Overbearing narcissistic 5 year old son-advice needed

[Bellejessleo]

Hi, I'm just looking for some advice really. My ds is 5 and in reception at school. He has always been quite a demanding, spirited child..even from newborn. It's starting to dawn on me, mainly from him starting reception and me comparing him to his peers, that he's really controlling in every situation. He has to go first, be the best, everyone has to play 'his' games the way he wants. Doesn't seem to show genuine empathy or care for other peoples feelings. At home he is the same, and I really struggle to get him to consider his sister (2.9 years), or me or his dad. His behaviour is quite bad, he throws tantrums like a 2 year old. Crying and screaming etc.
I struggle to get him to do anything that he doesn't want to do. I'm feeling really sad, like I'm raising a little boy that just isn't very nice. I try and encourage him to be nice to people and respect things, but I'm feeling a bit lost and am worried he's actually abnormal?
Is it possible to be a narcissist at 5 years old? Because that is what he is! I'm overly worried about this because his uncle and gran are and I know it runs in families.

Thanks 'rootypig' I think that's good advice to try and remember that he is still a baby really. I do love him with all of me, I just find it hard to like him all the time when he's so difficult to be around. There's loads about him that is fantastic though. He isn't a great sleeper either, he goes to bed at 7ish but is always up at 5am, which I don't think helps his behaviour. We've tried all sorts with that one..sticker charts, gro-clock, later bed time etc but that's his body clock I think and always has been. With the Gro-clock he figured out how to adjust it, so would make the sun come up at 5am and come bounding into our room saying 'look mummy it's morning!' At 5am

I wonder if having his teacher off sick for so much time is not helping your DS? Why is she off sick? Is it stress? Perhaps your DS hasn't had the routine and structure that he needs in school?

I have roughly the same age gap between my two boys and I can honestly say that my oldest child has always been hard work. He never ever lost his no 1 spot when his little brother was born he continued to think that the world revolved around him. He gave his little brother such a hard time (still does) and I would feel a real resentment that he couldn't just be more like his little brother. I honestly don't think that there was a single day in the first 7 years of his life that he didn't cry over something! It does get easier as they get older as your younger child becomes more assertive. I look back now that mine are older 11 & 9 and feel a real sadness that I had such resentment for such a small boy. I expected him to grow up so much faster than I ever have my younger son.

I'm picking up that you're annoyed about the teacher being off for so long and from what you say about pre-school, I'm wondering if you feel that if he was fine there, how things are so difficult in Reception? So maybe you're feeling annoyed with the school?

His teacher being off may be exacerbating the problem, but as most Reception classes normally have at least two TAs and most of the children think of them all as teachers, it made not have made a massive difference to him. IME of a similar situation, it's the parents who mind more than the children!

I wouldn't do what over is doing and try to speculate about why the teacher is off. It's really no-one's business.

I have a nephew like this although he is 10 now. Apparently he is very well-behaved at school. As I (and others in the family see it) the problem has resulted due to a combination of the following:

1. personality (not naturally easy-going in character anyway )

2. parents letting him be boss in EVERYTHING as a toddler when DC2 was on the way and then when she was born, because they felt sorry for him being usurped and wanted to give him extra attention (their FULL attention, so that he didn't have to wait for them to finish doing their own task - whenever he wanted them to so something, they did it, whether it was convenient or not. (this was their biggest mistake, I feel, and used to drive me mad.)

3). Severe lack of chastisement as a toddler/pre-schooler. One time he threw metal hand trowel at DS's face really hard in temper - luckily he was a bad aim and missed but he could have caused serious damage. I would have REALLY shouted at him and put him on the naughty step if it had been me but she just sighed and said "oh dear, we don't do that, it's naughty" in a wishy washy voice, and let him carry on playing with it!!! I was gob smacked!

4). Buying him a (expensive) toy nearly every week for no good reason.

5). Parents Went the other way as he got older and realised he was becoming too spoiled and would shout far too loud for things that I would have let go or dealt with much more lightly. Ie they didn't pick their battles. They have the added problem of often disagreeing how to discipline him with one parent being too strict and one too soft and they have arguments about it in front of him.

6). Parents treat their DD very differently as she is a much easier personality, and sometimes I've cringed at how obvious it's been and how they don't display the same kind of affection towards their DS in public. If we notice it, he will, that's for sure. Resulted in resentment towards his sister.

7). Extremely inconsistent and unfirm boundaries. Mainly because it takes effort and they sometimes can't be bothered to follow through proper discipline. They are of the "I'll count to 3. 1.....2.......come on, get your shoes on....2 and a quarter....errrrr.....put your shoes on now! 2 and three quarters.....oh please, DD...." type of parents. Etc etc. I'm sure you've seen this in other parents. I am strict and would count a proper 1, 2, 3 and if no shoes on then pick said child up in one hand, shoes in the other and off out the house.

They also make stupid threats without thinking which they cannot possibly follow through, so become meaningless. Eg they might be on holiday, and say "if you don't do z, y or z then we're turning round and driving home."

All of this has resulted in a poor, anxious, un confident kid who doesn't want to try new things, who gives his parents a hard time at home, who doesn't seem to have many friends at school, and who is VERY bossy and controlling when playing with his cousins.

It's not his fault. I feel sorry for him. He IS naturally challenging but how they've brought him up so far really hasn't helped at all.

I think they do realise they were far too lenient with him when he was younger, but once those patterns of behViour have been learned at an early age, it's quite difficult to un-learn them, and they're at a bit of a loss as to what to do now. And of course, it's a bit of a vicious circle because sometimes he is quite unpleasant to be around, and then it's quite difficult to be pleasant to HIM.

I don't know whether you recognise any of that in your own situation, OP, but I did just wonder whether it may be similar.

You've had some good advice so far.

As someone said, make sure the decisions and choices that you absolutely need to stick to ARE always stuck to. Eg if you need to be out the house in time for something eg school/train then he does not get any say in what time you choose to leave. But with things like what he wears to a party, let him decide, even if you think he looks a bit daft. Ie. don't sweat the small stuff.

If he tells you he wants to do something, if there is really no good reason why he shouldn't, then let him do it! I remember going on a walk with my DSs, and my nephew and his dad, and the boys were each kicking a little rock along a farm track. His dad told him not to do it, and didn't give him a reason why not, and so of course my nephew started to have a paddy because he thougt it was unfair, which it was. I pointed out that actually none of the kids were doing any harm kicking a stone along and I have permission for my boys to carry on! And that time, quite rightly, he changed his mind about letting his DS carry on kicking the stone. Had I not been there, though, I have no doubt that in my BIL's mind he would have thought that "backing down" would have shown weakness and would have stuck to his guns, resulting in an upset kid and an annoyed dad. And for absolutely no good reason!

Re: choice of activity: "ok, we're either going to the museum or the park, which do you want to do, DS? DD chose last time so your turn this time." And remember that it's DD's turn to choose next time it comes round and stick to that.

I'm going to shut up now . I'm waffling on and on and on......

Bellejessleo: I wonder if the past history of reflux and colic might have more of a bearing than you think? Both indicate a past history of cows milk protein allergy (any asthma or eczema, history of super fast weight gain - or the opposite, feeding issues and poor gain?) His continued poor sleep and Ott behaviour suggest it could still be a problem - as hyperactivity is the lowest threshold for a food allergy to manifest, and there seem to be links between Aspergers and diet too. Your situation sounds really difficult I hope it can be improved. Would you consider trying him on three weeks of a strict dairy and soya free diet?

It all sounds horrible!

By that I don't mean you sound horrible, or your son sounds horrible. The situation sounds horrible for both of you.

I think you should give yourself a hug, and Ds a hug, as you both needs lots of support and kindness.

Some good practical advice that I can't better, but I do think the thing missing at the moment is giving yourselves a break.

on a good moment - ask yiur DS if he likes being angry all the time and if he's happy with his behaviour? Some children know they aren't winning any popularity contests through their behaviour but are also in that cycle and need suport to change it.

Sounds so much like my dd belle with the sleeping, I found something she really, really wanted and made a 30 days in your own bed chart (I.e. Not coming into us at 2/4/5) and we're on our third attempt but she's on day 10 now and it is definitely resulting in more sleep overall. I've also praised a lot and given a really small treat after every incidence of sleeping well. I think the thing about predictable discipline/rewards is it doesn't work that well in any moment, works over time. Predictable consequences also help my dd feel more secure even when not behaving. I also give a sticker when I notice she's done something really well, she likes that a bit because it's a good surprise but in general she still doesn't like the uncertainty of it. I'm also a 'pushover' type btw and I've found that because they expect love from us and need it, when we do shout/lose temper etc she gets utterly furious as I said. You should explain it to your DH, there are consequences, that's fine but you just can't bark at our kids and expect them to jump. Fwiw my dd is pretty quick, it's about channelling the energy.

Oh and I take my hat off to anyone who's not ever felt hopeless or lost their temper with their dc, you either have my model angelic dc2 or you are just a superior type of being. Give yourself a pat on the back. Otoh, occasionally losing your temper and shouting or feeling less than charitable to your dc when they're hitting/biting/shouting at you or your other baby is much more normal imo...

OP, this is probably a left field question but - is your DS constipated, or does he have any other ongoing digestive problems?

I feel your pain! My step child is exactly the same way. Only thinks of himself, never considered others feelings. But he is also prone to to commence. He is 5 yrs old, and not a day goes by without him blowing up! My girlfriend thinks this is normal. What can I do? It is tearing us apart!