The right way to handle bad behaviour - ignore it or lose your rag over it!!

[mammabelleboo]

My 20 mo dd has been demonstrating naughty behaviour in the shape of biting, scratching and pushing. She has scratched from 10 months and has also now progressed onto biting and she will shove other kids when they are trying to join in with things she's playing with. With the biting and scratching, she has been worse lately with the onset of temper tantrums - I guess the terrible 2's! This behaviour comes out when we stop her from doing something she wants to do or if I pick her up from playing when it's time for nappy change or whatever. She really gets quite angry and has a real 'rage face'on her. I've tried time out in her cot - after a few mins I'll go up, get her to say sorry 9at that age I don't suppose she knows what sorry is, but it makes me feel better!) and when I say 'Why are you in there' she will say 'scatched Mummy' - so she knows exactly what she's done. This dosn't seem to be working as she is continually doing it and I'm at my wits end. Today, I tried another tactic - she grabbed both my cheeks and pinched them really hard - so she was inches from my face and I bellowed at her as hard as I could and burst into genuine tears. This sent her into an absolute paddy as I think I scared her (now feel really awful as I've probably mentally scarred her for life!!). I'm just so desparate to snap her out of this bad behaviour - I can cope with it more when she does it to us or family but I don't want her to do it to other kids or she'll have no friends! What's the best thing to do - keep on with the time out, bellowing at her etc and letting her know i'm not happy with her or just ignore the behaviour? Am I fuelling it by giving an almighty reaction? It dosn't seem right to ignore as that's like condoning it! Help! - Sorry this has turned into a bit of an essay - hope you are all still awake!!!
Any advice welcomed. Ta!

A 20 mo is not capable of understanding the reasons why you are shouting at her, and is not being naughty by any reasonable explanation of the word. The behaviour you describe is pretty typical for a child of that age.

If she wears an angry expression, it's because she's mimicking yours. Any attempts to reprimand will be met with complete frustration for a long, long time to come.

If she pushes other children around, just gently and consistently remove her from the area. She will soon learn to accept that she musn't push and shove.

My DD is 21 months and neither her nor any of her peers I know through m&b groups have that behaviour so I don't know about it being so common?

It sounds terrible though. Good luck.

CoteD - no offence but what planet do you inhabit that no toddlers that you know exhibit typical toddler behaviour. Mamma- it sounds like your dd is leaving babyhood behind and entering toddlerdom which does require a different set of parenting skills to babyhood (and different babies get there at different times - my ds started at 18 months, the tantrums and stroppy behaviour peaked at around 2 years and he is now slowly leaving it behind at 2.5 - he is starting to understand "sharing" and taking turns and that his actions have consequences. I think that it is important to ignore some behaviour as far as poss (tantrums) but it is necessary to step in and remove your dd when she is harming other children. I always have said "no hitting!" quite sternly as I remove ds and as he gets older I now make him apologise to the person he hit. He almost never does this anymore and I thank some really good toddler books for the advice about consistency. Hope that that is of some help...

blimey Cote then i don't know what groups you go to! I've never met a toddler who DIDN'T display this behaviour!

i agree, firm but gentle and consistent is the way to go. A firm NO, then putting her down or walking away; and then straight onto distracting her with another activity. I don't think you can 'snap her out of' this behaviour because it's part of human nature that children learn by exploring their effect on things, and the biting and scratching is part of this. I'd be careful with insisting on an apology etc in case it means you are focussing on the issue too much and making it into guaranteed attention from mum.

I think it's all about distraction at this age, while telling her firmly that we don't hit/bite/push etc. But no child gets it straight away. You'll need to persist with it but it will work.

And do you give her fair warning before you pick her up for nappy changes etc? Kids can get very angry if they feel they are wrenched away from things with no regard for their feelings!

Mammabelleboo, one burst of rage from you isn't going to scar her for life. But repeated outbursts will teach her this is the way to behave. So it is best to walk away if you know you are going to lose control.

There was a 3 yr old girl who went to day care with DS who regularly behaved like this. He was on receiving end of a bit and several wallops! The woman who ran the session (trained in childcare, several years experience) said that you mustn't ignore this behaviour, you must do something to show the child that it is wrong, but at the same time you must try not to give the behaviour too much attention. She said some kids get it first time round, others have to be told hundreds of times.

Good luck with staying patient.

I mean a bite!

Oh yeah - the other thing that it is worth working on (and I have yet to master it myself, but when I remember it works a treat) is to learn the preemptive strike tactic. So when you know that you are going to have to make dd do something that she won't like - distract her - get a favourite toy and put a nappy on it as well at nappy changing time, when you see a toy is going to cause friction with another child distract dd with another "more exciting" toy. And don't feel too bad about crying when dd hurt you - the reality is that if she did the same thing to another child, the child would react by crying (or fighting back) and the other child's parent would be furious. Your dd needs to know that her actions can hurt others so that she begin to develop empathy - and it is better that she finds out from you than by harming another child.

I have a 14mth old so my suggestion may be way off the mark but what about offering an alternative, eg 'kiss the little girl' or ?

My tactic if she bites is I take her off, look at her and say 'no biting' in a boring firm voice then I say 'kiss mummy or blow raspberries' and then make a big play of ha ha ha yayyy when she does. She is pretty good, doesn't bite much (at the moment). Mind you, this isn't in anger... And I think this is only the beginning of tantrums I feel

Thanks all for your good advice. It's a relief to know that the majority of you - sorry CD - all believe this is normal - you don't know how much better that makes me feel! I will try to keep calm and deal with this in a consistant, controlled manner by letting her know it's wrong but not in too much of a ballistic way. I can see othersideofchannel & HGlossops points of view that it's not good to give it too much attention - ranting in her face, stomping about & bellowing for England is maybe a tad too much attention!!. Must admit I do just tend to grab her from whatever she's doing when I want her to do something else, so yes, I suppose that would get her back up!! Will try talking to her a bit more about what we are about to do! Also like the distraction tactic to avoid an embarassing encounter with other kiddies. Thanks for some constructive advice. Just about to go pick her up from Nanny's now so will tune in later to see if any more chat! Hope she gets a good report and Nanny bears no battle scars!!

Just read yours mummymagic - that is a good tactic and I have tried it in the past. I've painted a bit of a black picture of her and she is an extremely loving child and will give kisses as a sorry in great abundance. She shoved my friends little girl on Friday and I made her say sorry and she did give a big hug - so that does work. just wish she wouldn't do the naughty behaviour in the first place!! I have also tried saying 'No we don't scratch/bite/push, we blow kisses instead!'..and that did work well, but I think she finds it a bit predictable and boring now!!! sometimes though, I worry that it might make her confuse anger with love!!??

Definitely no more bellowing. Even shouting at her is giving attention. I would definitely go for the ignoring approach and maybe explain once all is well again why you were ignoring her. She is still very young but it will sink in eventually. My son has just turned 2 and he only needs the promise of being put in his cot when he won't let me change him and he lies still.

Hmm, maybe we live a different life here in South of France - more outdoor weather, beaches for kids to run free, etc. Maybe that makes toddlers less aggressive?

I have seen kids (incl. mine) bite/scratch other kids on occasion, but I have NEVER seen a 20 month old make it a habit of biting, scratching, and hitting her own mother.

Well ... in England it's a sign of affection

Cote D'I live near a beach and my ds runs free out of doors (with supervision) every day, even when it rains - whilst I know that this fresh air and exercise is important I think it plays a very small role in dealing with a child's in-built personality. My ds has never bitten me, but he has hit me once or twice. He has never done this in public (only at home - testing boundaries with me), so anyone who knows me will not have seen it (I don't tend to advertise his transgressions for all and sundry, but deal with them quietly at home)

Chances are you are not seeing EVERYTHING that is going on with other people's child-rearing (and perhaps you are simply lucky with the nature of your dd, or maybe as she gets closer to 2 yrs you may find you need to eat your words (and I hope for your sake that that is not the case)) In any case, MN is great because people can tell each other probs that they are having without letting the whole RL community know what is going on and get advice and experience from other Mum's which is both reassuring and helpful.

Anyway for all I know the OP could live in the South of France. I am not sure that your geographical location predisposes you to well-behaved children. If it does perhaps I should give up my parenting techniques and just relocate - problem solved.

I'm in northern France and so was the biting/pushing child I mentioned earlier.

Ignoring is an amazing tactic. When my DS1 was about 18-20 months he started having tantrums about nothing. 4 or 5 a day for a few days. I realised after trying to give him what he wanted/snapping him out of it or whatever that NOTHING was working, so I just ignored him and let him get on with it. (I used to sit on the sofa reading "Toddler Taming" by Dr CHristopher Green for moral support!) After about 1 week of this, he got the message that lying around kicking his legs wasn't going to do it for me and totally stopped having random tantrums.

Now we have a new baby they've started up again a little. So must LISTEN TO MY OWN ADVICE!

I always say to my husband that the tantrum is a kind of monster that eats attention and inhabits my child for a while. If it finds that there is no food supply - ie. no attention - it goes away again. Eventually.

I think with specific bad behaviour eg slapping kicking biting, you do have to censure the child, but in a low key way.

I think at this age there is an element of frustration, they can't communicate well enough and it comes out with aggression.

My DS1 was a biter and it drove me to distraction. I took him to a behavior specialist at my GPs in the end. She told me to keep a diary of incidents - what, when, where, to who, how I reacted, what happened next. It gave me a perspective on it that it wasn't happening ALL the time which was really helpful.

It helped me to manage the situation and my reaction to it. It is very upsetting for us too, so I wish you lots of luck with it

That is so true, about ignoring the tantrums!

Also do try to remember that they all push/shove/hit - and its because they can. I guess its about learning, and us teaching, those boundries of behaviour.

mammabelleboo, I could have written your post about DS. He bites, pinches and scratches both myself and DH and other children and has done for the last 8 months. Sometimes he is an angel and other times he just looses his rag. Our current approach is firstly to preempt any situations, if he appears to be about to bite to say "no" firmly but calmly and remove him from the situation and if he does hit out or bite or throw a violent tantrum say "No that hurts" calmly and give him some time out until he calms down. The main thing we are trying is not to give negative attention as that seems to exacerbate the problem. We do seem to be getting through this slowly. It's always worst when he is overtired so we have to watch him then.

No offence Cote D'azur but were you trying to be helpful with your first post!??!

Even if it were true that none of the kids there are like that (and I find htat very very hard ot believe), is it really helpful to the OP to say so.

Yes MN is about being honest and not just telling people what they want to hear BUT....

mmbb - don't worry about scarring her for life. It can't happen from one time of shouting!
Re. the naughty step or cot - IMO your little one is far too young to understand such a concept
It's all about voice tone, distraction and consistency at this stage
Firm voice tone, with you down at her level
Distraction to either avoid the event happening or to ease away any tears once you have "told her off"
Consistency - speaks for itself really!

Hope things get better. It can be a very trying age can't it?
x

Don't wish to hijack this thread, but it made me fee better too.
DS1 has always been strong willed but has never been one to scratch/bite/hit until DS2 was born very recently.
He now hits both me and the baby and while both DH and I keep telling him "no hitting" he does still do it when he is feeling tired/bored/ignored.
I cant imagine ignoring this is the best way to stop the hitting, but what is? Any ideas anyone, did the Toddler Taming book have any suggestions?

Just read all the posts since my last check with both interest and gratitude!! Thank you all so much for your input - it really has been helpful. The main thing that seems to be coming through is staying calm, being firm in a controlled way, pushing the ignore button and using distraction tactics..will put them into practice ASAP! Obviously, not wishing my experience on anyone else, but it is a comfort to know that dd is not unusual in her behaviour & anyone else in the same boat - I hope you sort things out too. CD - should point out that my dd is not continually naughty - the bad behaviour surfaces sometimes daily, sometimes not - but in my book that's too often, hence my post. She is the light of my life and is a darling child for the majority of the time - maybe I'm expecting perfection but i find it hard to tolerate this bad behaviour. i was bullied as a child and no way is any child of mine going to be a meanie to other children! But thanks for your input - life sounds rosy the other side of the channel!!!

Oh no, I am so confused now. I am supposed to ignore bad behaviour?
I would have thought that the best way is to make kids see that there will be consequences if they don't behave, I can understand ignoring a tantrum if they want to watch TV or want another chocolate,etc, but if they are being somewhat nasty to other kids (or their parents!) not sure that is the right tactic.

sorry, (too early in the morning), meant to say "Am I supposed to...."