Is there such a thing as a Chav name

[MarySA]

I'm quite interested in those name theories. And how names go in and out of fashion. I've read on here about Chav names but is there such a thing. I see names that make me cringe but is it right to think of Chav names. And also upper class names. I must say I regard some names as a bit upper class like say Octavia and Benedict. I'd expect them to sail into Oxford University on their name alone. (Only joking) Anyone got any thoughts on this. And stereotyping by name.

It's interesting. Here (in the US) names like Octavia, Dante, etc, are seen as "chav" (or the US equivalent) probably because they are mostly used in the African American community.

Tarquin would be very chavvy because it isn't used at all and would be seen as "made up."

Americans who were related to "influential" families used to point out the connection by using those surnames as first or middle name, but now Kennedy, Carter, and Madison are down-market because they've trickled down. If you are actually related it's different. For instance my grandmother's maiden name was Watson, and if I used that as a middle name for a son it would be seen as "classy".

Also, interestingly enough (I just read an article on this), it's not the conservative, Republican Americans who are choosing the solid, older, Biblical-ish names for their children. Sarah Palin is proof of that, eh? She's got a kid named Track for heaven's sake! Meanwhile the liberal set is having kiddos named Frances, Hannah, John, etc.

Does someone become less chav/lower class/plebian by being called John instead of Jayden? Probably not.

Does someone become less chav/lower class/plebian by working hard, being clever, going to University and getting a great job? Hopefully yes.

So lets start trying to judge people on their person/character/education, not their NAME!

I'm not British, my children have normal/'posh' names (according to mumsnet) but I really dislike all this 'labelling' of names.

Hyphenated names.

Without exception the people I know who have named their children hyphenated names (Ellie-May, Jade-Rose Tyler-Jake etc) are people only educated to GCSE level working low-paid jobs.
I guess people who could be referred to as 'chavs'.

It may be judgemental but when you hear a mother behind you shout 'Blade!' you know you're not going to see a middle class, 4 by 4 driving, Waitrose shopping, Boden wearing woman looking for her child.

I think if you don't believe you make unconscious judgements when you hear one name or another, you are being dishonest with yourself. That's whether or not you approve of the word "chav" or not. Compare Felicity to Chardonnay for example.

As much as I hate the word chav I do agree that certain names tend to be used by different 'groups' of people. I suppose we are all influenced by what those around us call our children and we tend to be surrounded by people of a similar socio economic group/herefore names get polarised.

My oldest has a name often condemned as 'chavvy' (Savannah). I argue back by saying that it is the name of the Queen's first great grandchild but it doesn't sway most people I think we are mostly quite rigid in the way we think of names.

I don't want my children seen as either "U" or "non-U". My son's 1st name is "Adam" which is biblical, but also suggests "everyman". I think it would suit a builder or a plumber or a lawyer or an MP. My daughter's name is most distinctive for being Welsh.

I hate the word chav, but would not choose made up names either for my own children. We have gone for family names in the main, apart from the "Adam".

I thought the term Chav applied to all socio-economic groups and was more a term to describe someone with poor taste. For example, Jordan's pink Range Rover is chavvy, Wayne and Coleen's choice of name for their son was described as chavvy by the media, even Victoria Beckham has been described as chavvy at times. Hardly poor, lower class etc.

So people who work in low paid jobs are chavs?

I think the problem comes from the failure to recognise that there are some real cultural differences within one country. Some of these come from socio-economic differences (what is seen as a 'normal' name will be different on a rough estate or in a leafy suburb), some from regional differences (Irish boys names appear to be considered a bit chavvy in parts of England) and there are probably a lot of other variables.
In the same way that 'Kai' would be a perfectly respectable name in Germany or Scandinavia, some names are very specific to the specific cultural background of the family, and it is only in the wider cultural context that they are 'chavvy'.

(Also, some hyphenated names are fine (Sarah-Jane, Mary-Anne etc), but I do think Lexxii-Mai is probably a poor choice for most purposes.)

Whether we like it or not, people judge others on their names: it says something about where they're from, they're cultural identity, who they are. Of course once you've met someone it pales into insignificance but I can't help but think a teacher who reads her class list and sees a Hugo and a Jayden will assume things about them before she's even met them. Or an employer who has CVs from a Kylee and an Arabella. Once you get to know someone, it doesn't matter but it is true that certain names can mark you out as being of a certain ilk.

Also, for what it's worth, I subscribe to Jaffacakeeater's definition of 'chav'. It's not about how much you earn or what your job is; it's something altogether more intangible. I should add for what it's worth that I'm a working-class girl 'done good' (in that I have achieved according to most middle class standards) so maybe that influences my view.

ilocedaintynuts The 4x4 driving, Waitrose shopping, Boden wearing "middle-class" mum you describe - is that desirable then? Are we meant to choose names that aspire to her social standing and all the trappings that appear to go along with that?

She sounds AWFUL. She drives a selfish car, that pollutes the air for everybody elses children, yet shops in (allegedly) the most eco-conscious of all the big supermarkets, (YET it's a still a supermarket), and she buys her uniform, sorry I mean her clothes, from a fucking catalogue. I bet she also paid above the odds to move into the catchment area of an "Outstanding" local primary rather than send her kids to the rapidly improving one near her old house. Bleeeeurghhh!!! No thank you.

I think the dislike/disgust/hatred being expressed about these so-called "Chavvy" names comes from feeling of utter disbelief that parents wouldn't choose an aspirational name. It's pure middle-class horror - "why wouldn't they choose a name that reflects an upwardly mobile status?" (real or imagined).

I agree with badtime, imo a chav is someone with no taste, aspires to be a wag, false hair and nails and eyelashes for everyday wear, deluxe tracksuits and full make up. Colleen Rooney, Jordan etc. Not just someone who is uneducated, they're not mutually exclusive.

Chav names to me, are the ones that copy slebs, that have an excess of vowels or x, y, z s, makey uppy ones, or names that are really exotic when you have no link.
In dd1s class, there is a Paris, D'arcy, Casey and Katie-Mae. Whether it's unPC or not, they are from a very different socio-economic group. Doesn't mean they're not lovely kids or anything, just I could easily pick out their parents in the playground over some of the other parents.

Stellan Yes, names mark you out as being from a certain ilk. So what? That's the point isn't it? If you don't like a name because it has certain connotations for you, DON'T BLOODY USE IT.

Regarding teachers judging on names, of course it happens, but it's pretty ignorant in my opinion. Where I work it's considered massively unprofessional to pre-judge children based on the class list you are presented with in early September. Why is judging someone based on their "Chavvy" name (which is SUBJECTIVE anyway), any better than judging someone based on their foreign name because it sounds funny. It's just a bit pathetic.

My Aunty is Norwegian. Her name is Bente. As kids we thought it was funny. She was very good humoured about it. Now were adults we've grown out of laughing at or judging someone because of their name. Haven't we?????

I should add, for what it's worth, that I'm a middle class girl, both parents went to uni; I'm state schooled, AND privately educated, I have a masters degree, YET... I live in a council flat and work as a TA - under-paid and over-qualified. Find me a name that reflects MY social background please.

Badgerina, what is so AWFUL about a 4x4 driving, Waitrose shopping, Boden wearing middle class mum who works hard to buy a house in a catchment area of an 'outstanding' primary school? What is she simply likes shopping at Waitrose, likes Boden clothes and wants the best for her children?

As a non-Brit I find this thread rather amusing. But I also hope that my kids will get a chance to spend some of their education abroad to get a different perspective on life.

MadameMessy you can spot them can you? Can you spot paedophiles a mile off too?

This thread has turned into an "I can spot someone from a lower socio-economic background" parade. Who wants to join the Chav-twitching bragade?

tammytoby NOTHING. Nothing is so awful about her. Just playing devil's advocate there I guess the point I was (sarcastically) trying to make is that people are always going to have issue with other social groups, if that is the kind of person they are. I loathe the assumption that there is only one social group of people that others may find undesirable (Chavs).

People are allowed to do what they want aren't they?

I agree with you, this thread amuses me too. Class is a peculiarly British obsession. I am half non-British, I always say it's my better half.

Also, should have pointed out that it is possible for someone to take issue with that middle class mum. Believe it or not. Some might find her boring, or conventional. It's just an opinion! Not necessarily mine, but one that I am able to imagine!

Maybe Badgerina if you hadn't just focussed on the very last sentence in my post, you would have seen what I have said a "chav" is imo. I didn't say they were in a lower socio-economic group (In fact they must be in a higher one than me, because I couldn't afford all that), nor did I sneer at them. I just said I could match parents with kids, the same as I can match the kids with foreign names to those who have non national parents. Hardly a special skill is it, just saying what's right in front of you.

Badgerina you have assumed that I think the Boden wearing, Waitrose shopping person is a good thing! I don't!

All I'm saying is that names give us a clue (and only a clue) to the social standing of the owner (or parents).

You hear a mother shouting "Henrietta" and "Charles" we ALL have a certain expectation of what that mother might be like. You hear a mother shout "Chardonnay" and "Tyson" then you also have certain thoughts.

I add no value to either of these parents, just saying we all know there are different names used by different 'types' of people.

Poppadum no 'twas in Dublin! Can it be there are two Pocahontas children floating around?!

Walter pochahontas lives around the corner from my mum. I presume it's the same one!

Okay first of all I need to know what the definition of a chav is? xx