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Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

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Original poster

disciplining an 18mo - is it even possible?

50 replies

patagonia09 · 30/07/2013 15:02

My DS is generally very sweet and affectionate to everyone, but sometimes he's a right little S.O.B. He may be "patting" my face far too vigorously, or throwing food on the floor, anything like that. I tell him "No" in a firm and serious voice, and gently but firmly take his hand and move it away and hold it still, so I think it must be clear what "No" is referring to. But instead of stopping, or crying, or having a tantrum anything like that, he just gets a slightly horror-movie-posessed-devil-child look in his eyes and carries on doing it. I can say "no" a thousand times and it doesn't make any difference, and I end up getting really upset that lovely DC is in fact a demon and feeling like I could just clock him one right in the face.
AIBU? Am I doing it wrong? I would take his food away completely but as he already eats like a bird I'm loathe to reduce his food intake even more.
Suggestions? When does a "naughty corner" become an effective technique?

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

Potteresque97 · 30/07/2013 15:10

I had the same question, dd is now 2 yr 9 mos, most books say you can only do the tactic you're doing of saying no, even now I don't think dd really understands why the patting etc is wrong. Naughty step etc is all 3 and up. Interested to see if anyone else has suggestions...

GrimmaTheNome · 30/07/2013 15:12

What usually works is a related consequence - so the 'patting' you tell him if he doesn't stop you'll have to move away from him (or into a different room if that's possible and safe) - then if he carries on you do what you said.

The food is trickier - I'm inclined to think that if he throws the food on the floor, you should try to calmly just bin it. Offer him more at his next meal. Its really difficult with picky eaters but children don't starve themselves.

Davsmum · 30/07/2013 16:08

I agree to saying 'NO, that hurts!' firmly and seriously and then walking away from him - take no notice of the 'look in his eyes' Don't keep looking at him as that acknowledges the 'evil stare'
Don't wait to say 'No' - do it immediately he starts patting you too hard.

Try not to be upset - all children can be 'demons' - they can't be angels all the time..

Original poster

patagonia09 · 30/07/2013 19:21

Thanks everyone. Glad to know other people think I'm doing the right thing, even though it doesn't seem to be working. HOpefully it will improve...

OP posts:

YBR · 31/07/2013 13:41

With meals, our policy has been that DD's meal ends as soon as she deliberately throws food, or spills her drink. Mistakes are allowed (in as much as we have to tell the difference). This works as an obvious and imediate consequence, but also because DD doesn''t do it when she's hungry and generally eats well. Not sure what we'd do if she were a picky eater though.
HTH.

Empriscillavoss · 03/08/2013 21:50

I've been advised to start the naughty step by a qualified nursery nurse and my DS is 18mo too. I haven't actually started it yet so intrigued to see how she reacts to it! Maybe it's trial and error with this one I'm afraid x

lola88 · 03/08/2013 22:01

Ds is 18 mo and when he gets excited can be a bit rough i tell him no don't hit mummy i don't like it and i won't play if you hit me it works more often than not and when it doesn't work i stop playing with him with food i just say no mummy doesn't like when you do that if you don't want it put it back on your plate and leave it and make him pick up what he drops after he finishes.

Friends laugh at me and say i speak to DS like he's 5 but i honestly think he understands if i tell him not to do it and tell him what to do instead the same people who laugh often ask how i get him to be so 'good' funnily enough.

puppiesandkittens09 · 03/08/2013 22:04

To be honest I haven't read anything about this but with my daughter we just tell her a firm no and if she doesn't stop that's followed by a stronger and a bit louder no and in the end a slap on the hand or bum ( strong enough to realise what's going on but light enough not to hurt her). She then pretends to whinge but we tell her again that it's a no-no because it's naughty/it hurts/it's dangerous and she moves on. Having said that, she's only 13 months and just starting to be naughty.

Seenenoughtoknow · 03/08/2013 22:06

Ha - your DC could be mine right now! I've realised that getting up and away from the situation, saying 'no' and almost showing him the palm side of my hand (sort of saying I'm taking no notice) whilst turning my back to him has started making him realise he loses my attention for behaviour that is not acceptable to me (usually painful behaviour!).

He very quickly comes to me behaving more gently to get the attention back, which I return as soon as I see he has dropped the naughty look.

It seems to work better than anything else I've tried, and doesn't seem cruel at all because you are just not reacting to his bad behaviour. Sometimes he just wants a rough and tumble play though - and I'm trying to work out the difference between when he's just being a bit naughty and when he wants to play so we get a healthy dose of that too!

The food one is tricky, DS isn't a big eater, and tends to throw his food around when he's full. I usually take away the main meal and offer him some fruit and if he's still hungry he'll eat a bit of that too before throwing it. If he's really having a bad few days I just put one piece or spoonful of food on his table at a time and he takes it and eats it then gets the next until he's full...takes forever but after a few meals he forgets he was ever a thrower (for a few days!). Best of luck!

TwasBrillig · 03/08/2013 22:06

You're slapping a 13month old baby?? :-(

Hobblethwaite · 03/08/2013 22:10

What about teaching him "gentle hands" when he hits you?

My little girl (19 months) did the same and I would take her hands say 'no, we don't hit, hitting hurts, we use gentle hands'

Then stroke my face with her hands. It's worked a treat and can be reiterated if she gets a bit excitable. Now I just say, 'we don't hit, show me gentle hands' and she strokes my face and says sorry.

I haven't got a clue about the throwing food thing as we have the same issue, it drives me mad. I just say 'we don't throw food' and take it away if I think she's finished. I know it's a normal part of play at this age and they are learning but it still riles me when there is pasta all over the floor.

I'm not a fan at all of the naughty step as I see it as essentially withdrawing love for being naughty and I don't want to send that message.

I have found ahaparenting.com. really helpful.

Hobblethwaite · 03/08/2013 22:14

Second what twas said, Hitting a baby to teach them not too hit? That just makes me sad.

Hobblethwaite · 03/08/2013 22:18

www.ahaparenting.com/parenting-tools/positive-discipline/timeouts

Bumblebee78 · 03/08/2013 22:18

I love your honesty, ours get the demon child look too, i think they are just getting excited thinking it is a game and getting an adrenaline rush, which makes them hit harder. I dont think it is personal and he wont mean to hurt you, he probably isnt aware it hurts so much.

I think what you are doing is the right thing by saying, 'no' and saying it hurts. It will get through eventually i'm sure! Just one of the pleasures of being a parent i guess!

Cravingdairy · 03/08/2013 22:26

Naughty step for an 18 month old is just ridiculous.

TheBakeryQueen · 03/08/2013 22:29

PUPPIESANDKITTENS if you smack you are teaching that it's ok to hit someone smaller and weaker than yourself. That's poor parenting to put it mildly.

I don't know a parenting book on the planet that would advocate smacking a baby or even that a 13mth old knows right or wrong.

Where on earth did you get the idea that a 13mth old is being 'naughty'?

TheBakeryQueen · 03/08/2013 22:32

To the op, an 18mth old is driven by impulse, so if they feel like throwing food, they will. Regardless of any attempt at 'discipline'.

All you can really do is go through the motions at this age. 'No, X, we don't throw food, we eat food' & distract or end mealtime.

puppiesandkittens09 · 03/08/2013 23:20

as I said before, I smack her hand or bottom just enough to make her realise she's doing something wrong, not to hurt her. Smacking her the way I do doesn't hurt her in the slightest, I make sure of that. I've never hit anyone in my life and I'm not doing it now with my child. my daughter does things on purpose, I can tell when she does it out of play or because she's being cheeky. I've tried taking the attention away, but she doesn't care and just keeps doing her thing. And I can't do that when she puts her own health/ life in danger. I know what I'm doing and I am doing nothing wrong. it works with my child and she has never hit me back.

TheBakeryQueen · 03/08/2013 23:41

So your message is 'if you displease me I will smack you', how can that be modelling good behaviour?

And at 13mths you have no idea whether she will start copying your behaviour & start hitting other children (you could hardly hold her responsible).

Babies cannot control their behaviour and they do not understand danger or right from wrong. So it is pointless to smack.

Discipline means 'to teach' so you explain using words why we don't do certain things and you move her away. But you can't expect her to not do things over and over and over. It's what babies do. She is not being naughty or doing things on purpose.

Babies hand bones are so fragile, you shouldn't smack full stop, but you especially shouldn't smack hands.

morethanpotatoprints · 03/08/2013 23:53

I used to talk to them and explain that it hurts when they did certain things.
I would initially say ouch and soon they learned what it was like to be hurt/ ouch themselves.
When they fall over, don't forget to say ouch that hurts.
They soon learn that their behaviour hurts people.

puppiesandkittens09 · 04/08/2013 00:01

bakeryqueen, I am truly hurt by your accusation. if it helps you realise how 'badly' I'm smacking her, her hand clapping is probably 10 times stronger. you are over reacting here, really. if that has an impact on her bones, what about falling on her bum and knees all the time? and tapping the highchair's table before I get her food? do you really believe I would actually hit a 1 year old so badly and often as to affect her bones? i do it but it's not a habit. and when I do it my daughter understands that what she's done is really bad ( we're talking about turning the oven on time after time when she's been said no, taken away, explained everything and she still does it). I don't slap her when she throws food on the floor. I am not looking for excuses here, so please stop judging me. it might be hard for me to explain this situation but it's not something to be outraged about.

TheFantasticFixit · 04/08/2013 00:07

Goodness. The notion that a 13 month old is 'naughty' is so disturbing. I have a 20 month old DD who occasionally does things that are displeasing or potentially unsafe. The thought of smacking her hand or bottom to 'teach' her makes me feel sick. Children and babies of such a tender age have no concept of right and wrong, they don't understand being 'naughty'. They are only just learning about their world and putting together all of the codes and messages that their little minds are receiving. You are smacking innocent behaviours, not naughty. And you WILL, ultimately, teach your child that hitting, smacking, laying hands on another person is okay if their behaviour displeases them.

I cannot be stronger in saying this. Please STOP smacking your BABY.

puppiesandkittens09 · 04/08/2013 00:26

thefantasticfixit, she is not learning what naughty means, she is learning not to do that again. it might not be the best solution but when I did it, desperate times called for desperate measures. I am RARELY doing it, so my daughter will most likely not pick that up. it may be that she will start doing it in the future, but I'd rather deal with un-teaching her that than setting the house on fire. please stop judging me and be assured I do EVERYTHING I can for my daughter to be safe and happy. and she is.

I am sorry if I gave the wrong advice, it was not my intention. all I tried was to help and I honestly assumed that the op would look at what I wrote and take the best out of it, changing it according yo her situation. that is, of she decided I wrote anything good on there.

TheFantasticFixit · 04/08/2013 00:36

Puppiesandkittens: I'm afraid you will be judged for as long as it takes for you to understand that smacking a baby, however you justify it, is NOT okay.

Please read into other, more positive methods of discipline.

TheFantasticFixit · 04/08/2013 00:37

And if your daughter is touching dangerous things, ie the oven, or anything else that could be a potential fire hazard then it is not her being naughty, it is you being negligent in your watching of her and her accessibility to those situations.

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