I hate eating out with my DCs, what can I do to make them behave when we are in a restaurant?

[MmeLindt]

We met friends yesterday in a cafe for lunch. The DCs both had a children's meal. I had colouring in books and pencils with me so that they could draw but they were just really unsettled. They messed around, kept getting down from the table, and generally made a nuisance of themselves.

DS is 4yo and DD 6yo.

AIBU to expect them to sit and behave at the table at this age?

I don't expect them to sit for hours but at least as long as it takes us to have a meal without making everyone in the cafe turn and stare. My friends are lovely, but as yet childless and I can just imagine what they were thinking.

I was in tears last night because of their behaviour when we were out. At home they are ok but when we are in public they are awful.

YANBU to expect good behaviour in public at that age. I expect (and get it) from my 2.5yo!
I expect dd1 to sit at the table at home until we have all finished as well. Its manners IMHO.

My DD is almost 4. Generally she behaves but not always and we have eaten out lots with her and also make her eat at the table every meal at home. I find that giving her a main course when we have our starters helps as she generally eats slowly. Also, entertainment is good, possibly more than just one thing. While I agree that they need to learn how to behave, they are only children and adult conversation is really boring for them. Some days are better than others too, I guess we all have on and off days.

Overall, I often feel that DD is the worst behaved child when we are out but have spoken to other parents who think the same about theirs. So don't give yourself a hard time, you probably felt much more conscious than everyone else.

mytetherisrising
Yes, but how did you manage to get your DCs to behave, was there any particular "trick" that did it. Were you very strict about table manners? Did you use bribes or threats.

Strawberry,
I am clinging to the hope that they were not as bad as I feel they were

I agree in theory to the child friendly places but feel that we should be able to go to ohter places too. Next week, we have no choice, we have to eat breakfast in the hotel.

Build them up slowly.

at first go to places where you are served very quickly, so that the whole experience doesn't last too long for them. Just have a quick snack

Build up the time. and go reasonably often so they get used to the idea

Make it clear to them that you have the right to eat, just like they have the right to go to the park. If you don't get your treat (the meal) they don't get theirs (the park)

We do allow toys, DSs nowerdays! between courses on silent. TMy two are now safe to take out for long peroiods of time, but it has taken a while

That is a good idea, MB, to connect it wiht a treat for them. Will try that. I find myself connecting bad behaviour with sanctions more often than rewarding good behaviour. I know that it is wrong, but at the time all the good parenting advice seems to flow out of my brain.

Yes, I have always been strict on it from the first time she could feed herself with her fingers at meals. Always sat at the table in the high chair, always sat until we had all finished, so from about 8/9mths. She hasn't known any difference iyswim.
If she has been sat a long time and seems to be getting restless I do get her down and go for a little walk with her, usually to nosey in the toilets , shes fine then for a while longer. I also am lucky because she enjoys reading books so she will sit for ages with them.

I do use the carrot and stick approach If you sit nicely we can go to the park later or if you don't you won't watch dvd when we get home, that sort of thing, depends on what is happening for her at the time regarding what she can/can't have/do iyswim.

Its sounds too simple to work but it works with mine (6 and 5)- just before you go in tell them nicely what you expect of them. For example if we are going shopping, I say at the door mummy needs to do a bit of shopping and I want to walk nicely with mummy, no running off and no shouting. If I do this they are perfect. But if Im in a rush and forget all of a sudden all hell breaks loose as they act like they are in a playground. Why they need reminding everytime we go Im not sure

Orangehead
That all sounds very reasonable, but they knew that we were meeting friends for lunch and that they were to behave.

It was the last time I will see my friend for quite some time as we are moving away so I was very annoyed that the monsters were so feral

Don't beat yourself up, it was probably not as bad as you think and just seemed it in contrast to your friends with no kids.

We have done the sticker books and colouring route. Sometimes lots of little toys like kinder egg things will do the trick too.

They are still young and it will get better.

Mine know when they should behave too, but unless I am quite explicit with what I expect of them at that very moment, they dont.

Practice.

We have always taken DD (3.10) out for meals and as a result she knows what to do and does it. I never, ever take along any kind of toy to distract her. She is expected to behave properly. She loves ordering her own meal now, and enjoys the conversation.

i feel your pain

we went to a fab restauant which had a gorgeous childresn den upstairs, with x boxes, playstations, games etc..

i thought what a fantastic idea...loved it, but it is no where near where we live

I think it's worth considering exactly what we each mean by "behave" in this context (I can't help it, I keep thinking of the wicked would-be stepmother in Nanny McPhee...)

Do we mean

sit quietly

not draw attention to yourself

eat your food without dropping it

talk politely with the adults

not interrupt the adult conversation

not run around

not require entertainment, attention or occupation

be seen and not heard

not set the cafe on fire

What do we mean, exactly?

It's only once you've answered that question (not here, I mean in your own head) that you can answer the AIBU question for yourself. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect children not to set cafes on fire. But I think it might be unreasonable to expect children to be seen and not heard during an adult-centred social gathering.

This isn't aimed at the OP, I don't know what your experience was or what your expectations were, it's just that "behave" ("beehave beehave beehive BEE HIVE!!") is a trigger word for me, as it was for Simon in Nanny McPhee

Anna8888 you do sound a teeney bit smug.

It is more difficult with more than one child.

We have three children .

Honestly, like any skill, practice is the key.

DCs are 3 and 5 and they are capable of engaging in interesting conversations, staying in their seats and drawing pictures.
Alas is so much more fun for them to blow raspberries at each other!

Excellent post, onwardandupward.

DS is only 2.10 and there is only one of him, so I suspect this is easier on both counts. I always pack a tonne of different things - K'nex is always good, and Lego (especially a new set).

I remind him of pudding coming as a treat. TBH, I don't tend to do "if you won't behave you won't get X reward" because it's not always practical if you're out with friends (you can't exactly leave at will), but I do remind him that it will be coming, because fidgets stop children from remembering that good things are coming.

Always suggest brightly and firmly to assembled company that you have coffee and pudding together, and as soon as pud comes, ask for the bill, if you can possibly do so without embarrassment.

And I do agree with previous posters about involving kids in conversation - perhaps at their age, you could allow them to demonstrate some magic trick or other, or tell a rationed quantity of jokes. In fact, planning in advance what they're going to tell/show your guests might help them feel involved. Dunno really.

we take our dcs out at least once a week to restaurant, usually just the 2 but often enough dsd also, ages 6 (the dsd), 3yrs and a 7 month old. Feed up the older ones if not sure theyll eat what's there and they have puddings while we have our main course. I take magazines (have stockpiled a lot) couple of books to read, blank paper to colour in and colouring books and stickers. Theyre all used to going out fortunately and look forward to going to eat but that doesnt mean to say 100% of the time theyre great, i just bite my lip and remember theyre only kids, theyd probably rather be elsewhere while i sink into the floor!

I agree onwardandupward - it really does help to think through your own expectations of behaviour from your children, and what you can do to help them meet those expectations.
Ours have always been good if somewhat fidgety when toddlers, luck of the draw being a big factor IMO. Now they are older they can go anywhere reasonably reliably. We have always been quite strict with them in restaurants etc - but also stayed closely engaged with them when they were younger - colouring books, chat, helping them with the menu etc.
Tbh MmeLindt, I think the biggest "problem" for you yesterday was your childless friends. Lunching with your children and other women who don't have any yet is always going to be much harder on you. I have yet to meet a child who will not fail to show its parents up when in the company of childless relatives or friends.
I wonder if you are being too hard on yourself and your children
I would get lots of low-pressure practice in with them as a couple, and if you are not already doing so, explain the cuisine, the occasion, big up how lovely it is to lunch out with them, bla bla.
I know that telling the dcs we are proud to go out with them, even when this is not necessarily the literal truth applying to the whole event does encourage them to raise their game. This can be turned on its flipside to hissing under your breath "people are looking at you you little savages" .

I get the dcs to order their own food from the waiter, for example. I think it reminds them they are not sitting in a bubble with only their parents for company.

I agree Marina.

Little children are so pleased with themselves when they manage to do things like order their own meal that that in itself keeps them "good".

I recognise so much of what you describe, MmeLindt. We went through something similar when we moved. At the time I thought I had two uncontrollable monsters I couldn't take anywhere, but looking back I realise just how unsettled they were by the thought of moving to a new country and how this was reflected in their behaviour. They were the same age as your dc when we moved.

Try not to let it get you down too much as things will probably improve when they settle into your new home, maybe not immediately but it will get better. It took ds longer than dd but he did eventually settle and it has become possible to take them out again in public - and I have (mostly) stopped thinking that there must be either something wrong with them or with my parenting skills.

Good luck with the move.

Gosh, kids are sometimes just bloody awful in public. Don't beat yourself up. I know how frustrating it is (and some of these replies must be making you feel much worse ) Tomorrow is another day.