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The mushroom poisoning in Vic.... I am gripped

989 replies

Dustyblue · 09/08/2023 04:58

This has been all over the news. I live one town over from Leongatha and believe me, it's the talk of the towns.

We have loads of mushrooms around our place but wouldn't dream of eating them. About 90% of foraged mushrooms in Australia are poisonous.

Then again, you do get groups of people who think they know what they're doing, and perhaps they do.

Meanwhile this is suss-as.

Three people died from suspected mushroom poisoning after sharing a meal. Here's what we know - ABC News

Three dead and another fighting for life: What we know so far about suspected mushroom poisonings in Victoria

Police continue to investigate three suspected mushroom poisoning deaths after a family lunch last month in Leongatha in Victoria's east. Detectives have not laid any charges, but say the woman who served the meal remains a suspect. Here's what we know...

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-08-09/poisonous-mushroom-deaths-victoria-leongatha-explainer/102703430

OP posts:
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ImustLearn2Cook · 12/08/2023 09:26

Oh, ok. Thx @AutumnCrow . I hope they find a compatible donor for Ian soon. And I hope he pulls through.

AutumnCrow · 12/08/2023 09:40

ImustLearn2Cook · 12/08/2023 09:26

Oh, ok. Thx @AutumnCrow . I hope they find a compatible donor for Ian soon. And I hope he pulls through.

It's still really rare though. There's a bit about the rarity figures in this article here (from the area served by the Victoria and Tasmania transplant service). Deceased donors are still the norm - and the waiting list is huge.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-19/father-daughter-liver-transplant/11207862

After his baby was given just days to live, this dad found he could save her

Feisty little Mila is more her father's daughter than anyone might guess. The one-year-old's failing liver was entirely replaced with a section of her dad's, after Victoria's first father-child organ donation.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-19/father-daughter-liver-transplant/11207862

Choux · 12/08/2023 09:44

I read death caps also impact kidney function. It's possible that he isn't high on the transplant list due to his age and other health issues he either already had or now has from the poisoning. He might not be a good transplant candidate due to his general health.

But he's hanging on a week after the others died so he may recover.

NoraButty · 12/08/2023 09:45

If she did poison them purposely, and the death caps are out of season, this means she’s had the dehydrated mushrooms on hand ‘just in case’ for quite some time. This adds a whole layer of oddness!

alwaysonadiet1 · 12/08/2023 09:48

AutumnCrow · 12/08/2023 09:17

Someone mentioned upthread that a person might be able to build up a tolerance to the toxins in death cap mushrooms, the Amonita phalloides.

Is this actually true, or was it just a guess? I've googled and can't find anything.

I know that you can do this with some other poisons like arsenic (Victorian era 'arsenic eating' was a weird old thing), but this toxin is very different I guess? Anyone got more knowledge than me? (Or can search the internet more competently!)

I've been trying to find the answer to this. I'm still not sure but I think probably not. I have learnt that squirrels can eat death cap mushrooms though.

AutumnCrow · 12/08/2023 09:53

Thanks, @alwaysonadiet1. It's fascinating what some species evolve a tolerance to, and can and can't eat.

alwaysonadiet1 · 12/08/2023 10:05

They are on the verge of getting an antidote though. It was discovered earlier this year and is being tested currently.

ImustLearn2Cook · 12/08/2023 10:16

AutumnCrow · 12/08/2023 09:40

It's still really rare though. There's a bit about the rarity figures in this article here (from the area served by the Victoria and Tasmania transplant service). Deceased donors are still the norm - and the waiting list is huge.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-19/father-daughter-liver-transplant/11207862

Thx for the article link @AutumnCrow . I just finished reading it. Fascinating that the liver is the only human organ that can grow back. Though it did say in the article that in Australia they only do living donor liver transplants for children in emergency situations. So, for Ian he would be on a waiting list for a transplant from someone deceased. I still hope for a miracle for him.

ImustLearn2Cook · 12/08/2023 10:28

alwaysonadiet1 · 12/08/2023 10:05

They are on the verge of getting an antidote though. It was discovered earlier this year and is being tested currently.

After reading your post I googled it. Here is an interesting article about the potential antidote. It does say that it works on mice when given 4 hrs after being poisoned but not 8 hrs later. Possibly because too much damage has already occurred.

https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/may/17/potential-antidote-found-for-toxin-in-worlds-most-poisonous-mushroom

Potential antidote found for toxin in world’s most poisonous mushroom | Australia news | The Guardian

Chinese and Australian researchers have identified that a dye used in medical imaging can block the toxic effects

https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/may/17/potential-antidote-found-for-toxin-in-worlds-most-poisonous-mushroom

Whinge · 12/08/2023 10:34

I'm not sure how much use an antidote will be. The article says

The researchers found beneficial effects in mice treated with indocyanine green four hours after poisoning with α-Amanitin, but not in mice treated only eight or 12 hours after they were exposed to the toxin.

However, unless you know you've eaten a deathcap mushroom, most people don't realise they've been poisioned until many hours later.

The symptoms of death cap mushroom poisoning include low blood pressure, nausea and vomiting (which begins 8 to 12 hours after ingestion).

Janieforever · 12/08/2023 10:34

It’s been reported the police are now investigating the husbands medical recorcds, obviously in light of this, that poor man was in a coma for four months, four months! The toll that will take on someone physically and mentally , and he’s obviously still not recovered, all due to a gastro issue, and now his family have all suddenly died, also of a gastro issue, possibly murdered.

I can’t think of how low his mental state must be , and that’s before factoring in the suggestion his ex wife may be responsible for all of it. That she tried to kill him, failed, was going in for another shot and also murdered both his parents and his aunt and landed his uncle in a critical condition.

then the children, a father nearly dying, aunt and possibly uncle, both grandparents suddenly dying, and the suggestion their mother is a mass murderer and was trying to murder their grandparents, aunt and uncle but going for another shot to kill their father.

And from what I understand they are not little kids, they are much older, so they will know what happened at that lunch ie if they were told to stay away from a certain food , like the gravy etc and come to their own conclusions. Police will be interviewing them, and they have been removed into care, I assume both for their own safety and so they can’t be influenced in what they say .

it’s just utter devastation for one family, whatever the cause.

Conqueeftador · 12/08/2023 10:53

BreatheAndFocus · 12/08/2023 08:48

Beef Wellington (and presumable Pie) has the mushrooms in it with the beef. Why would you then make an additional mushroom gravy? It wouldn’t go. You’d need a thin, clearish gravy just to moisten the beef a bit. Perhaps she liked to use a pinch of dried powdered mushrooms to add to the gravy for just a hint of mushroom flavour, but then mistakenly added a pinch of death caps that she’d pre-dried in order to poison her ex? She could hardly explain that accident to the police, could she?

Where did the gravy bit come from anyway? I’d have thought the mushrooms would just be the ones in the Beef Wellington. Maybe she meant she just picked out the beef for herself and left the mushrooms as she didn’t like them? If they were death caps though, she’d still have been ill from the proximity to the beef. It just seems very convenient that neither she nor her DC ate the mushrooms. She never tasted a mushroom while cooking, she never tasted the hypothetical gravy to check for seasoning, she didn’t accidentally eat a small piece of mushroom that she’d failed to pick out when she served her portion?

Mary Berry has a recipe for beef Wellington with mushroom gravy, and she’s generally spot on with her flavours, so I guess it must be a thing (I say this as someone who thinks the gravy is one of the best bits of a dinner that comes with gravy😁).

MoustacheTwirler · 12/08/2023 11:07

Interesting article in the Times today. According to The Times, the dehydrator was taken to the tip the day after the lunch! So this would have been before anyone died and before police involvement.

The article also says that Erin refused to tell the police where she got the mushrooms from but suggested she got them in a local supermarket yet no one else has become ill. So unless her guests all got together somewhere else and ate the mushrooms there, it is not looking good for her.

Name99 · 12/08/2023 11:08

Is she still missing?

MissEmmaCrackenthorpe · 12/08/2023 11:13

Does anyone know if the church that they belong to "allows" divorce? I mean obviously legal divorce is a "thing" but some denominations won't allow divorce(e)s to remary within the church...
I appreciate that I have reached genuine Agatha Christie (4:50 from Paddington). levels of suspicion but I can't be on a mushroom poisoning thead that @MissLucyEylesbarrow has commented on and not ask.

Netaporter · 12/08/2023 11:26

@Name99 who? Are you referring to Melissa Caddick? Then yes. Otherwise no one is missing connected to the mushroom poisoning as far as I’m aware?

Janieforever · 12/08/2023 11:34

MissEmmaCrackenthorpe · 12/08/2023 11:13

Does anyone know if the church that they belong to "allows" divorce? I mean obviously legal divorce is a "thing" but some denominations won't allow divorce(e)s to remary within the church...
I appreciate that I have reached genuine Agatha Christie (4:50 from Paddington). levels of suspicion but I can't be on a mushroom poisoning thead that @MissLucyEylesbarrow has commented on and not ask.

Well I’d assume so as his uncle is a pastor and was there to convince her to proceed with it.

Name99 · 12/08/2023 11:40

Netaporter · 12/08/2023 11:26

@Name99 who? Are you referring to Melissa Caddick? Then yes. Otherwise no one is missing connected to the mushroom poisoning as far as I’m aware?

No Erin, apparently she wasn't at her address and lawyers were waiting outside the home.

velvetandsatin · 12/08/2023 11:42

It’s been reported the police are now investigating the husbands medical recorcds, obviously in light of this, that poor man was in a coma for four months, four months!

It was 16 days. He was in an induced coma.

Janieforever · 12/08/2023 11:44

Name99 · 12/08/2023 11:40

No Erin, apparently she wasn't at her address and lawyers were waiting outside the home.

Yes but that’s not “missing” . She was never “missing” and the lawyers hand served her the papers when she returned.

velvetandsatin · 12/08/2023 11:48

According to The Times, the dehydrator was taken to the tip the day after the lunch! So this would have been before anyone died and before police involvement.

It was dumped after the first two victims died, on the Friday after the previous Saturday's lunch. Also not dumped at the local tip, but one 15 k away.

velvetandsatin · 12/08/2023 12:21

The coverage of this case has been intense, but often really wonky. The police spokesperson has said EP is 48. Yet just today I have read her age reported as 44, 45, and 46, in various reasonably reputable publications.

masterblaster · 12/08/2023 12:25

AutumnCrow · 12/08/2023 09:17

Someone mentioned upthread that a person might be able to build up a tolerance to the toxins in death cap mushrooms, the Amonita phalloides.

Is this actually true, or was it just a guess? I've googled and can't find anything.

I know that you can do this with some other poisons like arsenic (Victorian era 'arsenic eating' was a weird old thing), but this toxin is very different I guess? Anyone got more knowledge than me? (Or can search the internet more competently!)

Inconceivable!

ZeldaWillTellYourFortune · 12/08/2023 13:47

velvetandsatin · 12/08/2023 11:48

According to The Times, the dehydrator was taken to the tip the day after the lunch! So this would have been before anyone died and before police involvement.

It was dumped after the first two victims died, on the Friday after the previous Saturday's lunch. Also not dumped at the local tip, but one 15 k away.

Wow, that's fishy.

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 12/08/2023 14:34

Janieforever · 12/08/2023 11:34

Well I’d assume so as his uncle is a pastor and was there to convince her to proceed with it.

Interesting question! The whole thing would make so much more sense (in a crazed homicidal way) if it was Erin who was being pressured by the people who were poisoned instead of - as being reported in the media - it being the husband who wanted out, and Erin who was pushing for a reconciliation, with the pastor and others backing her up.

As it has been reported so far, it is really confusing as to why she would want to harm them, as they were on her side. But maybe that isn't correct?

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