Anglicisations of Irish names

[Snowbell99]

I am just curious. What are your thoughts on anglicisations? Do you love them because they make things easier? Hate them because they ruin the beautiful original? Indifferent? Depends on the name?

I love many Irish names and this is just something I think about every once in a while. I am curious to hear your opinions.

I know several people named Shaun, Ailish, Eavan, Ashling and Neve. I feel like spellings such as these are being used less and less often. I also feel like people care more about fadas and using them properly.

A friend was thinking about Seersha for a while but people online got really upset because they found it inacceptable that she "butchered" the spelling. I personally much prefer Saoirse as well but I don't hate Seersha.

Also, do you think the acceptance of anglicisations has declined over the years? I sort of feel like this is the case. Anglicisations used to be more common from my experience, even in Ireland. But now the originals seem to be used more often, even more complicated names. I am wondering if this has something to do with the internet and people being able to look things up more easily. In the 90s you might have heard a more unusual Irish name and it would have been harder to figure out what the original was.

For me it really depends on the name. I am so used to Kiera and Keira for Ciara that they look perfectly fine to me. To be honest, the first time I saw Ailish it looked pretty bad to me and I find Ailis much prettier. But I got used to it. Seersha isn't really a favourite either I find Saoirse prettier.

For me personally in many cases I think I'd rather explain myself all my life than have the anglicisation of an Irish name but people might feel differently about this and even my children might and they may not appreciate being named Éadaoin or whatever I end up choosing. But I am curious to hear what you think. You can also name examples.

Mine:

Kiera - this actually looks nice to me and I would consider it if Keira hadn't been so common and I wouldn't be worried about people mixing them up. I also like Ciara, though.

Ailish - it looks more like an adjective that way and makes me think of "ailing", "fish" and "dish" therefore I really prefer Ailis. I am getting used to it, though.

Keeva and Seersha - I think they look sort of awkward but still okay. But I find Caoimhe and Saoirse much more beautiful.

Aideen - I prefer Éadaoin but Aideen looks fine to me.

Ashling - it doesn't look terrible at all, but I still like Aisling better.

Eavan - I prefer Aoibheann, the spelling is part of the appeal for me personally.

What is the most interesting anglicisation you have seen? What is your favourite? Least favourite?

@KirstenBlest

Kate Lynn is fine, just don't try to pass it off as irish

But if you want a daughter named Kate Lynn why not use that spelling? I mean there is nothing wrong with Kate Lynn but it is what it is .

Yeah Kate Lynn is fine, Caitlin as Kate Lynn is a (widespread) abomination.

@ancientgran, Kate is nice. Lyn(n)(e) is just ok, although it suits my Aunty Lyn. Katelyn, Catelyn, Kaitlyn etc are a bit naff

I have a soft spot for Amber Lynne

I would never have associated Anya with Eithne. I though that Anya was an anglicised form on Anja, and until i came here thought that Eithne was pronounced Eena. I'm not Irish, and I thought that Enya was an anglicised form of Aine

I knew Sinead, Siobhan, Grainne and Niamh as the names were around when I was young - they were fairly unusual

Some dialects pronounce Áine (to me awn-ya) On-ya.

Generally, as I understood it, Irish names are standalone, not 'versions of'. So people say Sorcha is Irish for Sarah but that's not accurate.

This is right re Sorcha/Sarah, but not all Irish names are of native origin. Many very well-known Irish names are foreign origin.
Seán has the same root as John. So does Eoin.
Séamus is James.
Caitlín is from (a form of) Catherine etc

Other names were'translated' by substituting another name with no link as mentioned above
eg Hugh for Aodh, Jeremiah for Diarmuid, Ann for Áine etc

As far as I know, Eilís and similar are of foreign origin.

Lizzie I always love your posts on Irish names.

Posted before i finished! What's your view on Éabha, Aoibhe etc? I know Aoife is Irish but the others always strike me as people putting an Irish spelling on Ava or Eva and I don't know if I'm missing unfairly

Agree Jennifer and thank you Lizzie, that makes absolutely sense re the more 'modren' Irish names. I thought Séamas was standalone. Everyday's a school day! I am afraid Seán will soon be fada-less! Also agree re Éabha, but only just a thought, I don't know the origin. Friend Éilis tells me there is a Hebrew link.

I'm a Siobhan ( sorry can't find a fada to put on it. My dad was from Cork and my Mum English and I was born and raised in England.

For 50 years I've had lots of different pronunciations of my name here 'Shebrion' being the particular favourite!

I love my name, it's nice and I love it's spelling but I've seen some right bastardised versions of it recently as stated upthread. I cannot understand why you would use a name phonetically that doesn't come from the country you are living in, I don't know I just wouldn't 🤷‍♀️

If you love the name own it and use the correct spelling ( other names are available ).

Siobhán you can hold down an a for the fada or, easier again, you can set Irish as a language on your phone text. I find it very handy.

@JenniferBarkley

Posted before i finished! What's your view on Éabha, Aoibhe etc? I know Aoife is Irish but the others always strike me as people putting an Irish spelling on Ava or Eva and I don't know if I'm missing unfairly

I believe that you are right about Éabha.

With Aoibhe I am not sure because some sites that i trust list it as a variant of Aoife and that might make sense (just like Étaín is the woman from mythology and Éadaoin is a more modern variant). But not sure.

I think a new example is Aodha. It has risen quite a lot. I think it is supposed to me Ada (as in AY-da) but I think in Irish it would actually not sound like Ada but like AY-a? I don't know. It seems like a modern attempt to spell Ada in Irish but maybe I am missing something.

Agree with you and haven't seen it.

In Scotland it's usually Eilish ( AY- lish) similar to but not as popular as Eilidh (Ay-lay). Here it's also Ruaridh (Ru- Ray not Rory). I'm a Sheelagh (double ee in Scotland). Lots and lots of Caitlins here- it's super popular in the 12-25 age group. Sorry it's a bastardisation of one of your lovely Irish names. My 3 DC all have very Scottish names, all Scottish spellings- I love them!

Thank you very much Jennifer
Aoibh means beauty in Irish and was widely used at least as part of a name, Aoibheall, Aoibhinn etc. The 'wicked stepmother' in the children of Lir was Aoibh, and the story is thought to maybe be14th century.
Éabha has been in Ireland a very long time, the name is found in Irish mythology as the wife of one of the early invaders. Also in stories set in the time of Fionn MacCumhaill. (The spellings of the names were a bit different, I've given the modern Irish spellings.) Éabha was used to translate Eve when the bible was translated into Irish too.

I haven't heard of Aodha Snowbell99. You're right re pronunciation, I don't think it would be Ada. Feminine forms of Aodh that were used include Aodhamair and Aodhnait.

@LizzieAnt

Thank you very much Jennifer Aoibh means beauty in Irish and was widely used at least as part of a name, Aoibheall, Aoibhinn etc. The 'wicked stepmother' in the children of Lir was Aoibh, and the story is thought to maybe be14th century. Éabha has been in Ireland a very long time, the name is found in Irish mythology as the wife of one of the early invaders. Also in stories set in the time of Fionn MacCumhaill. (The spellings of the names were a bit different, I've given the modern Irish spellings.) Éabha was used to translate Eve when the bible was translated into Irish too.

I haven't heard of Aodha Snowbell99. You're right re pronunciation, I don't think it would be Ada. Feminine forms of Aodh that were used include Aodhamair and Aodhnait.

Aodha is rising rather quickly in Ireland. I mean it is possible that it is pronounced correctly (AY-a) but I sort of doubt it. I have seen it on message boards and people claimed it was Ada and meant "fire" (aod does come from "fire" as far as I know but I think the name is still made up).

@Puffalicious

In Scotland it's usually Eilish ( AY- lish) similar to but not as popular as Eilidh (Ay-lay). Here it's also Ruaridh (Ru- Ray not Rory). I'm a Sheelagh (double ee in Scotland). Lots and lots of Caitlins here- it's super popular in the 12-25 age group. Sorry it's a bastardisation of one of your lovely Irish names. My 3 DC all have very Scottish names, all Scottish spellings- I love them!

This is just the most confusing Irish/Scottish name ever to me. And I am aware of Aoibheann and Caoilfhionn but I find even those more straighforward.

I know Ailís to be (AY-leesh, Irish) and Ailis (AY-lish, Scottish).

And Eilís (EYE-leesh, Irish).

These seem to be the more classic forms? As far as I can tell.

And then there's Eilis (EYE-lish), Éilis (AY-lish), Éilís (AY-leesh) but not sure if they are classics or variants.

And then people use all anglicisations under the sun. I have seen: Aylish, Ailish, Eilish, Eilise, Ailise for the various forms.

And now in Scotland Eilish is AY-lish as well? What? Hahaha I'm out, I'm so confused. I think even if this happened to be my favourite of all times I wouldn't use it.

The thing is that you can't even figure out how popular it is because some people seem to pronounce them all AY-lish even though some should be EYE and some LEESH. If you count all the spellings this would have charted much higher but many statistics miss the fadas you cannot tell what was intended.

So interesting re EabhaLizzieAnt! What I'm actually thinking of is Eabh pronounced Eve... Don't know what you think of that. Never copped the link between Aodh and Aedammair (as I know it).

Yes, Áed was the older spelling of Aodh.
The name has a lovely sound, but would probably get confused with Eimear.

forvo.com/word/aodhamair/

I've never come across Eabh, I don't think the 'ea' would give the 'ee' sound in Eve though.

I'm not sure why you are so touchy about the name Anya? It clearly isn't Irish, it has no links to Ireland. Apologies if you/your loved one/cat is called Anya, I like it as a name but it's not Irish.

You may feel it to be unIrish, and that's interesting, but my point is that the very beautiful and ancient name Áine is pronounced Anya in Ulster (and also in West Cork, surrounded by the Awnya pronunciation you have in Munster generally).
Why do I care what you say? Because, as you imply, some people might read your harshly worded posts and think "Anya" is wrong pronunciation. Yet you don't even know how to spell the Irish word for milk.
The letter á is in many words. It's in that most basic of words, tá (one of the two words for "is"), the name Seán, the word for women "mná". (Which in Ulster is pronounced "mra" with a r instead of an n.) So knowing how to say Áine in different dialects is helpful, as it has that á sound.

Don't you think it's more On-ya?
LizzieAnt, never thought of an Aedammair /Eimear similarity. I really like Aedammair I must say. Agree re Eabh not being Eve at all. Dc1 shared a cm with an Eve/Eabh. I worked hard not to query!