Am I worrying unnecessarily? Please help - sorry it's a bit long

[earthtomummy]

DS is 4.5. He has two sisters, 2.5 and 8mos. He didn't really talk until he was 2.5ish and properly communicate and interact until he was 3 and really when he started pre-school. I posted something y'day in the SN section about school's concerns about his fine motor skills. He's cross-dominant and hasn't chosen which hand to use yet. He can't hold a pencil or write at all. He also struggles sometimes with sequences of nos. and sees 9 as 6. But something that concerns me more is how he plays with other children. I basically DREAD play sessions. From experience I try to not build them up or make them a big deal beforehand. But apart from 2 friends, he is quite hostile - at times - v. hostile to friends who come to play. He'll either go off alone or be over the top silly, rude (poopoohead) and sabotage the other child's play. Frankly at times DS mayas well not be here during play sessions because he doesn't interact at all - or if he does it's negative. He's always been socially awkward - groups, birthday parties etc were a nightmare. But he always says he wants friends to come round and gets upset if they don't. He's a sweet boy but I can't help wondering what other mums must think. Also I find it hard to involve him in activities with me like lego, cooking etc. I can't help but notice that when I look after his best friend every wk, he is so easy to interact with. I mean, y'day's play session was with a 4yo we live opposite and who he walks to school with most days and sees at pre-school most days. But he was still hostile. Only with 2 of his friends can I relax but if all 3 get together he gets excluded quickly. I feel so upset. Something doesn't feel quite right. And somehow I feel really guilty that it's my fault. Sorry to go on.

Yes it does! Thankyou. Particlularly identified with the bit about pushing him beyond his comfort zone. DS can be v.v difficult when that happens, so don't know how he'll cope with reception next yr. DS didn't like the fireworks, either!

Yes it does! Thankyou. Particlularly identified with the bit about pushing him beyond his comfort zone. DS can be v.v difficult when that happens, so don't know how he'll cope with reception next yr. DS didn't like the fireworks, either!

ds loved the fireworks but not the company !!

earthtomummy I'm sorry it's been such a horrible day but you've just done pretty much the worst bit and it's not in the slightest bit stupid - I certainly was very tearful for a few weeks whilst I got my head round it. It's pretty much exactly 2 years ago that I approached DD's teacher with my concerns and I basically got the same reaction as you did (she would have approached me a few weeks later if I hadn't gone to see her)

My DD is aware that she is slightly different, our explanation was that her joints are slightly loose (the hypermobility) so it's that little bit harder for her to do things and made the comparison to a little girl who has glasses. She has made really good progress and both the school and us are really pleased with how she's doing. My hope is that by the time she reaches middle school the problem with her writing won't be very obvious, but should it still be an issue she will be given extra help and will probably use a keyboard. The physio's report about a year ago knocked me a bit as it said that they anticipated that the gap between her and her peers would widen as she got older. However her SENCO said that in her experience with early intervention it's the other way and felt the physio was leaving open the way for future help.Her reading is completely fine as is her spelling. Maths is OK, she reads some of the numbers back to front apparently. I'm not sure how she'll progress with that but is fine for now. Like Liz's DS she definitely does not like going outside her comfort zone and I don't think people can pick her out of a group - I think Lizs is right, you're more aware as a parent.

As I've said before socially I think she struggles a bit. She's fine starting a friendship but finds them difficult to sustain as she can't quite get a handle on the social rules at the moment and she ruminates over comments. She was inseperable from another girl in reception and it wasn't a particularly healthy relationship for either of them. They've both gone their own ways now and from what her teacher has said she does play on her own one out of the three playtimes (cue me nearly becoming gibbering wreck !) but that it's by choice as in her experience some children just prefer their own company some of the time. The rest of the time she plays with different groups of people, which is really good progress for her. She's also not the last child to get picked if they split up into teams apparently. The SENCO backed up that she plays with different groups as she apparently keeps an eye on them in the playground. I'm not going to put the things that I find stressful about her because they are so trivial in the grand scheme of things that I feel silly for even thinking them ! So basically for us things are loads better as the underlying stress about her behaviour has gone having found the explanation and we've seen really good progress. My advice is to sit down and have a good old cry when no one's around whenever you feel the need, and gradually you'll find that will be much less often. And I bet you if you ask around you'll find loads of your friends know happy & successful people who were always that little bit extra "clumsy" when they were children.

Earthtomummy - you are 100% normal. We all feel tearful and sad when we discover - or just face up to the fact that - that our beloved children are slightly different and may struggle. We want their lives to be perfect, after all, which is impossible really for any human being.
But it won't always be like this. In the huge scheme of things we and our children are so lucky. They have so many things 'right' with them and they are happy and loved.
Atm I feel very confident about ds. I see improvements every day and today I had a fantastic conversation with the Senco at the primary school where I intend to send him to pre-school. She was so positive and full of ideas to help him. Your ds sounds great btw - I love the anaconda and rock idea. He sounds like he'd get on very well with my equally bonkers ds!

And while dyspraxia doesn't just vanish, I do think there are millions of successful dyspraxics out there - still bumping into furniture and crap at sport, but happy and successful in so many other ways.
I love reading about the girl with dyspraxia who has just got the highest mark in the country in her English A levels and is off to Cambridge. She has written a book called Caged in Chaos which I must get round to buying and reading.

Aloha, being a rock is a great game, because I'm not allowed to move and I get a rest!! Obviously your kind words and those of everyone else who has posted here have reduced me to tears. It's like being pregnant all over again. I can't imagine a 4th child happening now..
I'm not sure what will happen next. I'm going to try to talk to my H/V or GP tomorrow for a referral, but I guess that the process may be some time in happening.
I think you rewcommended a book by Madeleine Portwood, which I'm going to get. Is there anything else worth reading - the one you've just mentioned sounds interesting.
Thankyou so much everyone for all your support. It's been such a long w/e and day, today, and I feel utterly drained. I'm also finding it hard to see DS in the same way I saw him last wk. which is unnerving me. I'm seeing him through this filter of special needs/dyspraxia etc. I'm hoping this willl stop. Idon't think I'm treating him any differently. Did you experience this. Does it stop and you revert to being the way it felt before this acceptance that something isn't quite right?

earthtomummy - yes it does stop eventually. I was really torn between wanting to know every detail and being afraid of information. It helped to deal with it on a more practical level with OT etc and fortunately we didn't wait that long for his assessment there. In UK the gp made the referral at the beginning of August and we had to wait about a month to see the Community Paediatrician, because he only visits the area once a week or so. 6 weeks on we are still in the waiting list for OT.

I'll confess it took me over a year to have the bottle to read the Madeleine Portwood book but it really helped me see the world through ds' eyes and explained a lot of his behaviour. also it made me feel less guilty about not having spotted it sooner since he didn't really show any of the more obvious signs until he was at least 2. What breaks my heart is that his teacher in the equivalent of Reception just dismissed him as slow to carry out tasks like getting dressed and daydreamy, getting cross and frustrated at him rather than helping him - bitch! He could have been helped so much earlier

my friend has just mentioned similiar actions she has discovered in her child . she was very close to one friend in nursery and now at school she doesnt interact with anyone . The teachers have tried to pair her up with other class mates but she doesnt want to play she just gets stroppy. her school work is excellent though and my dd is in same year and isnt as forward as her . i have tried to see if my dd would spend a bit more time with friend but dd has lots and likes to spend time with everyone . i really didnt know what to suggest . could she have a condition or is this a normal part of learning to sociolise ?

Yes, I honestly think it's normal for a while to really focus on the problem and feel rather consumed by it, but tbh, I have found that when I have had the official confirmation I have actually worried less. Odd, isn't it? But I think in most areas of life, uncertainty and fear of the unknown is worse than knowing. Because once you know, you can move on.
Remember, there are millions of adults out there who are happy in their own company and better one on one than in big groups. There are many clumsy people with rotten handwriting (like me!). They are not necessarily miserable or unfulfilled. The paediatrician who saw my ds said he sees adults all the time with a diagnosis and you would never even know. And that school is actually the trickiest time in their lives, because after school you have more of a chance to tailor your life to your needs and desires. Another book you might want to read is How to Understand and Support Children with Dyspraxia by Lois Addy.
Your ds might not even have dyspraxia btw, but I don't think it will hurt to read up on it if you feel the profile fits. There are often elements of Aspergers-type behavour with dyspraxia, which will vary hugely from child to child.

sorry bout spelling have 5 month who doesnt like to sleep at night lol

After a time I saw DD as I did before but with greater admiration for all that she has to overcome on a daily basis that other children don't. It makes her achievements all the more special I've found. Muma3, it's very hard to comment on your friend's DD , I've only got experience of dealing with a child with dyspraxia. Her teachers sound as if they are trying, I think if I was your friend I would go and have another word with them and see what they suggest. I think some children are naturally more comfortable with their own company and need a little bit more help in learning to socialise, but that's just my opinion and I don't have anything to back that up.

What a difference a ight's sleep makes. Feel much more robust today and'back to normal'. Had another chat with his teacher who is giving us his IEP tomorow. Seems the main problems are confusion as to which hand to use, hand eye co-ordination, rhythm and expression through music, immature behaviour (she said this in relation to him being happy to have other kids around him and not caring who they are and talking to them but not waiting for or expecting responses), difficulty in paying attention (not disruptive) and will listen when it's something that really interests him ( sharks, anacondas....!). Said he's verbally skilled and v. imaginative in fantasy play and quite self-absorbed and caught up in his own play.
I woke up this morning wondering if it's just a problem of him being pushed too fast in domething he has never shown an interest in. The pre-schools demands are q. high we think. Is DS perfectly ok and just digging his heels in and refusing to do things because he isn't quite ready. He is only 4.5 Or am I just closing my eyes to the fact something's not right. I suppose the school wouldn't do this IEP unless they felt there was a difficulty. We are thinking of not going for an assessment and letting it ride for 6mos. to see how he progresses on his IEP. Do you think we're being avoidant or sensible? Part of me thinks that all 4.5 yos are slightly odd and eccentric in their own ways and that DS' fine motor skills etc will develop, like his speech, at a slightly slower pace to his peers and will become socially more relaxed with time..? I'm just pretty confused - one minute I think he's fine and the next I don't.

He sounds very, very, very similar to my ds. And I am very happy that he will be getting extra support at school and nursery because of his meetings with experts.

earthtomummy - ime it is perfectly normal to fluctuate between feeling overwhelmed by the info, positive about the help on offer and then denial that there is a problem. We succumbed to your way of thinking when the odd comment was raised, put it down to personality, moves etc and indeed had the backing of his preschool teacher, but ultimately I wish we'd known sooner. As our elder child we had no comparison as to how he should develop but having had dd we realised some of the signs we missed.

The school are obviously trying to help him but they are telling you they feel there is a problem by initiating an IEP. Yes the environment may not be ideal for him atm, boys are often at odds with it to begin with, however the reality is he'll start Reception soon which will pose even more challenges. The more you describe him the more he reflects my ds at that age.

tbh I'd go for the medical assessment anyway. It may take a while to organise and if you wanted it in 6 months you'd face a further delay, and it may yet establish that he is broadly in line with his peer group, or maybe a bit immature in some areas. However I don't think you have much to lose by doing so, especially as the paed may simply want to review him in 6 months or so anyway or refer him onto another waiting list for OT or whatever. However you know your son and the choice to assess is yours whether now or later on.

And remember, seeing a paediatrician or OT won't change your son in any way. He will be just the same loveable, eccentric boy he always was. It cannot harm him. But it might possibly open doors to finding ways to help him.

I think what is hard to admit is that most children are pathologically sociable. That is normal. Some of us are going to have a work a bit harder to teach our children the social skills that will make their lives much, much easier.
Of course it is your decision, but thought you might want to hear from people who have felt exactly like you, but have come out the other side.

Very good point Aloha. They work very much with your child and ds loved his sessions with his OT.

Aloha and Lizs have said what I would say to be honest. A friend of mine first raised the issue of DD when she was about 3.6yrs but wasn't quite sure what it was and came up with Aspergers. I of course freaked and shot off the Health Visitor who explained away everything I raised. Also a lot of questions she asked about DD's behaviour I answered that it was fine, because I had no other child to measure things by and I didn't know any better. If DD had been my second child I would have realised a lot earlier. I think sometimes maybe we are all too ready to jump in there when they will develop in their own time, but it's a fine line as the extra help given by the professionals can really make a difference. The physio and OT we saw were fantastic as DD who is good as gold and does exactly what told at school became highly excited everytime she went and wasn't particularly compliant - "sparky" was the word they used and she had a great time !

Thanks for the opinions. It really does help. I'm just all over the place, aren't I! It seems such a fine line and as you all say, it won't make any difference to DS if he is assessed but, I suppose, if he's not and there is a difficulty then he's missing out on useful and necessary support. Just had a good play session though so feeling better this pm.

earthtomummy - we really are in a very similar situation. My DS is also 4.5 but in Reception already. Like you, I have a real sense that he isn't ready for some areas of the curriculum and part of me would just like to hold fire and see if he catches up. I agree with the previous posters about the importance of early intervention, but at the same time I don't want my DS to feel there's anything different about him, which might dent his confidence. Let me know what you decide to do - my gut feeling is to wait until after Christmas, as Kittypickle suggested, and then get the ball rolling with assessments etc. if the school feels there's been no improvement.

Don't feel so robust today. I can't believe how stressed I feel really. Just an underlying tension which isn't great. Got DS' IEP today and a Senco and early years specialist are going to meet him next wk. His teacher said he's more likely to get support in a group because his problems aren't severe enough. I don't know - we keep getting mixed messages. My sister saying he's a bit different and then backtracking and saying school are placing unreasonable expectations and the rest is just eccentricity and usual 4yo idiosyncrascies. Teacher on Mon. saying he's struggling and today saying it's not so bad and will prob. be sorted out really quickly. She thought it's worth geting his vision and hearing checked. They've set targets around the letter 's' (making marks in sand etc), to listen and respond to music signals and to imitate actions to go with a story or rhyme. I'm going to wait for the reports from the Senco and early yrs specialist before going any further. It's been such a lousy wk. Everything seems like an uphill struggle. I just feel like I need someone to come and rescue me.

sphil, I meant to ask how things are with your DS. Sorry to hear you are in a similar position. what are you going to do?
PS my mum is driving me crazy with her homespun theories about his difficulties/lack of etc...grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

My mum still has n't really accepted that ds is "different", 18 months on. She fluctuates between "I've chosen this for him for Christmas to help his motor skills" to "he'll catch up, he's just a slow developer". She means well but it is so frustrating when you are trying to be constructive. Other members of the family think we're overreacting , I'm sure , including mil who was a Reception teacher.

The Senco may be able to give you more of a steer as to how you and the school can help your ds. Bear in mind that dyspraxia, if that is what it is, affects 1:20 children, boys more often (Aloha has all the stats), many of whom go completely unrecognised in the classroom and who get no specific help at all. ds' issues are so mild in the scheme of things that he is not even on SN list atm as far as I know. Doesn't mean he won't benefit from the small group and individual attention on offer though.

It would be sensible to organise a hearing and eye test, just to eliminate those potential causes if nothing else. ds ' hearing is borderline when he has a cold and he has a visual tracking problem which makes it hard for him to follow what is on a board, for example. I have hearing problems which weren't recognised until I was about 5 and that affected my concentration in the first year or so at school.

Good luck, the rollercoaster of emotions will even out eventually.

earthtomummy I'm glad the SENCO and Early Years specialist are coming next week as it's not too long to wait. I think the important thing to focus on is that even if he does have something like dyspraxia there is wide spectrum and it affects children in different ways and it can be very mildly. And it may be it's nothing of the sort and he's just developing in his own individual way. I think that family are often a bit too close when it comes to giving advice. My Mum struggled with the idea of DD having a label at a young age but agrees now that it's been an amazingly positive thing rather than a negative. I think the thing to focus on is what needs to be done to keep his self esteem high and to ensure that he isn't getting unnecessarily fustrated. I think what you're going through is the stress and fear of making what you perceive could be the "wrong" decision that could unfairly give him a label that will stick with him for life, I know I certainly felt that way. But please focus on the fact that a) it might be nothing at all and b) if it is dyspraxia, it really really isn't the end of the world and there are thousands of adults who are walking around who would receive that diagnosis if they were at school now and not 30 years ago - they are successful, happy, fulfilled people just as your son will grow up to be. If he does have something, your understanding now will just make his transition to adulthood that bit easier than it would be otherway. Bit like a cliff face, you can struggle to climb the sheer side, or walk round more gently - the end result is the same, you get to the top but possibly by walking round you avoid the cuts and bruises you might get by taking the climb. If you get the chance, get out this weekend and spend some time by yourself, or book a session with a good book in the bathroom. Honestly this will feel better and it won't take that long.

Earthtomummy - I know just what you mean about underlying tension. My son's teacher spoke to me today about his IEP and our upcoming meeting with the SENCO to discuss it (I've posted separately about this on the Special Needs board, which is where I usually post.)Although it was all very positive I'm been feeling sick about it all day. I think I always hope that she'll say - 'Oh no, we've cancelled all that - he's fine now!' I think Kittypickles last post was spot on though - it has made me feel much better and I hope done the same for you.