Am interested in your opinion .....

[Ghosty]

Hello ...
I just have a little question and I would like some opinions .... if that's ok.
It's about a friend of mine ... it's not a problem or anything but it's been on my mind for a bit.
Anyway ... she (friend) has a little boy who will be 3 next month. He is a bright little boy who is articulate and lovely. I think she is a good mum and although a fairly recent friend she is looking like she will be a long term friend.
What I was interested about was her approach to a couple of things regarding her son. Like I say he is nearly 3 and she has not even attempted to potty train him. When I asked about it she said she has no intention to do it until he is older. Now, I am a firm believer in NOT pushing potty training (my DS was 2 yrs and 10 months) but I know that I thought about it and planned it for months before ... I tried a couple of times to see if he was ready and when he wasn't I waited a bit longer. My friend hasn't even tried to see if her DS is ready.
A couple of other things ... he is still in a cot. And she has no intention of putting him in a bed. He also still has a sleeping bag so he can't really move around that much in his cot if he wakes up.
And although he hasn't had a daytime sleep in over 6 months she still makes him lie down in his sleeping bag and cot every day for 2 HOURS ... in the dark.
Before you get me wrong and think I am an interfering old bag I will explain that I would never tell a friend that I don't agree with what she is doing as a mum ... we are all different and have our own ways of parenting... but for some reason these few things that my friend does (or isn't doing) I just feel funny about. I feel that she is not letting her son grow up.
I don't know any other mum who is not at least thinking of potty training by this time and I certainly don't know of any nearly three year old still in a cot and sleeping bag.
What do mumsnetters think? Is my friend a control freak??

I don't know Ghosty, I started reading your post and thought I was going to say "leave her to it, none of your business" (in the nicest possible way of course ) and then I got to the lying down for 2 hours in the dark bit and felt a bit uncomfortable. Hmm. Does she have contact with other mums? I'm just wondering whether she ever sees what other people do? Or whether these things just haven't occurred to her? Will ponder and post more maybe.

i agree ghosty it does seem a bit stange him still apparently being kept as these stages most mums would be glad to be free of nappies etc by that age.does she have family support or other friends? Personally i dont know how you could go about apraoching her on it but it doesnt sound very good for the kid.

hi ghosty
is she depressed and just cant be bothered with things?or maybe just a bit too laid back?its early days yet so she how it goes,like you said she could turn into a really good friend so dont let this spoil the friendship,once you get to know her better youll be able to tell why she`s doing those things

Thanks WWW ... the 2 hours in the dark thing is a bit much isn't it? She says it is because he needs quiet time but surely he can have quiet toys or some books or something if he is not sleeping?
She does have lots of friends ... she is Mrs SAHM/coffee group woman ... it is hard to get to see her as she is always busy ... and sometimes I get the impression that she looks down on most other people's methods of parenting ...
Her son also still eats jars of baby food BTW ... forgot to add that bit.

Thanks Loobie and Porquemama ... posts crossed!
This is the thing .... she definitely doesn't seem depressed ... she seems very very together ... maybe a bit too together?? I definitely won't say anything to her at the moment but ... just feel uneasy about it!

Ghosty a womans intuition is certainly almost right.Is it her first baby and as www says she might not understand around what age a child does this, that or the other.
Does her ds kick off when he goes upstairs for 2 hours, if not it seems to be normal routine for this child.She seems very naive and not allowing her child to advance in his developement.
You know her and her ds, trust your instincts.

does he eat other things besides the baby food as i dont think that jars of baby food would hold much nutrition for a kid of three years old, does he go to nursey/playgroup? surely he can have quite time in the light.

If she's already got lots of friends I would definitely keep my distance until you are sure what this is all about. Sounds like she rarely has a window anyway! I bet you a pound to a pinch of s#~t that lots of the others think along the lines you do too.

maybe she finds it difficult to accept that he`s not a baby anymore,maybe she only plans on having that one and wants to keep him as a baby for as long as she can,it is very strange,is she still breastfeeding him as well?

Sounds really freaky to me ghosty, I'm not surprised you feel funny about it. It's the jars of baby food that sound the weirdest to me. Does she seem like a normal person in other respects?

Oh no ... definitely not breastfeeding ... in fact she is one of these people that thinks that b/f past 12 months is wrong (even 12 months is too long in her opinion ... we have recently talked about this as I want to b/f for 12 months with my next one).
The funny thing about it is that she doesn't 'baby' him at all in any other way ... no baby speak, he walks everywhere, she is anti dummies and all of that.
He does eat other food other than baby food ... but he is very very picky.

Does he happily lie for 2 hours ? He doesn't cry ? Maybe he does sleep...
As for potty training there are loads of mums who wait past 3 years old....
The jars is not nutricious enough I would think but if he is picky maybe he won't eat much else...

Hi Ghosty - my immediate reaction to your first post was that she was wanting to hold back time and keep him a baby forever -but reading your later posts it seems that this isn?t the case. Maybe she just has really unusual ideas of how to bring up her child. I can see why you are a bit uncomfortable about it though - it is strange to say the least...

I would just go with your gut instincts. If you think the child is in no immediate harm and is not suffering any obvious developmental/emotional negative sideaffects then maybe you should carry on as you have been doing and just develop your friendship as much as you feel comfortable with. I am sure that if you thought she were suffering from depression or she needed help in any way, then you are sensitive enough to pick up on it quickly and do whatever you felt to be the right thing. (But really, baby food for a 3 yr old ???!! Hope he is getting enough alternative "real" food to make up for it!)

Ghosty are you absolutely sure that the little boy doesn't sleep??! It's just that my ds is going to be 3 this weekend, and he still sleeps for up to two hours a day, sometimes more, and I know this for a fact because I hear him snoring on the monitor. Perhaps the little boy sleeps sometimes, and other times he just lies there... on the other hand if he's crying out or obviously doesn't want to be in the room, then she should definitely not be making him stay in there.

DS has been fully toilet trained for six months now but I have to admit that he is also still in a cot. The reason I haven't put him in a bed yet is that he has never tried to climb out and seems perfectly happy in there, so I suppose I've let sleeping dogs lie, IYKWIM. I will obviously be moving him when he physically gets too big for the cot, but I figure I've still got a couple of months yet. Is it strange to still be in a cot when they're almost 3? I didn't think it was that uncommon... at least for me, it's certainly not because I'm trying to hold him back in any way. Everyone does things very differently, don't they.

Ghosty, I'm sure you'll be surprised to hear that I don't think there's anything seriously wrong with your friend.

On sleeping in cot/sleeping bag - our DD's doctor said that the safest place for a baby to sleep is her cot and that I should try to keep her in it as long as possible. If she tries to climb out, it's time to put her in a bed.

On the 2 hour nap - it sounds like he is actually napping. Is he crying in the dark for 2 hours? She is lucky to have a 3 year old who is still napping, I think.

On the baby food - I have been told that it is extremely nutritious, but that they just don't taste very good. Most babies stop eating from the jar because they prefer real food.

On potty training - I haven't gotten to that stage yet, but it sounds as though your friend is waiting for signs from her DS that he is ready to potty train. She sounds like she doesn't want to worry about it til then. Maybe this is a mistake, but it doesn't seem important yet since he is still not even 3 yo.

I wouldn't say anything to your friend. As I've learned through my friends, everyone seems to have their opinions about how to raise their own and others' children. But as long as their methods are not harming the children, it seems as though we shouldn't say anything. HTH.

Grobag make their sleeping bags for children up to age 6. There must be a demand for them in that case. I'm curious because whenever ds makes the transition to a bed (he's only 10 mths at the mo) I would expect him to sleep under a duvet. What's the trend elsewhere - could sleeping bags for older kids be a cultural difference? I agree about the difficulties in going to the loo at night though - the mind boggles!

Message withdrawn

I agree that it's probably OK. It's just different parenting of a different child.

DS1 was forcibly evicted from his cot at 2y 8m because we needed it for DS2. He'd shown no signs of wanting to get out of it so we left him as long as we could (I wonder if this is why we had no trouble at all moving him to a bed, he never got out and wandered or anything). DS2 is now 2.5 and also shows no signs of wanting to get out of his cot - we'll leave him in it as long as he wants.

If the DS happily lies in his cot for 2 hours in the day then it's fine - if he was left there screaming ans crying I'd be worried. DS1 used to have a long nap every day until he was just past 3.

Baby food at 3 is a bit weird but as the parent of fairly picky children, if he'll eat it then great!! In general, you feed your picky child whatever you can get them to eat. I do still buy 4mth carrot puree to hide on pizzas for my 2

Potty training - she has obviously thought about it and has decided what works best for her and her child I guess.

I know what you meant about friends' parenting methods grating but having no intention of sayig anything to them. I have a couple of friends like that but the reality is that they know their chld best. I'm sure people don't agree with my parenting methods 100% either

I think you are a great friend to be thinking about this but at the same time not mentioning anything.As we all know many mums don't hesitate to comment on differences in upbringing and thereby making us feel bad.

For what its worth I wouldn't worry too much.Could it be a cultural thing.Greeks and I think many mediterranean mums do do things differently to us.Many greek kids stay in their cots until it literally is too small for them (length wise)Many still drink their milk from a bottle until they are 5 or6 years old.They are all fed by someone else (with a spoon I mean!) until 3/4 years of age (mums don't want them or surroundings to get dirty) finger foods and unpureed food are introduced much later than we do, and generally no attempt is made at toilet training until the summer after the 2nd birthday.(because we take up all rugs and carpets during the summer months and accidents are easier to deal with.So if a child was born early October the mum wouldn't start TT until probably June the following year by which time the child is over 2& 7 months.

Over here they think we are cruel pushing our children to independance so young.Different approaches really.Now that mine are older I can see that they all end up more or less the same in the end.Enjoy your friendship!

Forgot to add that all kids here sleep 2/3 hours in the afternoon and then go to bed at midnight as you have no doubt noticed if you've ever been here on holiday!!!

Thank you so much everyone for your thoughts on this .... particularly Bloss for coming to the fore and reassuring me that my friend has not got some kind of control thing going on!
Like I said ... she is a 'normal' (if there is such a thing) mum in every way but it is just that these few things seem unusual to me as all my other friends seem to be more ready to get on to the 'next stage' (whatever that may be) ....
I agree with the cot thing ... if DS hadn't learned to pole vault out of a travel cot at 2 years and 1 month, we would probably not have put him in a bed for ages. In fact his sleep problems all started the night he first went to a bed so for those of you with 3 year olds still in cots I salute you!
The daytime sleep thing is the only niggle that niggles me really ... according to my friend he does not sleep and just lies there for 2 hours. I could understand the 'quiet time' theory if he had a few toys and books ... the way Bloss describes ... but isn't it a bit strange that a child would lie still for 2 whole hours and not sleep?? I don't know maybe it is just me and my son but I always had to do what Bloss does with the strong sleep cues etc and to be honest when DS began to not sleep I was relieved to give up the whole nap thing!
Anyway ... thanks again all body ...

I haven'y had time to read any other replies, so sorry if I over-lap, but my thoughts are:-

-potty training, maybe she's so laid back she's horizontal, or maybe plain lazy. I had no intention of doing anything with my 1st. I had offered him a couple of times to go to the potty but he wasn't interested, so I did nothing, then one day he told me he wanted to use the potty and that was that. Maybe she's also just waiting to be told by her ds?

-my neighbour has 3 kids, 7, nearly 5 & 3. I nearly died when I was round her house & saw that the nearly 5 year old is still in a cot. I didn't go in the room, nor did I have a tape measure with me, but I'm sure it's just a normal cot too, not even a cot bed. I thought that was really wierd. I moved both of mine quite early to a normal single so find even a 2.5 year old in a cot a bit odd.

-I know a lot of people advocate quiet time for the kid in their room even when they no longer nap. It does seem a bit extreme that it's for 2 hours in the dark (to say the least) but surely, if he really objected he wouldn't do it? I mean when my 2 came to the end of their naps around age 2, both got more & moe difficult to put down - crying & generally objecting. Is she putting him down & letting him scream for 2 hours? If so, then I definitely think a cheerful "I think he's trying to tell you somenthing/he's at the end of his daytime rest' sort of comment. If he lies in the dark for 2 hours without a murmur, then he's either happy to do it or he's the most (worryingly) compliant child in the world, but you haven't suggested in the rest of your post that he's not a happy normal boy.

The cot, sleeping bag & toilet training I wouldn't mention unless she does. The nap, I might just ask in a genuinely curious way if he's ok with it, say by comparing with your ds's naps & when/how they ended etc

My nearly-3 is still in a sleeping-bag, in his cot, having a daily long nap and is not potty-trained. I don't see that there is any rush to change any of that if mum and child are happy. Sometimes ds tells me that he doesn't want a nap and I tell him to lie down and have a rest with his bear in any case, and he invariably goes to sleep. It does seem to me that a 2-hour wide awake rest might be a little excessive, if the child doesn't need a nap then certainly he should have a rest without stimulation of toys, but perhaps not for so long. On the other hand, perhaps the mum needs the break - I know I certainly do! And like I said, if the child is happy then what's the issue? I can still remember having a scheduled nap time in nursery school at the age of 4/5.

this is interesting.
ds is aged 2 and 10 mths.
He still sleeps in a cot - I don't trust our stairgate to withstand the concerted efforts of an escaping toddler and he has not yet expressed an interest in moving to a bed. As baby #2 is due in early Dec I'd like to start the move to a bed, but only because I need the cot, otherwise my plan was to keep him in it as long as he'd stay. If he starts to climb out of the cot then I'd have moved him anyway. So I don't think being in a cot is strange, in fact it's safer and more convenient at the moment.

The babyfood - DS has gone though periods of not eating much / eating lot's of the same foodstuffs. Sometimes I think it's be a lot easier to keep giving him babyfood for my peace of mind, but don't as he's going to have to develop his own tastes and eat "grown-up" food at some stage. If she mixes the babyfood with other stuff I'd say it's fine.

The naps - how I wish ds would still nap for 2 hrs in the afternoon If the child is happy to rest then it's not doing him any harm - he's probably the better for it. If he fights the rest then that's a different matter.

Potty-training - ds is still in nappies. He's had one or two sucesses in the potty but I can tell he's far from ready - he denies ever soiling his nappy, he won't pull down his own trousers etc. I think DS is lazy/afraid of change and I'm not going to push it (yet, I wouldn't mind him trained before the new baby comes). Your friends child will probably train himself before too long - esp when he starts to realise his friends are all trained.

I do think my ds is behind in some things and advanced in others - an average child.

I think your friend is fine - just doing things her way. You could probably tell if her ds is upset by any of this and you didn't mention that in your post.

now if she looks down on others method of parenting, well that's a whole new thread....

Oh- I know this thread is nearly exhausted, but I wanted to mention that I am the youngest of seven children - and due to space constraints (I think), I slept in a cot until I was 4 years old. I think I'm pretty normal, but like others here have said, I think it's fine.

GRMUM - I thought your thread was fascinating. I'm always interested in the different cultural things that people do in raising children.

Interesting thread, Ghosty!