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Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

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Original poster

Screaming child, becoming a problem,...really it's glass shattering! Child banned from playgroup. Any ideas to stop it??

48 replies

Beenleigh · 08/10/2007 13:00

I am absolutely fuming!!!! A friend of mine has been asked to leave the church playgroup she goes to because her DD (nearly 2) screams a lot. Apparently other parents have complained. It seems outrageous! (ffs if the child had special needs, then there is no way that this would be acceptable!)

However, the screaming is very loud, glass shatteringly so sometimes, and my friend is struggling to deal with it. It's been going on for several months now, and shows no sign of abating. I think she does it to express a wide range of emotions, but often when she's excited.

Are there any books you could recommend which specifically deal this??

Be very grateful as my friend is very upset, and would love to give her something useful to think about/focus on.

Many Thanks

OP posts:

Original poster

Beenleigh · 08/10/2007 13:20

bump! Come on guys, need help.
Alternatively join me in slagging off the crappy church playgroup!!

OP posts:

donnie · 08/10/2007 13:28

has she consulted a health visitor about this ? I can understand parents complaining though - I would imagine sustained loud screaming would frightn a lot of small children so maybe the group's organisers felt they had to bow to pressure.

Sonds like she needs to talk to someone about this.

DANCESwithHughJackman · 08/10/2007 13:29

See now I really, really feel for your friend but at the same time my dd would have been terrified by a child who screamed all the time. I really hope you can find someone with some good advice. Church toddler groups can be hellish

LadySnotAlot · 08/10/2007 13:29

My goodness, that's rather narrow-minded of the playgroup! Are there any alternative ones your friend could take her DC to?

If not then I really think your friend ought to go back to the playgroup and ask them to refer to the initial and then standard government training they have to go on so regularly. There must be something in there that helps them deal with behaviour issues in small children.

In any case, your friends DC is just a normal child and that's what normal children do. or does she live in Stepford and all the other mothers have perfect children?

LucyJones · 08/10/2007 13:30

do you mean a church laygroup where the mums stay with the children or do you mean a pre school type of playgroup?
If it is the second then it isn't the other's mum's problem it is the staff.

Lulumama · 08/10/2007 13:31

hmmm , tricky.

i imagine , for parents to complain, they are either narrow minded, or it is absolutely unbearable , loud sustained screaming which is disturbing to younger children.

is it all the time?

TBH, my DD has been playing up at a group we regularly go to, so i have taken her elsewhere to save my blushes, and she was so much better behaved in a new environment.

so they might be doing her a favour

bobsmum · 08/10/2007 13:32

church playgroup or not, I can see that parents would complain. there's only so many times you can shrug something like that off if it's been going on for months like you say. If the child had special needs then yes I think it would be different, but AFAIK this girl you're talking about is NT - yes?

Agree with donnie that talking to an HV would be a good start. At almost 2, there are definitely ways of telling children "no" firmly.

My dd is 2.3 and understands the difference between silly noises/quiet voices and screaming etc and has done for several months now. But we did have to practice and show her how to do it. Copying games are good or songs with loud and quiet bits in them.

LucyJones · 08/10/2007 13:32

If it were my child I think I'd take them outside everytime they started to scream and firmly tell them to calm down.

morningpaper · 08/10/2007 13:34

I agree that screaming can really distress other children, I'm afraid

I had a friend's child who was a screamer and it wsa VERY stressful to be around him

Personally I have bollocked my children when they have screamed, and this has nipped it in the bud

If I was sure it was not a development issue, I would take a zero tolerance approach and inflict whatever was her harshest punishment for not screaming - e.g. time out

And praise and chocolate buttons if the child made it to bedtime without a screaming fit

Screaming children are bloody horrible IMO

SpookyDooooo · 08/10/2007 13:34

Yiikes what an awkward situation, i can kind of see why the playgroup has asked her to leave as some children are very timmid & not used to noise, my ds hates loud noises always has & he is now 5 years old, he still puts his fingers in his ears when i hoover or hides some where.

I do however sypthaise as i have a dd who is 21 months & she is a screamer but not through excitment, she screams when she does not get her own way, or is having a tantrum which these days is alot, she screams till she is red in the face, really embarrassing screaming.

If i was your friend i would maybe speak to a health visitor or smoeone to see what she could do to stop this, is she just screaming when she is over excited etc? what happens if you tell her to shh & keep it down? does she understand, suppose she may be a bit young still.

spooklesandwhine · 08/10/2007 13:46

Hmm I really do feel for your friend but can also see the other point of view i'm afraid, as it can distress other children if the screaming is very loud and for a long period of time

However, it is not very sympathetic to just kick someone out especially at a time when the quite clearly need some help and guidance for their child

I agree that your friend may need to talk to a HV to get some support and ideas (or send her onto MN as i'm sure there are plenty of people who can offer good advice on here )

does her DD do this at all play groups or just this one? if its just that one maybe she doesn't like it and thats her way of showing it!

maisemor · 08/10/2007 13:50

Instead of banning the poor mother and making her feel bad could they not have helped her??

I thought these kind of groups were "created" for mums to support eachother, give eachother advice and teach the children to play with and around eachother.

Did they actually talk to her before they banned her.

Is it actually legal for them to ban her and her child?

bobsmum · 08/10/2007 13:51

If it's been going on for months I guess we don't know if it had been talked about before the mum was asked to leave.

pagwatch · 08/10/2007 13:53

Actually I do have a Sn child who used to scream - and frankly I would have never expected other kids to put up with it. He could emit high pitched screams for sustained periods and it was AWFUL to be around. It is really frightening for little ones - especially new children.
He was at an NT nursey at the time and what i did was every time he did it I imediately lifted him out of the room saying only No very firmly. When he was calm and quiet he could return.
I eventually moved to an SN nursery and again they had zero toelerance.Between us , with a consistent approach that never gave him attention or reward for that behaviour, he stopped doing it.

So sorry but I can't personally be too grumpy with the nursey/playgroup and i have been in exactly that situation.

Lulumama · 08/10/2007 13:53

maisie. it is not the job of the volunteers who run the group to give parenting advice and support, for things they are not trained in. i used to run a playgroup, did not mean i could have solved the problem of a constantly screaming child....

cornsilk · 08/10/2007 13:53

I think it's out of order to ask her to leave. Who are they anyway, volunteers or a professional playgroup? Would they have asked a child with a dx of autism to leave if they screamed?

Original poster

Beenleigh · 08/10/2007 14:17

Thanks all, it's a church play group drop in where the parents stay with the children.
Thank you for your replies.
I really do understand that it's not nice for other parents or children to hear this, it is very loud, and my DD2 (8 months) cries when she hears it. However, I do not hold with the idea that we can just exclude someone (a child ffs) because their behaviour is difficult. Any yes, I agree completely she needs help, not ostrasising!

My DD1 goes to the same playgroup, and around the time that DD2 was born, she started indiscriminately grabbing other childrens faces, now imo that is far more unpleasant behaviour, but no one said anything ot me. I was desperately trying to deal with it though, and I think the reason that people are annoyed about the screaming is that my friend just seems to try to ignore it.
I'll print this lot out for her. Many Thanks for your replies.

OP posts:

cornsilk · 08/10/2007 14:20

Hope your friend finds a more tolerant group to go to Beenleigh.

Lulumama · 08/10/2007 14:23

" I think the reason that people are annoyed about the screaming is that my friend just seems to try to ignore it. "

maybe that is the key to it, not that people are intolerant, but that she is not visibly tackling the problem.? in which case ,if it has been going on for months and is affecting other parents' enjoyment, then surely she should tackle it?

Tortington · 08/10/2007 14:24

i would ask the P&T group for a copy of its formal complaints proceedure and a break down of how it is funded.

complain to the help group and forward to funders ( national lottery, local council whatever)

re child: ( this is where i get flamed)

i would wag finger and firmly say "no" remove child to bedroom for 5 mins each time it happens.

i think its rather like raining a dog not to shit.

same principle

it might sound like the bleedin obvious.

Tortington · 08/10/2007 14:25

if happens in play group - maybe associate the negative sanction with a rug. buy a round time out rug.

Blu · 08/10/2007 14:32

Has your friend tried to stop her screaming?

BlueberryPancake · 08/10/2007 14:40

I really don't like it when people compare children to dogs. especially shitting dogs.

with that out of the way, there'sa good book with tips on how to deal with that kind of issues: New Toddler Taming by Christopher Green.

I go to afew play groups and take my kids to a group on Sunday morning that runs as part of a church ofEngland church. That group is by far the unfriendliest and judgemental group we go to. I think we might have to change church...

maisemor · 08/10/2007 14:55

Luluie, I did not mean and I did not write that it was up to the organisers/volunteers "to give parenting advice and support, for things they are not trained in".

I said "for mums to support eachother, give eachother advice and teach the children to play with and around eachother".

BlueberryPancake · 08/10/2007 15:29

ok i thought a bit more about that. Teaching a toddler what 'stop' really means is an important first step I think. How I did it with DS1 is for example, to get some musical instruments out (his drum, tambourines, etc) and we play until I stay stop (or POP, like he says!). Then we start again, and stop when I say stop. Each time he stops with me, I praise him give him a kiss, say good boy, etc. We can do this with songs as well, or with anything like running in the garden. We run together and stop when I say stop, then praise, start again, etc. Then when he says POP, I stop.

If I say stop to him, he really understand what it means and will stop, without feeling that he is being 'told off'.

Your friend could practice that, and then move on to stopping bad behaviour at home (not when other children are around), starting to positive reinforcement. When that is working, try it when friends are around or at play group.

I'm not saying that it will work, I'm no expert, but it's a fun and positive way to go about it. GOod luck.

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