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Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

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Original poster

ds behaviour is getting worse not better, any other ideas please

35 replies

yawningmonster · 04/12/2008 19:46

I will try to be quick as it is morning here and I need to leave for work. DS is 4 and has always been a very reactive little boy and I have found parenting him to be a real challenge. I am 19wks pregnant at the moment and it is Summer here so is hot and ds gets hayfever which all contributes to behaviour.
DS has added biting to his list of other challenging behaviours, it is almost always me that gets bitten when I won't allow him to do what he wants etc but has also involved other children occasionally. When it occurs at home he gets put in his room immediately and no tv for the rest of the day. When it happens out and about he gets put in the car in his seat (luckily he cannot undo his belt yet though it is a struggle to strap him in....if I don't strap him in he will rip pieces off the car and try to escape) He gets one chance out and about to calm down and come back into the situation then if he bites again it is straight home and into time out. He is strong, he is heavy and he is very determined and it is getting increasingly difficult for me to put him into a time out but at the same time I don't want to be his target of aggression and I can't allow him to stay near other children if he is biting them. It is happening more and more over the last few weeks and he now goes around saying "You have to do everything I want or I will bite you" I ignore this and then when he does bite follow through as said. Help...this is wearing me down, he has other challenging behaviours also but at the moment this is the one that is really hard going.

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

janeite · 04/12/2008 19:50

Star chart? A sticker for every hour, or section of time (eg all around Sainsbo's or whatever) that he neither bites, nor threatens to bite. X number of stickers = small reward of negotiable value?

Josie3 · 04/12/2008 19:54

It reads as if he's doing it to get the reaction. Don't get me wrong - i think that it's fab you've stuck to your guns and been so consistent - but it doesn't look like it's working. I'd try not even mentioning it when he does it to you - instead wait a few minutes then kiss or hug him and say ' I Love you darling'. When he does it to other kids ask him to say sorry and make a big fuss of the other child. If he won't say sorry then again ignore it.

You could also make sure he gets lots of attention and playtime with you when he's behaving - and make sure you tell him that's why you're playing with him.

He sounds incredibly smart if you ask me!

Original poster

yawningmonster · 04/12/2008 20:00

janeite...Thanks have tried the star charts he just says he doesn't want a star he would rather bite me

josie3 what about if he is just continually biting me or other children to get what he wants, it is very hard to ignore and just let him continue. He does get a lot of attention as I have said he has other behaviour issues, one of those being a complete lack of ability at amusing himself so I spend a lot of one to one time playing with him and do praise him lots when he uses his words or finds another way to cope with situations he doesn't like. We tell him every night what we have been proud of during the day making special note of situations which could have led to biting but didn't.

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Original poster

yawningmonster · 04/12/2008 20:01

I had better leave for work before I am late but will check back later, thank you for any ideas.

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Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 02:55

bump...please

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TheInvisibleManDidItWithSanta · 05/12/2008 02:58

There was a thread earlier on today about biting..will see if I can find it for you. May give you some new suggestions.

TheInvisibleManDidItWithSanta · 05/12/2008 03:01

here

Not sure if that's any help

Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 03:07

hi thanks had a little look at that link but children are much younger than ds.

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TheInvisibleManDidItWithSanta · 05/12/2008 03:16

Ah sorry. Don't really have any pratical advice- you're already doing what I'd suggest.

Does he go to nursery? (don't know how school system works where you are) Could one of the staff there suggest anything different?

Not much help, but atleast bumping for you

Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 03:19

he goes to a cm when I am work and that is the only time he has bitten other children, 2 times to the same friend on different occasions. She handles it the same way I do with an immediate time out. Children don't start school until they are at least 5 here and can wait until they are closer to 6. We haven't yet decided about when he will start it will depend where he is at in 6-8 mths time and whether he is ready or not.

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TheInvisibleManDidItWithSanta · 05/12/2008 03:32

What age do they stay in school till then?

Ds1 started school at 4 1/2, though ds2 was 5 1/2- missed the cut off by 6 days.

Hopefully the biting is just a phase and if you and your childminder are handling it in the same way, he'll soon realise he's not going to get his own way by doing it.

Shells · 05/12/2008 03:32

For me I would do a reward chart, but with the negative stuff as well. With a kid as smart as your one obviously is, I don't think just ignoring and praising good behaviour is enough. I think you've got to penalise for the bad behaviour too.

So choose something to take away/or deny him that will really hurt. Favourite toys. Bedtime stories. You say you've tried TV - well do something thats harder for him to give up.

And my kids are not fussed about stars either. But they are fussed about ice cream and toys and treats - so use those instead.

And also when he's calm try and talk to him about it. 'It makes Mum so sad when you do biting, why do you do that?' etc.
Good luck. My DS was/is fairly challenging too. Its hard work isn't it.

Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 03:37

thanks shells I might try a twist on your idea with the pasta jar type idea so he can see he gains and loses things depending on his behaviour. He doesn't really have any favourite toys or anything he would really be bothered losing.
Invisibleman school goes through until they are 17 or 18 years old.

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Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 08:13

bump

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Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 08:32

bump

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Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 08:53

bump

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claw3 · 05/12/2008 09:01

Basically everything children do is for attention whether that be good or bad attention. The less attention he gets when he bites the better.

He is only 4, perhaps an all day punishment is a bit much, plus an all day punishment is all day attention.

When he bites, i would tell him it really hurts and make him give the attention to you. Ask him to kiss it better or hold an ice pack on the bite etc, teach him some empathy. If you want to change a behaviour, you have to replace it with a new one. Give him some praise, thank him for making you feel better.

I know it all sounds a bit Mary Poppins, but you have to totally change the way you deal with it, if the way you are dealing with it is not working.

Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 09:14

claw3 I have tried that when it first started happening but he can't calm down enough to even listen about it hurting let alone stop doing it and helping me to feel better. I find the only way to protect myself is to remove him, the time out is for calming down but time out has never worked as far as stopping behaviours go which is why we took away tv priviledges (he is only allowed to watch an hours tv a day while I make the dinner as tv in general makes his behaviour worse so while you say an all day punishment it is only actually 2 programmes he misses. I agree that I need to change the way I am doing things and generally prefer Mary Poppins type tactics but ds loses the plot quickly and emphatically and literally can't can't listen once he has strated acting out.

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claw3 · 05/12/2008 09:16

How about a time out to calm down, once calm can you reason with him?

Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 09:21

yes once he is calm, I talk to him about him and he can articulate what the problem was and we talk about other responses he could have used etc but then the very next time I do something wrong like too little milk on his weetbix then he loses it completely and launches himself at me and hits, kicks and bites etc. My husband suggested I lock myself away from him until he calms down but he literally tears the house apart, breaks whatever he can get his hands on, rips books etc. I have tried teaching him ways of expressing his anger in appropriate ways but it all falls apart when the situation hits.

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claw3 · 05/12/2008 09:26

Have you tried no long explainations or discussions (all attention again). Just when he bites, time out to calm down. Once calm, just simply you bite me, it hurts, help to make me feel better, end of?

How about letting him put his own milk on his weetbix? What kind of things make him lose it?

Original poster

yawningmonster · 05/12/2008 09:34

yes have tried the short clear messages too. Try to avoid known trigger points but it can be a minefield, everything I do is wrong...if I say he can put milk on weetbix, he will insist I do it, If I ask him to tell me when to stop so I put the right amount on he will insist I decide etc and at any point of this conversation he will lose it. Other known flash points are if he is playing with other children in a way that is hurtful etc and I intervene in any way he will lose the plot, when I am too tired to play with him (am pregnant at the moment and can't always run around the yard with him etc, I usually give him some other options I can do) he will lose it etc. There are times when I dread doing something as I am sure it will set him off and other times when I am sure it will be fine and I can be wrong about both of these situations.

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claw3 · 05/12/2008 09:40

Heres an idea, i used this on my 2 older boys, when they were younger.

Im not a great believer in punishments, makes kids that are already feeling frustrated even more so. I do believe in time out to calm down.

I started a chart where they had to earn their privelleges. So i wasnt taking anything away, they were just earning it.

For example the rewards were favourite dessert if they earned 5 points, tv if they earned 7 points, half and hour special time doing something of their choice if they earned 10 points. You can never take away earned points.

Wisknit · 05/12/2008 09:44

Maybe he likes the feeling of biting? (I used to get almost uncontrollable urges to bite at the age of around 6. I can remember standing waiting for some spelling to be marked and looking at my teacher's arm and thinking how satisfying it would be to sink my teeth in to her arm (I am now a relatively normal person ).

How about giving him a special toy or something that he can bite when he feels like biting to get it out of his system?

Or if it is a reaction to something ask him to 'say it with words' and express himself.

Hope it improves soon.

claw3 · 05/12/2008 09:48

For example on my chart, if you made your bed you earned 2 points, if you did your homework you earned 3 points (already enough points to get a dessert) and so on.

For you, something like playing well on his own for 15 minutes etc, could earn 5 points (enough for dessert), managing not to bite could earn him lots of points and tv privelleges for that day.

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