To wonder how the bloody hell people afford private education for their kids?

[HarderToKidnap]

Thinking about TTC and getting WAY ahead of myself I idly googled the local private schools. Bloody hell!! HOW do people afford this? My DH and I earn 100k between us every year so certainly not poor, but with a mortgage (on a two bed terrace) and other, what I consider to be reasonable, outgoings there is just not a way it could be done. So all these children being privately educated, do their parents earn masses and masses? Or am I missing a trick?

(Incidentally I wouldn't send my kid to private school - comprehensive was brilliant for me and if a child is going to do well they will do well, I believe. Was just wondering.)

I will admit it, I am not fussed about the British education system. We are just passing through. LOL at accents though, there is one fully British child in DS's class of 9. The rest are foreign like we are. DS's accent bounces around the world from Denmark to Philly.

I tried to enrol DS in the state school across the road and was offered a school 2 miles and 2 bus changes away. Couldn't be arsed when there is a private school much closer and the money isn't an issue.

I am sure you're right UQD. The difference between schools in areas where a large proportion of higher earners/aspirational parents send their children to private school, and the areas were they DON'T is EXTREMELY striking.
and yet these decisions are seen as an individual choice, with no wider consequences.
Remember the whole Buy British campaign? Maybe we should have a new campaign: support your local school? Though might be tricky once this government has cut their budgets by 25%

It is. But it results in only people with £1m houses using the state school. Not sure how this helps anyone else.

If the private school is some distance away then the local state school can be better for having local kids to play out with as well.
If the state school is really rough though with poor exam results then if you have the choice I can see why you wouldn't send your kid there just to improve the rest of the school. You'd have to abolish private education first. I also think letting schools expel persistently disruptive pupils again would improve standards. Having disruptive pupils in state schools rather than the old "naughty boys" schools may be good for those kids, but the disruption and herd effect of naughtiness can drag down the rest of the school kids who may be better off if the naughty kids were educated elsewhere with smaller classes and more discipline and time.

True, the emotional decision, if you like, depends on your assessment of the child's needs.

But what ultimately happens to the child depends not on assessment of the child's needs but on an assessment of the parent's wallet. This means that places outside mainstream education, if they need to be provided, are not going to the children who need them most, but to the parents who can most afford to pay.

Our local private school offers bursaries to kids whose parental income combined is below an amount (I think 35kish)depending on performance in the entrance exam sat at 11/12 before starting S1. I suspect many parents just aren't aware of the bursary system though as state primaries don't mention it to parents of kids in P7.

My quiet sensitive DH went to big rough comp

My quiet sensitive dcs go to big (good but with rough edges) comp. We're well 'ard

It works out at 2-3000 per term where we are, depending on age and stage. It is cheaper than nursery at first, but a strange argument since children are only at nursery for a couple of years, the commitment to private prep is up to 10 years!!

We have a similar income and spaced out children, but manage to send 3 of them privately for prep, on the understanding (hope!!) that they will make the local grammar school (which is excellent). One of them has graduated already, and by the time the third starts, the second will be there too (we hope!!). My salary, by far the smaller, pays for the fees!!

I think it is worth paying the price as they benefit so much from the extra curricular activities and the sport is excellent. I also think it gives them a confidence that they don't necessarily get in the state sector. I am a teacher in the state system (grammar school) and I think both have pros and cons, but this is what we have chosen and it is possible to do it comfortably. We don't live a luxurious existence, but have an annual holiday and pay for tennis, swimming etc for boys as well as music outside school. It does depend on priorities and the time you have available.

Good luck on your decision.

It works out at 10K per child per annum where I am. If someone was on 100K then if you take off the school fee's for 2 kids they'd be on 80K. So I'd say that it's pretty do-able round here on that sort of salary.

We have a combined income of 40K and I'm not sure where we could cut back to find the 10K a year for 1 child.

One of my kids will be attending the local national challenge comp in september, if I had a theoretical 10 grand I'd rather spend it on fun stuff for the whole family (holidays, gadgets, days out etc..) than on one set of school fee's.

When I was in the Army, I was the only officer in the Mess who went to a state school. Got teased a bit for going to 'free school' until my enquiries revealed that my A level grades (A, B, B, D) were better than most of my privately educated colleagues.

I turned the teasing around, pointing out that they had all gone to expensive schools for children with special needs.

I think home environment and upbringing make a huge difference - parents always read to me and I had a wall-to-floor bookshelf right next to my bed crammed with books.

Having said all that, I think private education does give you a hunger for success/ambition that a lot of state education lacks - there is too much catering for the lowest common denominator in state schools nowadays.

we are on about 55k a year with large mortgage and one ds - fees currently £640 a month, I earb about £1000 after tax, and pay fees out of that. It is a sacrifice but well worth it. What's left goes in to emergency fund and any some savings for secondary if he does not make a grammar

lowenergy - it is not as simple as £100,000 - £20,000 = £80,000 left to live on. The £100,000 is taxed the £20,000 is paid in full.

Someone earning £85,000 pa brings home about £4,600 per month. Fees for two children at a reasonable private secondary will take about half of that, leaving £2,300 for a family of four to live on. I don't know about you but our standing orders alone add up to £2,100 per month and we don't have a huge mortgage.

No wonder only 7% go to private school. And many of those fees aren't paid fully out of parental income anyway.

People will probably become less and less able to afford private fees, it's happening around where I live, state schools over subscribed. Young families have mostly unfortunately had to take on massive mortgages due to the insane growth in house prices. I hear young people (I'm talking twenties here, as I'm quite old :-) ) constantly say that they have no security in the private rented sector, and can't even put up a shelf and there is no council/HA housing available. Hence they take on horribly large mortgages. All well and good in our low interest environment but historically this has never lasted. When interest rates go up surely a lot of families are not going to be able to afford private school fees anymore?

It's happening here as well, Eurostar. One of our local private schools has gone into receivership, and a private primary school is losing pupils at a rate of knots, so has had to increase the number of bursaries.

It's bizarre - we have the top 2 state primaries for our region in our catchment whose results are far higher than the national average, but some parents will insist on sending their children to this primary school which is 8 miles away. Lovely facilities, and a beautiful building, but my goodness, why on earth would anyone pay that sort of money for the kind of education you get for free 5 minutes walk away?

lowenergy if both people work and earn say £50k, then a household income of £100k is about £72k net of tax so roughly £6k per month. Assuming that the mortgage eats about a third of income then there is £4k left. Once you take away £2k for private school that then leaves £2k for all other expenses. I don't think there would be much room for luxuries. Looking at the maths, I can see why someone with a household income of £100k would be questioning how they could afford it.

UQD - state school chidren smell funny though. Thats why mine go private. hmm

I went to private chool which is why I cant do emoticons properly

On the other hand I went to state Primary so maybe thats why I am thick.

No, they are not over-subscribed with catchment children, but it's not usual to get in if you're outside catchment. AFAIK it's slightly different up here in Scotland, with primary schools serving their immediate area.

Honestly, the whole state private debate on MN does my head in.

Our DSs will go to which ever school I think will educate them best, which will deliver the services I need (after school care is very important to me) and will have the right culture because I want well behaved well brought up young men who are a credit to themselves.

So far, our DSs have gone to girls' private Prep schools with vey few boys and thay have benefited from small classes and better concentration and behaviour. They will likely go to single sex boys grammar school with a public scool ethos of excellence in future.

It is not about state versus private it is about good schooling. The state can deliver it but politicians are too frightened to make it happen. I want every parent to have the choices I have but the sad fact is they don't. It takes money and sacrifice by parents to make it happen as things stand.

Sorry but it i about wealth and politicians will not admit that. That is the travesty of our UK education system. Not state versus private. We need to move the debate on.

[polemic emoticon]

Yes, but some parents truly believe that private = better, and it would not matter if there was an excellent state primary or secondary state school in their catchment, they would go private regardless.

Which is their choice, obviously, but a fool and their money are soon parted, as dear old Granny was fond of saying.