Raising Boys

[LunaFairy]

After reading a post regarding a mothers worry about her ds, a recommendation by another postee advised to buy a book called 'Raising Boys'. I decided to buy it (i've never felt the need to refer to a book before about my child) but I wanted to understand a bit more about 'boys'. Being a female and having a large age gap between me and my older brother, I felt a bit out of touch with understanding what boys go through as they grow up. I finished the book today - It's a great read and it's highlighted some points that I hope will help me understand so much more about my little man. Has anyone else read this book?

er...just looked at my copy of the book and the surge is supposed to be at 4...is my copy way out-of-date? guess so since the above says 5!

ps slarty - i have also spied the excellent opportunity to use DH as a scapegoat heh heh!!

Yeah I read it - it is interesting and it does seem to account for a lot of educational differences.

I got annoyed though when it said you shouldn't put your ds's into nusery. How to take the guilt and magnify it a thousand fold....

oh i missed that bit about nursery, perhaps i read another book by the same author?
how to have a happy child or something?

or more likely i glossed over the nursery bit

yes wasa that's my biggest memory of 'raising happy children' - the nursery guilt. argh argh argh.

Steve - I'm confused?

In your book you site that boys aged 4yrs have a rush of testosterone giving them the same levels for a while as a 12 yr old boy - you in your comment just now you say:

"I don't know of any hormone changes or special naughtiness
peeaking at four. "

Can you clarify this please?

Yours is a good book but very harsh on mothers how have to work and need to put their kids into nursery....

O my! I'd compeltely forgotten about this.

Steve, if you're still checking in, thank you for joining us on this thread. Firstly, can I say I found and continue to find your book extremely helpful and very insightful into the mysteries that are my husband and sons.

The testosterone issue has been discussed several times on a number of threads here on mn. I agree the pubescent testosterone surge is well established along with its influence on behaviour (apologies I wasn't clear about that in my original post). However, when challenged in another thread to find any supporting evidence for the 4-5 year surge I couldn't. The original research wasn't cited in your book, I wasn't able to identify any studies on PubMed or a wider google search or in a couple of medical text books I had access to. If I'm wrong I would be more than happy to be corrected.

[shick]

Dang

Should have read [shock[

OH fgs

how uncanny..... dp and I having horrible time with ds at the moment (not all the time but when it is its awful) 5 almost 6 - possibly testosterone fuelled behaviour. Normally lovely companiable, agreeable, reasonable, fun ds just won't listen to anything when trying to get him to do some things or not to do some things - have tried explaining what could happen if he doesnt'listen or act - have tonight imposed sanctions (no bed time story)... We have read the Steve biddulph book so maybe its time to revisit it. Has anyone else out there any tips to help us all cope with this 'phase' - we are feeling really stuck.

hi oldtimer - i welcome any evidence (the jury still being out on this thread: steve, come back and clear this up for us please) that the surge is indeed at 5/6 rather than 4 bcs i am hanging onto that as an explanation for our normally cool and funny DS's general Bad Attitude at the moment! he is driving me to distraction. flouncing around like a mini-teenager (normally the job of my 7 yr-old DD), answering back, cheeky, bursting into tears...it really does feel MOST hormonal, i must say!!

SteveB, if that is really you, I would also like to see a list of the research and studies you quote for the testosterone surge. Saying "but the following information is well established" is meaningless and does nothing to advance your case.

It seems to me children can misbehave at whatever age, whether it be 4 or 14, all ages in between, before or beyond. It is convenient and simplistic to blame hormonal changes. Please show me the proven evidence for these surges and evidence that these changes result in specific difficult behaviours.

I dont think it was him after all....

Well, an apology is owed to blueshoes, boobalina, and especially pheebe, as well as everyone else.

I have just gone back to check over the book and you are right, the "surge" is given as being at four. Right now I am checking back
to find the source for this, RB was written
twelve years ago and I don't have all the material, which was in the days when you went to libraries and photocopied everything.

But given that there don't seem to be any other sources for the early testosterone surge idea, its likely that it may not be verified. So watch out for this being not included in the next edition.

I apologize for coming on so pompous and know-allish in my first post. The power of knowledgeable and reasonable mums has won over an ageing and clearly losing it old
dad, and I stand corrected. Thanks to everyone for being so gracious about it. I recently retired from being an educator (I haven't been in clinical work for the last twelve years). Probably a good thing !

For sudden naughtiness - at four, five or six, it sounds a better idea to look for other reasons ! Bye and thankyou.

Steve B.

yes..i've read it, thought it was very good.

Steve (can hardly believe it is really you!), can I also say thank you for taking the trouble to join us. You didn't come across as pompous at all. I found your book very helpful and would like to say thank you for the ideas. My current fave is "How to Talk..." and this thread has reminded me to have another look at your book.

Excellent critique of this book here.

Excellent?! I beg to differ. Drawn out feminist diatribe at best. And really, really boring. [yaaaawn]

Wow! I was planning on getting this book as my DS is nearing two and we have another (apparently male!) baby on the way. I have a new found respect for the author now!

Pheebe it is absolutely true that boys around the age of 4 have a testosterone surge almost as high as at puberty, and it explains a lot of the behaviour changes around that time. I've just recently been on training all about boys and they reffered to this surge.

Fascinating thread, i'm going to email my tutor to find out where she got her evidence and get back to you.I've got to be honest as the mother of 2 girls and then 2 boys now aged 7 and 4 I do believe the theory

I think the book is really interesting and has certainly helped me and my DH when shaping some of our ideas around becoming first time parents to our DS. I also got the raising babies book on the back of how useful I thought raising boys was.

FWIW its worth I though the critique posted above was extremely dull as well.

I have been in Childcare for 30 years, as well as having my own DS, and yes I would definitely agree with the testosterone surges.

The 4 year old one turns them into the Tasmanian Devil

The 14 year old one turns them into Kevin the Teenager

I got the book. Don't like it at all. Better book - the how-to-talk-so-kids-will-listen book. I think when you have only two boys like I do personality differences are more important than gender differences. Might be more relevant in institutional settings.