CO-SLEEPING TO COT & OTHER SLEEP ISSUES WITH BREASTFED BABY BOY (8 MONTHS) - HELP!!!

[MamaTama]

I'm a single 1st-time mum, am currently co-sleeping with my 8 month-old DS (& have been ever since he was born) but am now faced with a predicament which relates in a lot of ways although not exactly to phlossie's previous post (15th May). Please respond if you have any constructive comments...
A bit of background:
we recently moved from a bedsit to a 1 bed flat & he's still in my double bed but I'm totally exhausted due to being woken up anything from 5-10 times a night after being with him all day long. Sometimes I know he's hungry & he's also teething (he mekes a specific noise when he has that kind of pain & I give him homoeopathic Chamomilla immediately) but other times it's like he just wants me cause I'm there!
So here I am at 1am in the living room instead of in bed where I should/need to be (again) & he hasn't woken up since I put him down (breastmilked out!) at 9.30 when I really want to go & lie down. This has happened several times so I'm assuming he must be able to smell me when I'm in the room & this is unsettling him from his sleep.
In desperation I got a cot to place at the foot of my bed & am in the process of painting it but am apprehensive about what will happen when I try to move him out of our cosy nest & into an unfamiliar space - should I take him straight out if he doesn't react well (my heart says 'yes!') or leave him to cry for a while in the hope he gets over the initial shock of this new enclosed, seperate sleep environment (my sleep-deprived head says 'please, do whatever it takes to get me some rest!")?
I've procrastinated a bit over getting it all ready to use if truth be told, but he's just begun to crawl & I'm feeling like it's unsafe to have him napping or sleeping in my bed without a rail/guard now. TBH part of me would like to continue to co-sleep with him but I also feel a strong need for a little space. It's really intense being his sole carer & day & night closeness in reality is becoming a bit claustrophobic for me, much as I love him & have been applying many principles of AP in my interactions with him, including carrying him in a sling for the 1st 6 months almost exclusively (although I now alternate with buggy), breastfeeding on demand etc.
Living in the bedsit for a few (6) months after his birth & then gearing up for/actually doing the move has meant we don't have a solid set routine for bedtime in place, save an orange glowing salt lamp in the bedroom after dinner & breastfeeding to sleep, the other things we do are variable from day to day, which I'm aware is probably not helping. He can sometimes just drift off to sleep by himself if he's really tired or resettle without some form of attention/comforting from me if he awakens briefly, but not often.
Any suggestions on easing the transition from bed to cot & encouraging him to sleep on his own for longer periods would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your contributions!

No advice I'm afraid but I'm sure some much more experienced mum will come and advise you soon! Just wanted to say that I think you've done really well to be there for him as much as you have as I know how claustrophobic I feel being around my baby all day sometimes and that's without co-sleeping!

My only advice would be to set up a regular bedtime routine eg: bath, read a story or sing to him, breasfeed then bed. Preferably as early as possible. I get my ds in bed by 7pm or els I know he will be in a fowl mood the next day and is also more likey to wake as he is overtired and wound up from the day.

I'm sure someone will have some much better advice to offer soon! Good luck!

I'd say good idea, we slept (DS and me) much better once he was in his cot. And he now sleeps even better since he is in his own bedroom - turned once last week.

and don't be too apprehensive babies adapt well to new situations. You could for example put a sheet on the new cot that was in your bed for a few night so that it has your smell on it, make sure baby is sleepy before you put him in cot.

Bedtime routine is a very good idea. And he can go for a while without milk so have you tried giving him water from beaker or bottle instead of milk at night? I think some people might dissagree, but if he wakes up for a nice drink of BM and gets water instead, he might not bother waking up anymore after a few night.

Thanks to both of you for your replies, encouragement, empathy & advice.
So far he doesn't have a set bedtime & analysing the reasons why one sad but true fact is the earlier he goes to sleep the longer I have before I turn in without any adult company (before I had him I had a very active & varied social life & was always out & about, now most nights I'm here on my own). Really feeling isolated from my friends, most of whom are either childless or have grown-up or teenage offspring so at a different stage of life & with totally different priorities etc. I don't seem as close to many of them as I was previously, some have stopped contacting me or replying to my calls & texts, or if they do it's very brief & sporadic - I'd heard that this sometimes happens when you have a child but never thought it would happen to me!
As for bedtime routine, as I said there is very little consistency. I'm disappointed in myself in this respect as I was a teacher for almost 10 years prior to becoming a mum & know very well how important predictable routines are for helping children feel safe & secure, but whilst I provided this for my students I'm not giving the same to my son as yet & really want to get something in place soon, ideally at the same time as I introduce the cot. The lack of firm routine is also probably partly due to the fact that I sort of rebelled when I was off duty & lived very freely & spontaneously in my home life, not having set mealtimes or order of activities outside of work. Basically I've been used to totally going with the flow in my own private life as I had to function to a tight & rigid timetable in my professional one, but that's something I'm going to have to get over if I want to provide my DS with what he needs & deserves. I know it's not going to be easy but I must do it!
The sheet idea for the cot is a great idea which I will definitely be trying. He won't drink water though (day or night) despite repeated offerings, neither from bottle nor beaker so that one's out, he just messes around with whatever receptacle I've put it in, spits or dribbles it down his chest & eventually throws it on the floor!
Thanks again, hopefully more MNers will respond over the next few days with more info & suggestions.

I totally agree with the bedtime routine thing. I'm very much like you, had a regimented work-life and (much to my surprise) turned into a go-with-the-flow earth mother type when my DS was born and I think in most ways that's the best approach (especially when you're breastfeeding) but one thing I started when he was a few weeks old was a bedtime routine, as much for my sanity as his, I think!

Can't offer much advice on the bed to cot situation as my now three year old is very, very happy in my big bed and shows no signs of moving out! I did have a cot with side off next to the bed and he used to begin the night in there and then move in with me at some point in the night but now he has formally taken over the bed... All children are different and from what you say yours might be up for it. I am constantly surprised by how many things DS takes in his stride that I agonise over. Our situations are quite different though; we didn't actually start co-sleeping until DS was 9 months old when a mixture of being able to crawl and separation anxiety really took hold and he was waking up every 45 minutes so. Co-sleeping meant he went from screaming his head off when he woke to rolling over, stroking my cheek to make sure I was there and then going straight back to sleep. If you've always co-slept your DS may be so securely attached that he may now be happy to loosen the ties a little? Have you had a look at Elizabeth Pantley's No Cry Sleep Solution book? It's very practical and as the title suggests offers solutions which don't involve any CC techniques.

Sleep issues aside, being an AP mum is a big practical and emotional commitment (though one imo that will pay off in the long run)and although you sound like a really lovely little family you do sound quite isolated. All my pre-child friends were either childless or had had their children earlier than me too but luckily they've all stuck around. However, I've also found it invaluable to have friends with children the same age as DS to compare notes with. We started going to playgroups when he was very little and we've both made some fantastic friends that way. I've also found attending La Leche League meetings is a good way of finding like-minded mums, especially when I felt I was the only woman in SW London still breastfeeding her baby past 6 months!

Sorry for the ramble but I hope some of that is of help to you

Hi there, just wanted to say that we stopped co-sleeping at about 8 months (LO is now 10 months and bf). Like you I was wakened up many times in the night by a fidgeting, rooting baby who really didn't need milk but would half-sleepily have a nuzzle and a drink. I put her in her cot in at the foot of the bed and she started to sleep through almost straight away.

It wasn't without some shouting, but she wasn't upset just telling me she wasn't happy at being put to bed. I sat on my bed and patted her (she kept moving my hand off her!) I think my being there and not picking her up made her upset, so I sat at the foot of the cot where she couldn't see me so I could shushh her. I edged my way out of the door a little more each night.

I have a voice activated mobile/lightshow from Mothercare which worked really well for her (its a Tomy Winnie the Pooh one).

The bedtime routine is important, she knows that its tea, bath and bed, with the last feed being done in the dark in her bedroom. She's in her sleeping bag, relaxed and warm. If you are missing the closeness, perhaps you could bathe together instead?

Hope this helps. I know how hard it is, but you have lots of support and friends on here

Dear house of mirth, glad I'm not the only one who had a totally double life going on, I don't think being a Gemini helps in this respect either!
Thanks to you & Foxythesnowfox for the messages of support, useful suggestions & affirmation that routine is important but that also emotional intelligence should play a part in making these decisions, which is what I feel anyway.
My rough plan is to set the cot up (with Mamatama smelling sheet!) & try to get him to take daytime naps in there (when I need to be getting on with things). That way I know that when he wakes up he'll be safe & can just call out to let me know he wants to get out: at the moment when I'm in another room I dread hearing a dull thud, I've lost count of the number of times now over the past fortnight he's woken without me knowing & quietly managed to get over the various makeshift barriers I've constructed to keep him on the wall side of the bed & into trouble. Once he was actually on top of the glass table (of course from pre-baby days!) Actually it was my own bedside table from my mum's house when I was a kid so really don't want to get rid of it. He was just about to knock the stereo to the floor & had a very proud & mischievous look on his face, like, "Look what I can do now!". Several other times I've gone in just in time to stop him dropping off the bed altogether onto the wooden floor, so the cot would avoid a repeat of these worrying scenarios in future.
As to night-time, like I said part of me doesn't want to stop co-sleeping & he's about to hit the 9 month mark with possibly increased separation anxiety, so maybe I can work out a compromise such as putting him down for the night in the cot but then bringing him into bed for the last couple of hours before we get up so we still get snuggle-time but I also get some space to sleep?
THOM: funny you should mention the Elizabeth Pantley book, I'd never heard of it but found it the day after I typed the 1st message about this in a charity shop & bought it for £1.99! I've had a chance to have a quick flick through & really like her approach as it seems so versatile & customisable to individual circumstances. I need to get it together to keep a log for 3 days to analyse what's going on now before attempting to work out a strategy for Jahleel.
We are isolated in some ways but I have tried to get to some groups, some just didn't suit me at all, others we went to regularly for a few months but that fell apart when the move was coming up & he'd outgrown them by the time I was ready to take him again. I'm in the process now of finding some new places to go/things to do appropriate to his new-found mobility & other skills & interests.
As for the bedtime routine, I've notived he sleeps better & longer after a bath, but can I commit to giving him one every evening?!
Thanks again for your help, this site is a real lifeline!

Good luck with it all & keep us posted. As far as the bath goes until recently I always had a bath with DS so it became something I looked forward to rather than a chore. Of course you could have a bedtime routine without a bath...

Anything at all can become his routine. I only mentioned the storytime and bath as that's what made my ds sleep through fairly early so I stuck with it! If you would rather have a certain nursery rhyme that you sing, or baby massage, then breast feed then bed, go for it!

Don't feel you have to commit to bathing him every night if that's not what you feel comfortable with. it has to be right for both of you!

Also, not sure if this has been mentioned but perhaps get him a comforting soft toy or a blanket that he only has in his cot so in time he will assosciate this with going to sleep so if he wakes can comfort himself back to sleep before he wakes fully if you see what I mean!?

It really does sound like you have a very secure relationship with your baby so I'm sure he will adapt well.

I know how hard it is to be on your own with or without the baby. Although I sometimes look forward to a bit of time on my own once ds has gone to bed, I sometimes dread it as I know I will be sat with nothing to do and no one to talk to. My dh works a lot and 3 nights a week works 12 hour nightshift and 3 days a week 12 hours dayshift. Needless to say I'm on my own a lot until his 18 days off come around every 7 weeks. It is lonely and like you my friends (even my best friend) has drifted away from me. Even my friends with babies are not consistantly in my life as we all have a lot of things going on.

It's hard but I really think once you've set up a bit of a bedtime routine, the day will have more of a rhythm to it and he and you will know what to expect and when which makes it easier to plan trips out to see people and socialise a bit.

Anyway, I'll get off before I blab on anymore . Take care!

Hi again Meandmyjoe, you weren't blabbing, I really am grateful for all the comments & suggestions (& feeling of genuine empathy) from you & the other people I've been lucky enough to have had contact with in the short time since I joined the MN community.
He has both a familiar blanket (made of supersoft bamboo knitted fibre, a gift from a well-off friend) & a velour teddy bear which he nuzzles into, they will definitely be going into the cot along with sheet scented with eau de Mamatama as per previous post.
Jahleel's been asleep for almost 4 hours straight so far tonight in the bedroom (I'm in the front room typing this so as not to disturb him but checked a little while back & he's totally out for the count). Totally unheard of, usually it's 1 1/2= 2 hours max at a stretch!
Downside to that is my breasts are now filling up to bursting capacity & I'm not too hot at expressing manually or with pump, so getting itchy-tingly sensations which are not too pleasant (too much information?!)
We went to... wait for it... baby gym for the 1st time today. I think I may have found the perfect outlet for that mad energy he's got (virtually non-stop, from 5am he's ready to rumble & sometimes doesn't hit the sack til almost midnight!). Unfortunately it's only on once a week for an hour though, could do with 1 @home 24/7! Do you think there's maybe a charity out there somewhere willing to offer me a grant to convert my new living room into an adventure playground? He's sprouting muscles in places babes of his age (8 months now) are meant to be all soft'n'squshy, starting to suspect he's some kind of superhuman!?!
I've been strangely motivated by your messages of support & am pleased & proud to say that I've been doing some late-night cot painting since the weekend (with eco-friendly linseed based paint - don't ask!). A total farce: once I read about the solvents leaking out into the surrounding atmosphere for up to 3 years with conventional paint I was paranoid about using that so ended up shelling out money I can't really afford for a truly non-toxic natural alternative, which smells wierd but quite nice at the same time. When midnite munchies hit it was all I could do to stop myself having a little taste just out of curiosity!
Now that's blabbing!
I'll let you know of any further developments...
Oh shouldn'thave spoken too soon, he's awake now!

Hi mamaTama

i thought I'd better come on here and say hello and welcome, since I haven't yet got a chance to on our August thread. I read your profile and came here.

You sound like a fabulously intresting person. I look forward to talking to you
It is hard being a first time mum, and especially on your own. Your doing a great job.
i have 2 ds's now. One thing i have noticed between my 1st and 2nd is that ds1 (in retrospect)was so pandered and spoilt. he never slept well, and still doesn't but from day one at the hospital they said rock him, etc, etc. all these fussy things.

ds2 however has been alot less doted on and sleeps much better.
I found it hard to move him from basinette to cot, and into his own room. i used to always put him to sleep in a basinette, but after 1am feed we co-slept. But when i did get the courage to move him to the cot, he has been so much better, now only wants his cot.

anyway, I guess what i'm trying to say is be careful not to fuss too much and spoil him, as they do get used to it, and they do start to over power you with their wants, especially around one, when they start to get their brains into gear.
i hope that doesn't sound to mean mummy. anyway it's quite late in my part of the world Oz, so i'll say good night, maybe i'll make more sense tomorrow

Wow Mamatama - you sound like you are doing a brilliant job. I'm also a work regimented gemini who turned into a hippy as soon as my maternity leave started!

My dd is 17 months and I'm still cosleeping. So - I haven't got any advice about getting babies into cots yet.

I'm sorry to disagree with Uki - I don't think you can spoil a baby. I just think all babies are different. Just go with the flow and do what feels right.

I have a routine with my dd - the usual old chestnut of tea, bath, pj's, story and milk. I've just given up BF'ing so she has a bottle of cows milk.

Have a look in your area for some baby groups. There are loads in my area, often held in church halls. £1 entrance fee with a cup of tea and cake/bicci!!! I have found them fab and now know lots of local mums. It's also to nice to just get out of the house and great for babies to watch the hustle and bustle of it.

Good luck with things - I understand about neding a bit of space tho. Have you got any family nearby? In the early days when dh used to work long hours I used to pop dd into the car during her nap time and drive the 60 miles to my mums. I used to stay overnight and go home the next day. It was a weekly Thurs/Friday habit in the end! My mum was ecstatic to have all he time with dd and I got to have a sleep/pop to the shops etc!

well I can eat my words anyway rosie as I co- slept last night with ds,he was just not a happy chappy and ended up in bed with me, after I put him in bed with me he went straight to sleep, and didn't even want to get up early.

although it was nice having him there, i feel he is safer in his cot, less chance of being rolled on, or covered, or overheating. SIDS don't recommend co -sleeping in that respect, and I'm paranoid.

yes all babies are very different, and i often wonder if second ds is naturally easier, or is it because i know what i'm doing now, and more relaxed second time around. Probably a bit of both. I agree that you should spoil newborns and younger babies, but i've had a lot of friends spend a year and half with their babies not sleeping, and I don't think that's good for mum or bub. I think they wake out of habit by 9 months more than anything. My ds does still wake once, too. So i'm trying to offer water and settle rather than feed now.

Opps so sorry Reesie

Hi Uki & Reesie, thanks for words of welcome & sharing your experiences & opinions.

I really am finding it's a delicate balancing act as Jahleel gets older - meeting his immediate needs reasonably quickly & stalling him a little for other things to help him learn patience & to encourage him to amuse himself a bit too. I believe some things should be attended to more or less straight away but at times (when especially overtired) it can feel like he wants whatever it is yesterday & I get an anxious, under pressure sensation in my stomach. At 8 months there is definitely a degree of understanding there, but I'm careful not to expect too much of him: after all he relies on me to take good care of him & I chose to bring him into the world!

As I mentioned above Jahleel seems to relax a lot & sleeps more deeply after a bath (a very attractive prospect!) but I'm wondering whether I'm really up for doing it as part of a nightly routine? He gets half the water out of the tub onto the floor (more cleaning up!) & then just wants to drink milk as soon as he decides he's ready to get out: if I try to dry him properly & dress him for bed before BFing he gets really upset, crying & kicking, but if I don't he crashes out on me wrapped in damp towels & it's a nightmare trying to get his PJs or sleepsuit on when he's all limp (I've tried & he's woken up very annoyed to put it mildly)...

Also, I've never really gotten into the bedtime story thing, I always have a dim orangey lamp glowing in the corner of the room, too dim to read by, & anyway books excite him too much, for the eating-the-corners value as well as for the pictures!

So needless to say I'm having difficulty trying to decide what exactly to do with him on a regular basis to signal wind down. Anti-routine gremlin strikes again!

Mother & baby groups: in theory a great idea, but in my experience not always so in practice.
I find the interactions can sometimes be a bit false/superficial & also quite cliquey &/or competitive, none of which I find remotely enjoyable, in fact despite trying out quite a number since DS was born I still hadn't found any I felt comfortable in - until the other day.
I saw an advert for a parents group with free creche facilities for the LOs a short distance from where I live: it was a revelation! Real people with their guard down (not a fixed grin in sight xx!), being totally honest about their lives with children, for better or worse. Not non-stop moaning but talking through some of the issues & problems they face, discussing possible ways of exploring, easing or solving them & also sharing some of the joys of having young ones. With a healthy dose of wicked good humour thrown in.
Such a broad mix of people, all there in companionship, a non-judgemental, relaxed atmosphere & space to drink a (still hot for once) cuppa without having to worry about scalding anyone! I was at ease the minute I walked in & Jahleel had a great time in the creche playing alongside with babies & toddlers around his own age. Can't wait for the next session (in a couple of weeks time - Bank Holiday this Monday so it won't be on).

All my family is up North (Newcastle way) or abroad, so no support or respite from them, & most of my friends are too busy to give me any kind of break (a couple of my neighbours do sometimes take him for a walk in a nearby park, but it's not a regular thing, though I'm grateful for every minute of 'free' time they give me). I've been in London most of my adult life but it's a different city with a LO, quite isolating at times if you're not in a super positive state of mind & ready to go out & throw yourself at total strangers.

Got to go now, I've typed this in 3 slots in between seeing to little man's needs & I need to have a sleep myself now!

Goodnight (or goodmorning/afternoon) to all, depending on when you actually read this.
Mamatama

I don't actually read ds a book at night or else he is far too stimulated by the pictures and trying to grab the book! Basically, I bath him, take him upstairs to his dimly lit room, give him a massage with his cream as he gets dry skin in his arms and legs, as I'm dressing him, I tell him a story (always the Hungry Catapillar, as I have memorised it! Sad I know but he expects it now and he loves it!) Then feed him abnd pop him in bed. There's loads of different things you can get him to associate with sleep though so do whatever works. I admit the bath is a bit of a palarva but it works for us and he also tends to get quite grubby so needs one!

That sounds like a great idea Meandmyjoe, thanks for following the thread! I might try it tonight if I have the energy...
I took him to baby massage class from 5 weeks to around 5 months but he's too wriggly to go there now. Doesn't your LO resist getting dried & dressed after the bath though, even with the story?
For DSs dry skin have you tried pure shea butter? It's a bit pricey but it's 100% natural & a little goes a long way. I get mine from L'Occitane & it lasts for months if you don't go over the top!
xxx Mamatama xxx

YES! He has always hated being dressed, always protested/ cried and wriggled to get away! Sometimes the story works at distracting him but not always! Even if not, he still expects it as when I say the first line of the book, he stops wriggling for a second and smiles so he is listening!

Oooo I haven't tried the pure shea butter but I have heard it's good. i will invest in some as the stuff I use at the minute is on prescription which is free but I go through sooooo much of it, it's not that good either so I will give it a go. Thanks x

Oh so Jahleel is just doing what babies do in resisting getting dressed then? He also cries every time I go to put his bib on at mealtimes which I don't understand & must admit I find a bit annoying as he then forgets the upset when he has the bowl in front of him & starts tucking in to the delectable concoctions I've painstakingly prepared for him! Ditto for face & hand washing, even when he's just enjoyed a lovely breakfast or dinner (about to start giving him a proper lunch everyday too). Hoping he'll grow out of it fast...

I really would recommend the shea butter, but make sure you get the pure form & not a cream that contains it as it's usually just a tiny amount & the rest dodgy chemicals. AFAIK the prescription creams are based mainly on petrochemical products/mineral oils which sit on the surface blocking the skin's tiny pores which is obviously not a good thing. If only you could get natural remedies, lotions & potions etc. on the NHS: yes I know, dream on!
I've been using it for over 10 years now & apart from olive oil & plain water, is the only thing I've put on Jahleel since he was born - no soap or bubble bath or anything except a tiny squirt of plant-based shampoo when I wash his hair & he smells gorgeous (of course I would say that but other people have commented on it too so not just biased Mama's opinion)! The cosmetics industry is scary, if you want I'll email you an article about all the nasty additives they put in everyday toiletries but prepare for a shock!

Anyway, typing this while Jahleel has a nap when I should by fixing myself a healthy lunch so bye for now!

PS Cot onto final coat of paint now so watch this space!

I use olive oil too, i've always been too concerned to use any shampoos or bubble baths on joseph, especially because of his dry skin. I would be interested in the article abput additives as my dh is always saying there's nothing harmful in them!!!! My email address is [email protected] Feel free to email me!

You'll have to let us know how it goes with the cot. I am really hoping it is a smooth and stress free transition.

Better go get Joseph his breakfast! Bye x

Hi MamaTama

I have a 9 month old DD, and accidently fell into co-sleeping when she was about 5 months old for a couple of reasons.

When she was 7 months old, I decided that I couldn't cope with the constant alertness I felt in the bed, and the 15 breastfeeds per night. However, she looked petrified the minute we tried to put her in her (almost too small) crib.

We went to Mothercare (only because I felt that I had to get something THAT night, after a horrendous one, and couldn't wait for something like Ebay) and got a bedside cot. It is fantastic. She now sleeps in her own cot, beside my bed. This means that she is not so close to me that my lovely milky aroma wakes her, but when she DOES wake, she is easily reached by me rolling on to her mattress, feed and roll back into my bed!!

Ok Meandmyjoe, will email it to you tonight if Jahleel stays asleep long enough (if not tonight asap). It's a really good article (although written by the founder/owner of a natural bodycare company who obviously wants the reader to buy his products it still has lots of very valuable, precise information about the worst, most common ingredients in everyday toiletries).

As for cot, final coat done & almost dry!
Jahleel's taken to rolling or crawling over the rolled up quilt I've got next to his mattress on my bed & getting into the little bit of space I've got left, maybe he senses his days (or rather nights) in the nest are numbered? I really want to make the cot cosy & inviting for him but must admit I don't like the bars at all.

If I had more money & space I'd probably have opted for the co-sleeper add-on type mattress as mentioned by llou031205 (thanks for your message, glad you found something that suits you!) but I unfortunately I don't have that choice.

Still haven't got any closer to establishing a proper night-time routine so any further suggestions welcome!

The financial issue is another story & possibly another thread, trying to stay positive about my situation but Maternity Pay's due to run out next week...

UPDATE:

Well, the final coat of paint took ages to dry (or was I just looking for excuses to delay the inevitable?!) but last night I put it together next to my own bed after I put DS down & when Jahleel woke for the first time at around 10pm I BFed him back to sleep (or so I thought) then gently placed him in it...

... he immediately opened his eyes, looked left & right & began whimpering & staring at me through the bars with an expression of --- (what? I don't know so won't speculate) on his beautiful little face, whatever it was it was awful. I kept repeating "Sleepytime now, it's ok." again & again in my softest voice but it did no good, he was reaching out to me & started to cry for real, but with a tone I've never heard before. Truly pitiful.

I couldn't stand to see him like that so I picked him up & held him close. He stopped crying immediately but turned away when I offered him the breast & then leaned very gently into my body as I rocked him with his head on my shoulder. He stayed like that for a minute or so then pulled back to look at me in a searching quite solemn way. I found myself kneeling there with tears rolling down my face, Jahleel making a small 'Uh' sound every time a teardrop fell, which only made me cry more. I kept trying to smile saying 'It's ok' even though I felt anything but. He slowly moved himself so his head was over my heart & was very still. A silent, intense moment passed & he gradually sort of bowed with his head down on my stomach, crouched with his bottom resting on my crossed ankles in the darkened room. Very wierd, I really felt like something big was happening, which I suppose it was/is.

I never said I wasn't the sentimental type (I most certainly am!), but was surprised at how emotional I got.

Went in to check on him at around noon (in cot for nap at 10.20): he was awake but calm & quiet just touching the different parts of the cot & smiled at me when I said 'Hey, did you have a nice sleepytime?'. He even used the railings to pull himself to stand from the bed side when I took him out.

Wondering how it'll be tonight when I put him into the cot from the beginning instead of part way through his nightime...

UPDATE PART 2:
Last night bath then massage (well sort of anyway, I just rubbbed whatever part was nearest as he squirmed around all the while singing Twinkle Twinkle!) then BF then bed.

J slept 7.40pm-1.20am then had long BF before going back down 1.45-5.30ish! Then snuggled with him in the big bed for a couple of hours this morning before getting up to have breakfast & play. He's woken briefly each time I've put him down in cot after BFing to sleep but seems ok with it, settled really quickly.

Now I just need to try & get a routine sorted for him & once I have something do-able, stick with it as much as possible.

Mamatama

PS MAMJ: Did you get the article I emailed you?

Hi Mamatama,
i found your threads while trying to search for advice to my own situation which is similar to yours!
Sera is 8mo and has been co-sleeping with me since birth and for the past 2 weeks i've been trying to get her into her cot. Its been an emotional rollercoaster! We tried unsuccessfully at 6.5mo (kept screaming to come back in bed and for BF and me being sleep deprived would bring her back, plus it was so nice to cuddle
It wasnt my intention to cosleep as i also have a 2.5yo who has always slept in his own cot and by 7mo was sleeping thru (such a champ!)so i wanted to adopt the same principles for Sera but it just didnt work that way for a number of reasons.
I dont regret cosleeping at all as it has created a beautiful bond between me n Sera - i now wish i coslept with #1!
For Remy i followed the routines in a book called 'Save Our Sleep' by Tizzie Hall. Being a first time mum this book was recommended to me by other experienced mummies. We didnt really stick to the day time routines everyday as it was variable (but tried as it led to good night time routine). But the idea is that you put your baby to bed FULLY AWAKE so that he is aware of where he is falling asleep so that when he drifts from one sleep cycle to the next he doesnt wake with a fright wondering where he is. The book says not to feed/rock to sleep then be placed into cot. If you can imagine if you fell asleep in yr nice warm bed then woke up to find yrself in the bathtub! you'd wake with a fright too!
So this is what I have been trying for the past two weeks. Most nites she still feeds to sleep as she is so buggered plus my toddler needs attending to before bed so i found it easier just to put her straight into cot. Of course this meant that 1hr later she would wake up crying and i would go in to try and resettle her every 1/2 hr for the next three hours when i would then give up and give her a BF! haha...so then back into cot to sleep until approx 2am and i would resettle her. then she may sleep for 1/2 or 3 hrs before screaming her head off ...at this point i am sooo tired i just drag her back in bed with me for BF and a cuddle back to sleep. Phew.

Tonight she put herself to sleep...tho i suspect it was to the soft piano music as she went back to sleep straightaway after i turned it back on and did not need to physicaly settle her. So....im trying to stay positive and believe tonight we r making progress...
Its just very different to my toddler who is a great sleeper and yes i am finding it a huge challenge, so if anyone has any advice on how to transition from cosleeping to cot that would be great!
Hopefully hubby's days of being banished to the living room will soon be over

Congrats mamatama on making it thus far, Jahleel sounds like a very lucky boy to have u as his mummy

Hi, great to hear that things are improving mamatama. Yes I received the article, it was very shocking! It really has opened my eyes to not only the products we use on Joseph but also our own products. I did reply saying thank you but my lap op battery died just as I'd sent it so I'm guessing you didn't receive it! Thank you for taking the time to email it to me. x