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Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

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Original poster

Oh dear. 4yo has done something so very naughty. Am a bit too stunned to think of appropriate consequences.

55 replies

poissonrouge · 19/01/2011 09:27

4.8yo dd is off school sick today.

We (her, me and little brother) were playing a quiet game in the sitting room.

While I sat with my back to the sofa, dd climbed up behind me and stood picking a good spot of paint off the middle of the beautiful painting her grandmother painted and gave her for her first birthday.

I can't believe it.

She doesn't really know why she did it.

I didn't even have the oomph to rant and rave about it. I'm a bit speechless really. I rant and rave when she clouts her brother with a golf club - this is... I don't quite know what to say.

She put on a good show of fake crying until I pointed out it was fake and she stopped and looked a bit sheepish.

I haven't lost all perspective. I know she didn't mean any malice. It was jolly naughty of her though, wasn't it? I am just so gutted that she did it.

She has gone for a sleep now (not very well) and was a bit tearful. She asked if I could tell Granny and Grandad not to come and visit us so they don't see the painting. She also asked if we can fix it.

I have told her that I am really disappointed, and that it is very wrong to destroy things and damage things, and that Granny would be very sad if she saw what dd had done.

Q1: How naughty was this? How cross should I be with her? I don't really do punishments, but what are the appropriate consequences? What would you do?

Q2: How do I fix the painting? It's an oil painting. The damage is very obvious. Dd peeled off a yellow bit to reveal the dark blue underneath.

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

alarkaspree · 19/01/2011 18:15

At 4 she won't easily understand why a painting that her granny painted for her birthday is more special than the painting that she brought home from school last week, which you have probably already thrown in the bin. She wasn't being naughty on purpose.

I agree with asking granny to fix it.

SingleMumAndProud · 19/01/2011 18:22

I agree with the other posters. You have explanied to her it was wrong and that granny will be upset and now she is upset and feeling bad because of it.

vesela · 19/01/2011 20:08

It sounds as if you're above all sad that the painting doesn't apparently mean as much to her as it should do. I would be sad, too. I think we all worry about bringing children up who don't have those sorts of feelings, don't appreciate presents etc. But she's only four - she's only just beginning to develop those sorts of feelings, that an object means more because it comes from someone you love, was made/chosen with care.

That said - how best now to ensure that she does come to treasure and appreciate the picture? Probably not by overdoing it, making her say sorry to granny etc. - otherwise she's more likely to feel shame when she looks at it and have a distant relationship with it. Better that she looks at it in ten years' time and thinks "oh look, you can still see the hole I made when I was a funny little four-year-old."

Yes, I'd normally be in favour of doing something to ensure children don't wantonly destroy things, but I think in this case you have to think more about what the best result all round would be!

vesela · 19/01/2011 20:16

(am not suggesting leaving hole unfilled, btw!)

mumeeee · 19/01/2011 22:17

It was a bit naighty but not unusual for a 4 year old especially one who is not very well. She probably was just daydreaming and didn't realise what she was doing, Don't punish her anymore. She is already upset that she has spoilt her picture and worried that Granny will be upset and cross with her,
When DD1 was 4 she picked some wallpaper off of a newly decorated wall bt her bed.

seeker · 19/01/2011 22:25

Not really naughty - just one of those things. Probaby saw a lump of oil paint and couldn;'t resist picking at it. Easy enough to fix, though - wny can't you ask her grandmother to touch it up next time she comes? Maybe dd can help with the fixing bu holding the frame steady or something.

lovereallyhurts · 19/01/2011 23:37

Oh dear, I must admit I'm worried now that I am heinously lax with my DD. Because this kind of thing would hardly register on the scale of naughty in our house, to be honest. It might raise a 'hhmpph, you really shouldn't do that kind of thing, DD' from me, but that's about it.

Dancergirl · 20/01/2011 12:49

OP - if that's the naughtiest your dd will be, you are VERY lucky.....

ChippingInSmellyCheeseFreak · 20/01/2011 13:00

I think it's more 'inability to show restraint' than 'naughty' (and trust me, I'm not of the namby pamby parenting way of life! Usually told (on here) that I'm too hard/harsh etc ) I think even as adults some of us find it hard, if not impossible, to restrain ourselves when thins like this just present themselves. I'm 10 times her age and it is taking all of my self control not to pull the bits of wallpaper off that are curling up (whole place is a renovation project but I don't want to make it worse).

However, that said, there is a consequence of this behaviour and that is that the picture needs repairing and without doubt the only person that should do that is Grandma and the person that caused the problem, needs to fix the problem.

So... I would phone Grandma and explain what has happened so she is prepared. Ask her not to be indulgent and say it's OK when it isn't, but that she is very upset about it, but will take it home and try to mend it. Then I would make DD ring Grandma and invite her around and when she is here tell her what has happened and ask if Grandma can try fix it. I would also ask her what she thinks she could do that would show she was sorry and to make Grandma feel 'not so upset' (probably make a card).

I know it sounds like a lot written down, but it's not really. She needs to learn to show restraint and this is how they learn.

turtlewings · 20/01/2011 19:42

Oh dear, another mother living in the clouds! for god sake, shes 4years old they touch things!!why would you punish a poor child for exploring, you would have a field day with my lo, he loves touching and breaking things lol!! they are kids, they will soon grow out of it, just prehaps, put stuff you dont what her touching, put out of her reach??

ChippingInSmellyCheeseFreak · 20/01/2011 19:45

Oh dear - another mother who will wonder why her son has an asbo at 12. Yes, she could put the paintings on the ceiling instead of the walls - perfectly reasonable solution

loler · 20/01/2011 19:54

I also wouldn't consider this naughty - I would probably have a rant as I would have been disappointed about the painting but when I calmed down could see the funny side - I would have like to have a pick too probably.

My ds1 (4) drew a whale in black crayon in the middle of our cream living room carpet. I knew it was him because he'd been doing under the sea at school. He said it wasn't him and turned on the water works. Told him father christmas was watching and got an admission - as well as proper tears.

He didn't know why he'd done it and I really believed him - sometimes they really don't.

We have a carefully placed rug and a good story for the future.

Don't be too hard on her she is only 4!

muddyangels123 · 20/01/2011 20:01

I think that your DD did this for attention.
You have a new baby and i think ( imo ) that your DD is feeling a little jealous put out by her new little Brother.
Of course, you are very upset ( i would be too), all you can do is explain to DD that the painting is very special and make sure she tells her Granny herself so she takes responsiblity for her actions.
If she's feeling unwell and a little resentful of BB i can see why she did it.

Squaredance · 20/01/2011 20:08

Aww. This is not classic naughtiness IMO. She has discovered the lure of picking things. Lots of people pick their nails, spots, loose threads, stickers that should be left on their equipment, etc. She did not seek to deliberately spoil or destroy from the sound of it. She just got carried away by something.

I think you should have a conversation about how, if something isn't a toy, we shouldn't spoil it or play with it in a way that could poil it. ie furniture, ornaments, paintings but I wouldn't really punish on this one.

I would definitely tell the grandparents but ask them "not to notice" or comment. Either that or, probably, honesty is the best policy. Tell them, then tell her you have told grandparents (before they are next due round) and say they said they are sorry she has spoilt her painting but they are not cross as they know she didn't mean it, but she shouldn't spoil or pick at anything like that again. and in the meantime you can almost certainly get someone to repair it. Try the local art college and ask for their best fine artist student, to whom you will pay a small fee for restoration.

Squaredance · 20/01/2011 20:11

Ah sorry - just seen that Granny actually painted the picture! Even better. She can apologise to Granny and Granny can play along (but ultimately not be too harsh). Picture can get repaired and I think a lesson learned is much better than a punishment, in this example.

turtlewings · 20/01/2011 20:26

My son wont have an asbo! he is 2years old! Let kids be kids!! my gawd there is no harm!
And well if the op is moaning at her kids picking at a painting, but it out the bloody way!! Common sense must not stopped off at your house!!!

Squaredance · 20/01/2011 20:46

but turtlewings, obviously not relevant for 2yo but I do think 4yo + shouldn't have to have everything "put out of the way" just to stop them from doing damage to something. It's nothing to do with common sense they're not animals FGS! At some point kids need to learn self control and/or respect.

If everything "grown up" is removed from reach how/when can they learn the self control and respect for items? If the only things within reach are "kids things" that they are allowed to batter/destroy, is that teaching them that everything they can reach is available for destroy, even at school/friend's houses etc?

ChippingInSmellyCheeseFreak · 20/01/2011 20:47

Common sense stopped at mine - it must have been yours he missed :)

Allowing children to do as they please and ruin whatever without a thought for anyone else ... brilliant parenting... Of course there is harm dimwit .

Yes put the painting and everything else in the house out of the way - fantastic idea. Of course, teaching them to respect things is so outdated

loler · 20/01/2011 21:14

I think this is all getting a bit personal. It was only a painting - if it was a really special painting it should have been on the wall and out of the way. It was given to a 4 yr old girl - who probably assumed it was hers. She didn't get a pen and scribble on it, she didn't get a knife and deliberately slash it, all she did is what everyone will have done to something at some point and have a little pick.

It sounds like she was very sorry for what she did and understood she did wrong ("please don't tell granny") - she sounds like a lovely little girl - she has been left to stew - now move on.

Having a little pick of something doesn't mean that she'll turn into a wild thing, smashing her home up, I'm sure she would dare to touch her mums best vase. I can remember lying in bed picking at a loose bit of wall paper - just because I could - So far I've avoided prison and haven't got any ASBOs. However - I did play with a cotton thread in a boring meeting at work today so maybe the police will catch up with me soon

loler · 20/01/2011 21:15

that should be 'wouldn't dare' - don't want to get her into trouble!

ChippingInSmellyCheeseFreak · 20/01/2011 23:01

Loler - what on earth makes you think it wasn't on the wall?

Giving something to a 1 year old girl (which she was at the time of the giving) doesn't mean they should just be allowed to destroy it as you are implying (who probably assumed it was hers).

I don't think anyone, least of all me, said she would turn into a wild thing, smashing her home up?! The ASBO wasn't in relation to her at all as you well know.

We all did 'naughty'/can't resist things as children, I have no issue with her doing it, but I do take issue with stupid people who say 'let kids be kids' fuckwittery at its best.

It is an opportunity for her to learn what happens when you spoil something special.

loler · 21/01/2011 09:41

As I said ast the begining of my post - It's all getting a bit personal - I personally don't think I'm stupid. But maybe I am wasting time giving my view on a thread like this. I'll go back to a book swap thread or cooking thread where opinions aren't so controversial.

You asked for opinions - please don't call people stupid if you don't agree with them.

I'll now take my 'fuckwittery at its best' parenting style and go and have fun with my small monster. There are more important things to worry about!

loler · 21/01/2011 09:45

And the asbo bit wasn't aimed at you OP - it was aimed at the people who seemed to be ganging up on turtlewings - was trying to avoid a bun fight but seem to have ended up right in the middle of one!

Poppyella · 21/01/2011 21:01

smelly cheese - i can't believe you have laid into loler like that. Or turtlewings for that matter.

Chill out love.

corblimeymadam · 21/01/2011 21:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

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