can't say anything to alleviate your pain but just wanted to let you know that we are listening. {{{{{{LOTS OF HUGS}}}}}

VF - just wanted to say I'm thinking of you and have been since your first post on pg. I lost my first at 26 weeks, baby was fine but I got pre-eclampsia and she had to be delivered by cs and died a few day's after, she was just too small. I felt I'd completely let my baby down and hated my body for it. The first few month's were awful - got drunk alot, sobbed alot, didn't want to face anyone just in case it led to me trying to explain what had happened.
Didn't have any other children then, but I can only imagine how hard it must be for you. Try not to worry about the children, they are extremely resilient and this tragic experience will help make them into beautiful young people.
Don't want to give you all the crap like how time is a great healer but it is true. I felt nothing would be able to lift me out of the terrible blackness, but time did.
Loads of love VF x x x x x x

My DS went through a 'naughty' stage in the 2 weeks afterwards. I thinks kids sometimes blame themselves when things happen they dont understand. It occurred to me the other day to tell him that it wasnt his fault the baby went away. He said 'cause I dont say to you' . He had been through a phase of refusing to say sorry for bad behaviour when it all happened, sooo sad. He is only 3.5. He still asks 'baby come back' 'baby come back soon often'. He also knows I havent been well lately ( infection) going to GP, taking medicine and he knows it is related to 'the baby gone away' .
VF if you ever feel like to meeting up, I live in NW London.

VF I don't pretend to understand what you are going through our baby died at only 12wks, the awful labour you must have suffered and the hospitals refusal to help your baby. But I just wanted to share with you that boys of our sons age do react to grief in unexpected ways.
I m/c a few weeks ago and out of our 3DC's we only told our 7yo DS that I was expecting I feel the same as you do in that its like he has lost respect for me, he was so kind in the 2 days we found out and then I went into hospital, but since then he has been awful really rude and bolshy not doing as he is told sometimes just down right refusing.
Sending you love and will be thinking of you xxxx

VF, my first child was stillborn at 26 weeks 15 years ago due to placental abruption, i felt the same way, cursed my body for failing my baby so much.i never held him, or was given any mementoes, try not to torture yourself with these thoughts although easier said than done i know. im assuming they will perform a post mortem to identify the cause of the infection?? my heart goes out to you.{{hugs}}

VF, thinking of you tomorrow. I hope the service brings you some comfort.

i have been doing some research on preterm labour and am astonished by the amount of things that can be done, i know the lovely nhs would not have offered me these treatments but if i had known what i do now i would have tried everything. it has took me these last 2 weeks everyday researching to find out that there are many proven and not proven ways of preventing and stopping preterm labour- i am finding comfort in planning more pregnancies with these preventions etc in place.

i plan to make an easy to understand website, in hope that if someone else finds themself needing to stop labour or trying to prevent another preterm labour, they can find information quickly and easier to understand.

if my mysterious infection was bactirial vaginosis which is really common cause of labour, i would like to know that the antibiotics the doctors were giving me have been prooven statistically not to stop preterm birth. i would have also liked to have known that bacterial vaginosis is simply sorted by sticking the bacteria that should be down there back again, therefore killing the baddys- can't belive that can be done by drinking actimel/onken biopot yogurt etc, or even better getting a acidiphillis pessary.

its also mad to know that just testing your discharge ph levels with normal ph paper can predict labour and also doing a saliva hormone test can predict labour too. treatment for labour varies from drinking ridiculous amounts of water to all these different herbs that relax your uterus.

i think though that even if this was the infection it would have been too late, if i can at least raise awareness of this though by doing a website i will. it will at least give me a project to do over the summer and keep me thinking of the positive things that can come out of this whole nightmare.

i asked the kids whether they wanted to come to the funeral, they said yes, when i told then that they wouldn't miss any school as its before school (its not), they said they didn't want to come. so i have decided to take them to school and do the funeral with just me and dp.
they have been better today - i think i need to get them back in control of them, my dp is just no good at it, bless him he tries but at the end of the day they really only listen to big bad mum!

spacecadet- i can't beleive you have no momentos of your baby not even memorys of holding him - that is awful, i am lucky to have held my baby although it all still feels like a dream.

cori - your infection sounds a nightmare, what has the doctor said? what are the symtons of retaining tissue? i had a pretty mad infection when in hospital which i still don't know what it was. but i had ectoplasm discharge. after the birth i bled huge clots. and now its been 2 weeks i am bleeding pink/yellow bogies- i do not think this is normal so am going to the doctors tommorrow, not that i think they will be able to do anything other than more antibiotics. i have got an appointment in about 5 weeks time to see the gyny people at the hospital but i still want to know about my infection sooner that this as i am driving myself crazy. i am also thinking that as my infection might have been in my uterus it could have gone to my ovarys and made me infertile - which would kill me, as i have always wanted more children. i expect you are thinking this way too, and having to wait till your appointment is too long. can i have sex again, i don't feel like it at the mo but my dp has felt like it since he saw my b cup boobs increase to d cup milk boobs, they are back to b again now (bummer) but seriously is sex wrong because of reinfection, could the infection have passed to him? and of course is not treated. i might send him down to a clinic anyway.
anyways i would love to meet up if you would like cori i am in ladbroke grove area, w10.

funeral tommorrow and i am dreading it, i think i should be looking forward to it but am just really scared, i dont know if i will cope, and also i do not want to go out of the house and see people, which i know i will, it is not exactly inconspicouis getting into a hersette - it will draw alot of attention and sad looks and i don't think i will cope with that, i have not even seen my friends since as have just layed in bed. i suppose the funeral will help to finish things and maybe then i will get out of bed and start taking the kids to school and trying to remember who i am so i can try and do normal life again.

crickey have written an essay yet again soz - once i pop just can't stop!

Hi VF, I think your Web site idea with pertinent info would be fab. It would be a massively generous gesture to other parents who may find themselves in the same position one day.

As a 'precursor' / additional thing to it, you may want to start a thread here with your findings to date / a few sources of advice / an outline of what can be done etc. with a clear, relevant thread title. The search engine web crawlers go through MN and threads are indexed so people searching google etc. do get hits to MN threads.

I'm trying something similar at the mo with a thread I'm writing on NCT classes so if someone looks for info on NCT they might find (amongst the hundreds of links) a link to my MN info.

Best wishes for your recovery, VF.

virtualfairy read your post last night just wanted to say that i am so sorry for your loss and that i will be thinking of you today as im sure others will be too
love and light xxxxx

Virtual Fairy - thinking of you and your dp today. Look after each other.

I think your website is a great idea - keep us updated on how it's going.

Kia Kaha (stay strong)
Kiwifruit xox

Hi VF
I hope you are feeling OK today. I know it is such a difficult time.
The idea of a website is great. At times like these it helps to know you are doing something positive.

About a week ago I started to pass some tissue, when I went to the loo. ( this was 4 weeks after the miscarriage)The hospital advised me to come in for a scan, they could see that some tissue had been retained. I also had a raised temperature, so indicated infection. I have been on antibiotics for a week, will go to hospital tomorow for another scan.
I was told you can have sex again when the bleeding stops, but if you have an infection I would avoid it just in case.
My greatest fear is the infection could cause infertility too. Havent had any advice from doctors yet.
I work locally to you, so we could meet up and have coffee one day.

VF, have lurked on here for ages. Just needed to say how very sorry I am to hear about your loss and I am thinking about you and yours. I cannot begin to think about how you are feeling but if you do the website then at least the loss of Seven will not be in vain. Goodluck with it and hope that tomorrow goes as well as it can.