Good old fashioned smacking

[heepie]

I don't believe it did me any harm and I do wonder why the previous generation, ie mine, was so much better behavied than the current, ie my kids. I find the softly softly, ignore bad reward good behaviour does not work with a strong willed child and find myself more and more thinking what was wrong with a good old smack? Peeing on the floor right in front of you with a big smile on the face surely warrants more than the removal of a star on the reward chart? And whacking little brother over the head with a heavy object? Not eating something very nice and edible that I have slaved over in the kitchen? Why must we never tell our children to eat what is in front of them when I wasn't allowed to leave the table until I was finished? I don't have an eating disorder. I think it's time I through all the modern how to bring up children books out of the window and remember how it was done when I was a child? Anyone else feel this way?

It's not a case of

1. smack her
2. let her get burned

There is a third option

3. remove her.

If you can get to her quickly enough to smack her before she gets burned, you can grab her and move her. Put her in a playpen, buggy, diffent room, hold her on your knee. All of these while saying NO. the options are limitless. The difference is you might have to do that 50 times before the message gets through, whereas you might only need to smack 5 or 6 times before the message gets through, so hitting might be quicker, but is it better?

Now I can only answer that question for myself. And it's no. For me, it's not better. I would rather move them 50 times to pass the message than hit them 5 times to pass the message.

I am a firm believer in consequences and in being strict, but, for me, there are other ways of acheiving that than smacking. They just take longer!

snowleopard - just reading through the thread and see that you 'parped' at 13.40... Parp withdrawn, eh?

(In complete agreement with you, BTW)

I also think with fires etc and other dangers, parenting is a balancing act where you dfo sometimes have to let a child see that things can hurt them. So I do as M2PW says, remove my 2yo from a fire and explain it's hot - ouch - and say no, as many times as it takes. But if he persists with a heater that's not too hot, I'll eventually let him touch it a little and find out - if I judge that it's safe. And if he persists in tormenting the cat, eventually he'll find out that he will get scratched. Natural, genuine consequences - finding out what actually happens if you do silly things - make far more sense than a smack.

I was smacked a lot as a child and like someone else on the thread, right up until I left home at 16, often round the face.

I always thought I'd never smack as I was so outraged by the injustice of it. Ds1 is 9 and I think I did smack his hand once, can't remember why, I think he was about 5 and he did something awful to dd when she was a baby.

She is now 5 and has had several however, and I feel dreadful about it, started a thread a while back asking for help with it as her attitude and rudeness and utter refusal to listen to me was making me see red to the point of losing control and smacking a leg or hand.

It amazes me that people might choose it as a form of discipline, it makes everyone feel awful and achieves what exactly? I do my utter best not to let it get to that loss of control, even leaving the room helps a little, and I am ashamed of doing something I wholeheartedly disagree with.

I used to have arguments with a friend who simply couldn't see the problem with her sister smacking the 9 month old's hand to stop them pulling books off the bottom shelf.
Her reply was consistently that he doesn't do it now. Of course he doesn't, when he explores there, mummy hurts him. I find that horribly sad.

wonk, I'm a pathetic parper! i always get drawn in.

But I guess i parped before I understopod the OP to be genuine.

It doesn't really matter what you think. It's against the law if it leaves a mark which is usually does so anyone admitting it on here is breaking the law. The law is as it is because most right thinking people know that hitting a child is wrong.

It does matter what people think, surely, that's the difference between them doing it or not?

How often is it actually enforced, the law? I haven't left a mark with my dd's smacks, they've been on the leg through trousers as she runs away. It's still worng surely?

Okday example... NSPCC been the charity my boys' school has supported last term. Had a talk the other week. Every single child came out with an NSPCC wrist band with their web site and phone number. They all know how to call childline if a parent hits them. Children are clever and wised up and thank goodness for that. No other people in society are we allowed to hit- fed up with the checkout girl at Tesco? Why not slap her around the face for bad service. That'll teach her eh...

I do believe that smaking children is wrong - they have the same basic human rights that an adult does.

I was smacked as a child and would when asked say that it had not done me any harm, but how do I know? I have a good relationship with mother and grandmother responsible for this but on the downside, am a fairly shy person and feel awkward in many social situations. What might I have been if I had not been smacked? It is not possible to say with certainty the effects it has on a child.

I would just add that I am opposed to criminalising smacking. Child abuse is currently and should remain illegal, there cannot be a sane person who would dispute that. However, those parents who at the end of their tether smack a child in anger (and I have done this on 2 occasions I can think of) are wrong and often wracked by guilt but should not be categorised as criminal. If I was prosecuted for smacking my ds because he had bitten me, could I plead self-defence - utterly absurd. Like it or not, some different factors apply in a relationship between a parent and young child.

Those of you who are happy to hit, particularly in a calm way. So ... if you had a dispute with your husband. You thought you'd done something ok, he felt you'd done something horrible. So he calmly hit you, to teach you not to do it. Is that ok?

(And how would it feel if he hit you in a rage of anger? Still bad, but probably not quite as bad, I'd bet.)

I just don't see how anyone can tell children not to hit and then go ahead and smack them. We need to try and model the behaviour that we wish them to emulate. I know it's not always possible but I just think it's bullying for a bigger person to use their physical strength against a smaller person. I know there are situations where we have to use force with our children, but smacking as a regular form of discipline is IMO unacceptable.

Were ther previous generation really so much better behaved than the current generation?

As as child I was smaked. I was a naughty child, but have never forgiven my parents for smaking me (apart from the time my mother hit me around the face for screaming in her face when I was about 9, and I could tell from the shock on her face she hadn't meant to do it)

I would never have been smaked for the instances mentioned in th OP.

Why on earth would somebody smack a child for peeing on the floor and smiling? DS2 went through a phase when he was 3 of peeing in the house and in the porch. He and DS1 found it very funny. I showed my disaproval, adn told him not to do it again. Smaking a child for something like that makes me feel sick.

I'm not the calmest person in the world, and DH and I have both been know to hit walls when our children have really, really pushed us.

At the weekend DS1 was so cross about something that he kicked in the glass in the front door. DH and I would both have received a "good hiding" if we'd done that as a child. Instead, I gave him a hug, and told him he must be feeling awful. He hugged me back and sobbed. He had to got to buy new glass with DH and help him fit it. DH will probably take the money out of his bank account to pay for it.

If your approach works so well then why the pee on the floor with a grin?

Nuff said

Plenty of men around the world use physical discipline on their wives and say it works. Long tradition of it. There are even Christian and Muslim texts setting out things like how wide or narrow the stick should be.

By the way anyone saying criminalise - it is already criminal if you leave a mark. Get the children camera obiles or web cams they set up right and you could find yourself all over youtube as a child beater. Nice revenge for the child. Serves the parent right.

the only time i will tap dds hand (i mean tap not leave a mark) will be if shes doing somthing dangerous, ie. putting fingers in plugs, near a hot cooker, trying to grab a knife off the side at MILs [dont start me on that].

other than that i wouldnt do it.....i wasnt severly damaged by being smacker....or was i?? im a fairly average human being now but when i was younger i self harmed.....i had a major shock and thought i was in the wrong so i hurt myself......you do wrong you get hurt surely thats the message.....theres nothing to say that wasnt what caused it....the same as theres nothing to say it was.

but you do something dangerous and get a tap (rather than a cut on your arm, burnt hand, electric shock) i dont think is a problem

I have never understood what a tap is.
Can you feel it?
Does it hurt?
Does it leave a mark?

iv never left a mark on my dd and shes had a tap a few times as mentioned above, i doubt very much it hurts mroe shock than anything, i know if i shouted she wouldnt listen and would get seriously hurt, its the lesser of two evils!

"If your approach works so well then why the pee on the floor with a grin? "

are you serious?

this is pretty normal child behaviour

for a parent not to realise this is a bit unsettling.

Smacking is totally unacceptable. I was smacked hard as a child, by my father. To look at me now you would say that it didn't do me any harm, but it did. It certainly didn't do me any good.

I still think about it from time to time. I can still 'see' the outline of his hand on my leg where it had gone bright red. He used to smack my little brother too.

The day it stopped was when my brother was 13. One day my dad hit him and my brother punched him in the jaw and knocked him over. He then stood over him, with his fists raised and calmly said "You will never smack me again", then he spat on the floor next to my dad's head and walked off. My dad was shitting himself.

I will never forget that day. It was awesome.

Since then my relationship with my dad has improved dramatically and we are now good friends. But, as I say, I vividly remember the smacking and there is nothing he can do to make me forget it.

I am also completely confused by smacking. If its just a tap, what is the point, and if its inflicting pain, whats the point? I am hoping to gradually teach my children that there are consequences to their actions and that they can make choices - I am teaching them to be grown-ups. I sincerely hope that as grown-ups they never live in a society where a consequence of an action is getting a smack.

By the way, I also think trip trap re: the OP. To post on MN that you both think that smacking is OK, and that there should be a punishment for not eating food/having a toilet training accident

You can discipline (i.e. teach) your child without shouting or smacking.

Actually i already stated that i tried restraining/ removing BEFORE smacking. Again, you are not listening. There was no other room she would have been any safer. There was no playpen as it was a friend's house. I do not, i repeat, smack my children as a matter of course. And i certainly do not thwack them. Are you saying that when your children misbehave you get sooooo angry that you can't control yourselves? If i am so angry i can't think straight i remove myself or my child from the room before i lose my temper.

What is wrong with a smack?

It teaches children that it's OK for a big person to hit a little person. That's what's wrong with it.