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Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

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Original poster

Am I wrong to refuse my 5 month DS feeds during the night??

92 replies

henrybaba · 04/02/2007 20:27

In attempt to get my first full nights sleep since last August, I have decided (in consultation with DH) to try to limit the number of feeds I give my DS during the night.... but am seeking reassurance, or advice otherwise, as we don't really know what we are doing!!

I have been exclusively breast feeding DS - to the point where he absolutely refuses to bottle feed (but that's another story!) He is still waking up anytyhing between 1 and 4 times per night and my natural reacton is to feed him as I know it will send him straight back to sleep - but I have decided that I need to break the cycle.

I have just started giving him some rice in the mornings as we think he is hungry. I have decided that from tonight I will only feed him once during the night and if he wakes up more than once I will just try to get him back to sleep without the food - I just know the result is going to be a very upset baby and a very guilty mummy....

Am I doing the right thing? Does anyone else have experience of this working?? How long will it take for him to adjust?? Am I a bad mummy for starving him??? Help!!

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

Twinklemegan · 04/02/2007 22:56

Leahsmum's DD is fine though people. I do agree it's dangerous to advocate not feeding a 4 day old in the night - don't know if you were or not LM. I must admit, I'm not sure I would have set my alarm to feed DS if he hadn't woken - I never experienced that dilemma.

Twinklemegan · 04/02/2007 22:58

Just re-read that - I strongly disagree with myself. In the early days DS had jaundice and I had to make sure he fed regularly so yes I would have set an alarm. Very glad I didn't have to.

misdee · 04/02/2007 22:59

TM, dd1 wouldnt have woken. she also had jaundice which too ka while to clear, which made her sleepy (but not bad nough to go under the lights). i have a shockingly yellow pic of dd3 whose jaundice was worse.

Twinklemegan · 04/02/2007 23:00

x-posted I think Misdee!

leahsmum · 04/02/2007 23:00

Obviously if she had been looking for a feed then I would not refuse but after one night offering only water then not waking in the night thereafter I was certainly not going to set my alarm to wake my baby to feed her when she was obviously getting enough food during the day. She never lost weight or had poor growth due to this. She has hit all milestones in advance for her age (not that this is relevant but just incase you may think her development may have been hindered due to lack of food in the night).

Twinklemegan · 04/02/2007 23:01

Or maybe not? Anyway I know where you're coming from. Sounds like your DD's jaundice was worse than my DS's. Actually the early days are a complete blur tbh.

nooka · 04/02/2007 23:09

I'm not advocating forcing your baby to have four hourly feeds (although it wasn't uncommon in the past), but my ds decided on that from day one (I timed him, and it was pretty exact). He was very (old fashioned) text book, going on to six hours etc. However I don't know how anyone can really effectively breastfeed to a strict routine. Yes you can distract for a while, but you can't force them to eat! I remember trying to wake up ds and feed him late at night to try and reset his internal alarm, and he resolutely refused to "dream feed". And then dd came along and decided that she liked to feed little and often (and be carried around the rest of the time too). I think to a large extent they come preprogrammed with the way they want to do it. You can attempt to persuade them otherwise, but if you don't go with their inclinations you are probably doomed to frustration and eventual failure. (oh and on the bottle front my brother went straight from breast to cup, because he refused a bottle and he was younger than 5mths)

Astrophe · 05/02/2007 00:03

leahsmum - don't worry 'bout the lynch mob - course you didn't starve your dd! My dd also slept through very early (10pm-6am at about 6 weeks i think), and i never ever woke her to feed her (and if hv had told me to I would have told her to go jump, but in Australia, where I had her, the advice is to "feed 2 to 3 hourly during the day, and at night when baby wakes"). she was fine - big and healthy and strong, and i had plenty of milk during the day despite no night feeds. My DS is another story!

nappyaddict · 05/02/2007 00:06

unless he has had some nights where has has not woken for a feed he still needs them in my opinion. after 6 months he shouldn't need a feed in the night and this is when you should readress the situation.

hunkermunker · 05/02/2007 00:38

Who says "a sleep is as good as a feed"?

Babies need both, of course they do, but at four days old, it's a rare baby indeed who doesn't need feeding more often than four-hourly or during the night.

I think repeating "a sleep is as good as a feed" too often might not be a good idea, LM - it's not helpful for the majority of babies.

hunkermunker · 05/02/2007 00:40

I would also hesitate to say that babies shouldn't need feeding in the night after six months either, especially with babies just starting to eat food at this age now.

Mind you, DS2 often eats as much or more than I do during the day and he's just one. He still wakes at night for a feed too - and is ravenous - and still eats masses for breakfast too

nappyaddict · 05/02/2007 01:04

tbh that's probably out of habit that he wakes then and for comfort.

ds used to go 7 hours at night even from being newborn and even sometimes in the day but he was not the norm.

Sakura · 05/02/2007 02:58

My DD is 4 months and 1 week, and Im wondering about night sleeping too. She has been known to go 5 hours in the day without feeding, so I know she doesnT need to wake up every 2 or 3 hours or so in the night. Shes easily distracted in the day and tends to just have a "drink" from the breast, rather than a feed. Typically, shell finally settle about 9:30pm, wake at about 11 (feed and change), wake at 1 am (feed and change), then 3a.m (feed) then 5:30 (feed) then 7:30am (I get up). Im wondering what will happen if, instead of feeding her at 1 a.m, if I just settle her back to sleep. Its RISKY to me, because she could well be thirsty, and then could wake me up again after about an hour after me just getting off to sleep, whereas if I just go ahead and feed her, I know shell go another two hours or so.
Interesting things on this thread are, that 1) babies can wake out of habit instead of hunger and 2) babies (and adults) have natural waking cycles so there really is nothing you can do to stop the baby waking, and if feeding her gets her back to sleep quickly then, why not?
I`ll try settling her tonight instead of feeding her at 1:00am and let you know the results.

nappyaddict · 05/02/2007 03:01

could you try giving her a sip of water to see if she is thirsty and see if that helps her back off?

naughtymummy · 05/02/2007 06:51

Henrybaba sympathies all this conflicting advice is v. difficult. You have n't specified what you mean by "at night" . IMO I think it is completely reasonable to expect a 5 month old to only feed once between say 11pm and 7am. However is it worth the heart ache if he will go back to sleep with a quick feed ? My DD is 17 weeks and I don't feed her if she wakes B4 5 but i know that she will settle with a dummy. I don't think this is cruel in anyway- I just helping her know the difference between night and day, she rarely wakes. I feel confident to do this becuase she has 4-7 oz at 1030pm.

BTW am totally at 4 day old being offered water at night. I did set an alarm to feed my DS at night as a newborn as he was jaundiced and sleepy.

DS took a full feed from a beaker at 4 months he also refused a bottle

Original poster

henrybaba · 05/02/2007 08:54

I just have to report back to you all......

Not sure whether my DS sneaked downstairs in the night and read all of these messages...but last night he slept from 10.30pm til 7am!!!!!!!! Halleluiah!!!

I am quite sure it was just very coincidental and quite possibly just a one-off but I feel great for it, he is full of beans this morning and we are all very happy!

It seems this thread and started all sorts of debate - makes interesting reading and fascinating how many different methods and schools of thought there are on the subject.

BTW, don't think anyone should be got by a lynch mob - everyone should be free to express opinion and share experience!

OP posts:

Twiglett · 05/02/2007 09:36

congratulations .. DS did this too .. DH and I started talking one night about considering 'controlled crying' and he slept through that night .. he was about 5.5 months IIRC ... and from then on (barring teething / illness) he's slept through .. he's 6 next week

cruisemum1 · 05/02/2007 14:23

haven read all posts but my ds is the same and just wanted to have this thread on my list. more later...........

ScoobyDooooo · 05/02/2007 14:36

Well done i am glad your d has slept through the night bet you feel refreshed today

Leah - Are you saying that your baby of 4 days old only had 4 bottles of milk from 7am till 11.30pm? & that was it everyday? how many oz's was she having a time?

Ceebee74 · 05/02/2007 14:49

Congrats Henrybaba! Long may it continue eh?

I just want to add that I too am shocked that you would offer a 4 day old baby water rather than milk - tbh, I was given this advice by a friend who has 2 teenage sons (who it clearly hadn't done them any harm) and at the time, I thought that it sounded great if it meant you slept through - but once DS was born, there was just no way I could have given him water when he was hungry. I was fortunate that DS only ever woke once a night for a feed and stopped that at about 3 weeks - but it does seem a bit selfish to deny them food just so you can get a good nights sleep - or is that just me?

(BTW, the same friend told me that she used to put her lo's in the garage when they were crying so her and her DH couldn't hear them! )

nappyaddict · 05/02/2007 16:14

you shouldn't stop offering milk until they are 6 weeks and over 10lbs iirc.

ds u sed to sleep from 11 til 7 and was very fussy with bottles in the day. when he was born he would have 2 oz at a push in each feed.

lulumama · 05/02/2007 17:43

eeeeeeek ! at a 4 day old not feeding in the night !! a sleep is not as good as a feed ! babies need to feed night and day , for a good few weeks, if not months !! mine both slept through at weeks old, but not days !!

why on earth would you offer water and not milk in the night!!

ok, the MW and HV said ok, but how many threads have been on here about MW and HV offering incorrect and sometimes dangerously outdated notions about feeding babies?

nappyaddict · 05/02/2007 18:16

but what if they actually don't wake for a feed in the night like my ds. i never offered him water he just rarely woke between 11 and 7. if he did i fed him obviously.

sunnyjim · 05/02/2007 19:37

I don't think you are cruel or wrong. 5 months is early to go 12 hours without food though so this is what I'd try. (sorry if I repeat anyone)

a) try and make sure he is getting really good feeds during the day

b)if HV has advised it then introduce rice /fruit puree. I'd go for the midday(ish) feed though not first thing in the morning

c) If its at all possible get your DP to give a bottle feed (expressed or formula) just before bedtime. That way its easier to see that he's had a good feed at that point plus you get to rest for a bit.
You may have to really persist with the bottle. The reason I say get DP to do t is that he associates you with boobie so he won't take a bottle instead.

d) at 10/11pm (about 4 hrs after he's gone to bed) wake him up and do a feed. You may need to try boht a dream feed or actually getting him up. At this age I used to have to wake him up from 10.30ish for an hour to ensure he'd then sleep later on. give him a relaly good feed. We'd give as much of a 7oz bottle as he would take straight away at 10.30pm, then offer another (freshly made up) 7oz bottle after a nappy change to settle him back down.

If he wakes between 12am and 6am, resettle with boiled water.

THen you KNOW he has had a feed at 11pm, so his tummy is full. You're not asking too much of a baby to aim for 6-7 hours of solid sleep at this age and you need the rest.

We got DS sleeping 7-6/7 with the wake up at 10/11pm at 3 months. It was great especially as DH coudl give a bottle feed at 11pm 3 nights a week so I got to go to bed at 9pm and sleep until 6/7am.

Good luck

cruisemum1 · 05/02/2007 21:59

I am crashing this thread as my ds wakes irregularly during the night (21 weeks old). He was doing 9 - 6/7am at 3mnts but once he hit 4mths it was 2 hourly wakings . Now it can be anything from 5 hr stretches followed by 2 hourly in one night, or the other night one waking at midnight and then nothing till 6:45am or last night - every two hours. He does feed as i offer boob as a sedative but I really would rather not. Nothing else gets him to sleep at nigthtime though and he is not a baby who will be shhd/patted/rocked/stroked etc etc. I'm taking a bottle up tonight and hope that helps . Of course if he fusses I will give in . But hey - at 2, 3 ,4 am I do what works best......

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