Facing second termination for medical reasons this year...

[EggletinaClock]

I know there's the thread for post termination support as I used to be a regular poster, but I wanted to make an appeal to a wider audience.
I had a termination at 22 weeks in April 2011 for Edwards' syndrome (only detected at my 20 week scan as a result of a heart defect - NT and bloods came back as low risk). After several months ttc I got pregnant again and opted to go straight for CVS at 11 weeks. Unfortunately, the sample was contaminated with my cells and then there were Xmas Bank Holidays, so all in it took 19 days for me to get a result. That eventual result was that the baby has Down Syndrome.
From the day of the CVS onwards I have been bleeding and had mild to severe cramping, I've been in hospital five times and two consultants have said they think the pregnancy is slowly failing anyway as it is inherently faulty. I have opted to terminate to end this utter nightmare. As I desperately wanted to avoid going through another delivery, but as I was over 12 weeks, I was referred on to a private clinic. I was supposed to have the termination surgically yesterday but it was cancelled at the last minute due to a
potential airway problem. So now I have been left with no choice but to go through with a delivery. I took the initial pills this morning and will be admitted to be induced on Monday by which time I will be 14(2). I am not too worried about the delivery as it can surely not be as bad as the one at 22 weeks. They have also warned me that as the pregnancy is failing anyway I may well not get to the inducement in Monday so I am expecting miscarriage at any point.
At no point during this pregnancy have I been happy, merely anxious and fearful and all my fears have come true, again.
We are to be referred for genetic testing and have been advised not to ttc before then. My husband is refusing to even contemplate trying again. I still so desperately want a second child (I have one healthy daughter) but I fear what might happen should I conceive again. Time is not on my side as I am 38 and getting ever closer to 39.
I would really appreciate if any of you with similar experiences of repeated tfmr could share them with me. Particularly what you considered around trying again or giving up. I know there are women here who have had two terminations for medical reasons (Manitz and Cantdothisagain are two I remember.) How do you cope? At the moment I feel very calm, I was braced for bad news, and I have little of the fear I had about the induced delivery last time. Is it going to hit me later or am I toughened to this now?
Any help or advice gratefully received.

Thank you all for your good wishes. It is all over now. It was very painful and took seven hours, two hours longer than last time, but the last two hours were strangely almost painless. I couldn't avoid a shot of morphine as at one point I just couldn't cope but I only had one. I'm to stay in for a couple of hours to have my bleeding checked but then hopefully I get to go home and sleep in my own bed. They will scan me next week to ensure nothing was retained. I'll then have a long think about all your experiences and opinions before deciding what to do next.

I was just coming on to say I hope you're home and that today wasn't horrendous. I was thinking of you this morning and my DH and I were wishing you well. I hope you're on your way home now and can sleep there knowing that at least it is done. I'm sorry it was so painful but at least it is over.

An unMN hug >

I'm glad your labour is over and hopefully nothing retained this time, I really hope you get to go home soon. Try and get some rest and please don't go back to work if you don't feel up to it - make up an illness or something. I actually found it helpful to go back to work after my first termination, but really needed more time after my second... See how you feel. Lots of love to you. Please post again when you feel like it and let us know how you are doing xxx

I hope you get to go home and rest in your own surroundings. Take it easy. ((hugs))

Eggletina, I really hope you are home now and can rest and be looked after. Today is behind you. Be kind to yourself and allow yourself whatever time and space you need before contemplating the future. Love to you and your family.

So sorry.

Thinking of you x

Thinking of you tonight and hope you get some rest x.

I'm so sorry, that must be a terrible thing to go through.

I am thinking of you too Eggletina. I hope the physical recovery is more straightforward this time around. I know emotionally is totally different.

As for work, go if it will help, take time off if it wouldn't, but for just a few days you can self-certify anyway, presumably, so no need to tell the truth.

Thinking of you.

Thanks everyone, and especially you Can't. I've just had the best night's sleep I've had in weeks and I am getting by with just paracetamol for the pain, so I am tentatively hopeful that this will be a quicker physical recovery at least. Mentally I feel mostly numb but I'd rather stay like that than have some sort of breakdown.

I'm not due in work until Thursday but I'll self certify or work at home on Thursday and Friday if necessary. I'm desk-based and part-time anyway so it's not physically gruelling, I also work mostly alone so there's not other people to front up to.

I'm glad the pain is manageable with paracetamol. Oh and I was numb, too. Sort of dazed and tired. I think it's the way the mind copes with it (the other option would be a breakdown probably!); accepting it little by little.

How is your DD? How old is she now? has she picked up on any of this? Mine didn't, which helped....

Dazed and tired is about right. My mum is staying so I've had a couple of long talks with her and she's hugely supportive and understanding.

Daughter is 2.5, knows I've got 'a poorly tummy' but is quite disrupted by me not looking after her, so now wants her dad all the time instead of me, and is not settling to sleep very well. Similar to last time really, I feel so guilty and am desperate to be able to get back to looking after her. She is the only thing that keeps me sane.

My DD1 was younger for both of my terminations so it was easier in a way as she knew nothing. But I had the guilt, too. Actually that was one of the issues in my head about ttc again - would it be unfair to her to put her through another pregnancy in which I would be tired, bleed (I kept bleeding in early pregnancy and being told to rest) and then finally have to go back to hospital to terminate? It was also why I pretended I wasn't pregnant to myself a lot.

Be kind to yourself. Your DD will benefit from being with her dad. She still has you, and you will soon be at her beck and call again.

Don't rush around too much btw - I did, wanting to make it up to DD1, and ended up bleeding horrendously, apparently due to overdoing it in the day or two after the termination.

That is a big issue in ttc again here too, I can't bear the impact on her of me being ill. I've been almost entirely incapacitated for three weeks now and before that I had horrendous 24 hour morning sickness for weeks so I haven't been fit since October really. I've had today and this morning on complete bed rest, I need to do some light tidying today and do the dinner later on but I will move very slowly at all times and keep resting as much as possible.

The biggest challenge now is how I feel mentally. Last time all I kept thinking was that we'll try again and it'll be ok and make it all alright. This time I feel a very acute sense of despair and lack of direction that I have never experienced before.

Poor you. It's such a horrible and exhausting time mentally. I just wanted to say that my DD was 4 when I had my second tfmr and she knew there was a baby who had left my tummy to live with the angels. She was sad that the baby had gone, which made me feel awful, but forgot about it VERY quickly, and soon after didn't remember at all. They are very resilient and have such short memories! Also please don't worry that you can't look after her as much as you'd like just now, if you were ill it would be the same. I promise she will forget this time very soon.

I can completely empathise with your lack of direction and despair. I felt very similar and we actually decided to give ttc a break for a few months. It is very early days and you need time to come to terms with all you have been through x

Sorry I didnt mean that to sound like you should give ttc a break for a few months! Just that it is so early for you that I think your feelings are so natural.

It's ok grandj, I knew what you meant but I am too old to wait a few months. The thought of ttc again at the moment fills me with absolute dread, but so does any thought of the future. Today is a very bad day indeed, my mental health was already very bad due to the aftermath of the last termination but now it feels like I'll never ever be calm and happy again.

Egg, I'm sorry you're in a bad way today.

On the subject of ttc again, apart from the sheer visceral need to do so, what motivated me most was realizing that I would be sad and terrified about a future pregnancy going wrong whether I was pregnant or not, so I might as well just ttc and be terrified and pregnant, as opposed to being terrified and not pregnant. Waiting would have aggravated my anxiety, I think. But when I got my bfp, first month of trying (again), it felt like a death sentence. I almost wished I hadn't. It's all so complicated and mixed up.

I guess we all react differently; you need to take it step by step, slowly.

That sums it up nicely Cant. I said to my consultant at the beginning of my last pregnancy that I was terrified of being pregnant and terrified of never being pregnant again.

Feel a little better after a talk with my husband today. He will support ttc again but not right away. He wants me to be physically and mentally better before any future attempt. I've been pregnant for 8 of the last 12 months so I am physically done in. I'm relieved he's supportive though as it is one less thing to worry about and gives me a tiny glimmer of hope that I haven't had up to now.

8 of last 12 months is tough; I sympathize. And your DH will probably take his cues from you as to when your body is ready.

There is hope, really, honestly. Did you come across Shangrila on the termination thread ever? She had two terminations for T21, mc due to Turners, and there were other issues, she lost a few babies.... and then got pregnant again and has a healthy now nearly 2 year old boy. Can't recall her age but she was older than you when she had him.

She swore by taking extra folic acid, I vaguely recall, because some consultants think it can reduce risk of T21...I think.... but her story gave me hope when I was pregnant with Babycan't, as she had been through it more than me and was older than me and she had a healthy baby in the end. She was absolutely petrified, but she got there.

Eggletina, sorry you've had this awful, awful experience. Please just take it slowly - not TTC necessarily but your next steps, whatever they are. You've been through a terrible, terrible trauma - physical and mental - and it's no surprise that you are wrung out. You need, comfort, love, care, gentleness. With time and with just putting one foot in front of the other you'll find that life starts to open up again. But it takes time. Thinking of you and your family.

Sorry, not clear. I didn't mean "please take ttc slowly" - I meant "whatever it is you need to do next, do it in your time because you have been through so much". I hated it when people told me either to take time off ttc or to get on with it - I was just so busy trying to hold on to life itself that having to deal with well-meaning instructions felt like a real intrusion.

I don't think I remember Shangrila, Cant, I'm afraid you were the first person that sprang to mind! Positive stories are good but I suppose not everyone gets a happy ending and that's why ttc again just can't be all consuming again.

Margo, I know what you mean, do what feels right when it feels right. I really do feel utterly wrung out and as if I need a tonne of looking after. However, I have a very supportive husband and wider family and they will help me as much as they can. I have felt very distant from friends as they all go on to get pregnant and have second and third babies and I think if and when they know about this it will distance me still further. I'm actually ok with that as I realised last time that I rely far more on family for emotional support.

I had a stock response to people last time when they started on about how on earth I'd coped, where I would shrug and say 'I'm still standing' and I feel the same today. I am still standing, albeit wobbling somewhat.

Egglet, how utterly, utterly crap that you've had to go through this again, and at Christmas too. Not fair.

I just wanted to second what Can't said about the 5mg Folic Acid. I think she mentioned earlier that I had a termination for T21 and a missed m/c due to T13, then a further early m/c. I DO actually consider myself 'lucky' that I miscarried on those 2 occasions as I wasn't forced into that dreadful decision that I had to make with the T21.

Anyway, recurrent miscarriage dept put me on 5mg of FA, cyclogest (progesterone I think) pessaries and low dose aspirin from positive pregnancy test. I however, was a little bit naughty and got myself sorted with the high dose FA (6 tablets of 800mcg from Holland & Barrett every day) and was on it for about 14 months before falling pregnant again. Which miraculously appears to be going to plan (now 36 weeks). Not sure which one, although I'm convinced it's the FA, has made this pregnancy work.

I was taking the FA even though we weren't TTC, but it made me feel better in the fact that I was doing something to make a difference.

Wishing you strength, you're coping amazingly xxx

So sorry to hear what you are going through. I don't know if this helps, but we did PGD on our embryos when we were doing IVF and out of 16 embryos from 2 cycles, 15 were abnormal. We tested for Edwards, Downs & Patau Syndromes. Most of them had at least one of those conditions. A couple had Turner Syndrome.

About 50% of all embryos are abnormal. However, most of these are lost to miscarriage so you would never know.

I wish you well for the future. May I ask how old you are?