To expect the Doctor to respect my wishes?

[loumum3]

I have not vaccinated my youngest child. I have done this after much research and made an informed decision. The Doctor's surgery has phoned me several times now and written requesting I go in for a discussion about this. I haven't got time for a visit to discuss this, nor do I want to so I said if I had to, I could talk about it on the phone....I have had the Doctor on the phone this afternoon grilling me about my choices, really trying to scare me into having the jabs done and trying to make me feel bad. She cannot see my point of view at all and has been very rude.

Is is really too much to expect a Doctor to respect the decisions I make about my own children ?

Has anyone else experienced this ?

It seems the people who park on the zig zags outside school and the people who don't vaccinate their children do have the same mentality 'as so long as its safe for my child stuff the rest of you'.

A child at a playgroup we attend has got measles (is very, very ill with it). My friends 2 month old baby who this child was playing with at playgroup prior to getting measles is now unwell with measles - the mother of the girl who didn't get vaccinated beacause she believed all the scare mongering and thought they were dangerous is now regretting her decision as she is endangering the life of her friends child.

How would you feel if you were the mum of the 2 month old, who is in hospital?

"It seems the people who park on the zig zags outside school and the people who don't vaccinate their children do have the same mentality 'as so long as its safe for my child stuff the rest of you'."

Oh utter utter rubbish healthymum.

Why don't you read the thread, have a little think, read the thread again, and have another little think. Then come back. So long as you've had a little think eh?

Andrew Wakefield is on sky news now - struck off - he is a flake.

Taking blood at a party - having a patent on a single vaccine. Conflict of interest - well ofcourse he is denying.

What a dangerous loon.

backtotalkaboutthis - you are a patronising idiot.... and I'd rather not speak to you.

I'm really worried about my friends baby as she is very, very sick and it has been caused by someone who believed the mmr and autism link from a doctor who is now struck off, didn't vacinate and now have passed on a disease which can be fatal to a baby. You imagine how you would feel if your 8 week old was in hospital with an illness she shouldn't have been exposed to and now runs the risk of permanent brain damage from it.

I think the vaccines should be compulsory, but if you choose not to you should also, as a repsonsible adult, not allow your child to risk the lives of other peoples babies.

I really don't want to speak to you either, but why don't you read the thread.

Tbh I'd be more pissed off about a vaccine that prevented me from catching a disease and having lifelong immunity that I could pass on to my young child. Why do you think there are more cases of measles being seen in young children now? They don't have immunity from their mums! How do you know the unvaxed child passed it on anyway? It could have come from anyone and the unvaxed child is a victim just as the 2 month old is. If it was a child who was too young to have had the vaccine that had gone in and spread the disease to other young children who would you be blaming? It's awful that the little one is so ill. I hope that both children recover quickly. I just hate the way any child over 13 months that hasn't had the vaccine gets blamed for every outbreak when there a thousands of people all over the country whose vaccine immunity has worn off and could just as easily have passed it on.

There are many people on here who are profoundly worried about their own children, sometimes damaged children, and, I'm deeply sorry to say, children that aren't with them any more. Healthymum has so much compassion for them she compares them to people who park on zigzigs and "stuff the rest of you".

Or she hasn't bothered to read. But as you presumably have read the thread, why don't you enlighten her.

Yes, I have plenty of compassion.

Again pixie, vaccines aren't 100% effective so she may have caught measles anyway. Would that make it better for the mother of the 8 week old? probably not because her baby is still sick! Why does it matter where it came from? Given that children mix everywhere I would be much happier knowing that I was passing my immunity on to my baby rather than worrying about the vaccine status of everyone around me!

backtotalkaboutthis, that was a bit personal and somewhst unnecessary. I obviously meant that you were suggesting individuals could be corrupt rather than us having a corrupt government as was being suggested. To be honest individuals can be corrupt on both sides of the argument.

Pixie, I have already acknowledged that it is awful that a young baby is so sick but the very thing that you are defending is what has caused this problem in the first place. That mum was unable to pass on immunity to her young child to protect him/her at their most vulnerable age.

bubbleymummy, I'm a little confused. Why would a mother be able to pass on immunity if she'd had measles but not if she's been immunised? Surely the antibodies are the same?

bttat, you may be a compassionate person but you have not shown it here. healthymum, I hope both children make a full recovery.

"I obviously meant that you were suggesting individuals could be corrupt rather than us having a corrupt government as was being suggested. To be honest individuals can be corrupt on both sides of the argument".

It is not exactly corruption: it is the way the wheels are oiled. It's the way the wheels are oiled at the expense of vulnerable children. I am not even suggesting that those involved are acting in bad faith. I know for a fact that it is perfectly possible to hold a senior government position, move directly to a major pharma company, be involved in vaccine promotion to former colleagues, secure (with others) a highly profitable deal, and for it all to be entirely legal and in good faith.

But it is basically all about money, all the same.

To admit vaccine damage along the lines Andrew Wakefield suggested as a possibility would be financially apocalyptic for the pharmaceutical world. It is NOT going to happen.

Unfortunately happyseven there are vaccine damaged children who will not make a full recovery, and those who have not even had the opportunity to try.

Am I allowed to accuse you of the same lack of compassion if you don't give a face to all of them? No, I don't think so. So you can't judge.

Unfortunately Pixie we have heard on this thread of vaccine damaged children who will not make a full recovery, and those who have not even had the opportunity to try.

Am I allowed to accuse you of the same lack of compassion if you don't give a face to all of them? No, I don't think so. So you can't judge.

Did you vaccinate for other people's children?

My children are less of a risk to unvaccinated children than vaccinated non-immune children.

Gee, this is getting personal isn't it? I do think it's sad whoever suffers whether they are damaged by the vaccine or because they weren't vaccinated.

I also genuinely believe that my children are less at risk if I vaccinate them and that is why I do. I also do it partly for the greater good (I had the swine fly vaccine as I work with cancer patients who couldn't fight it off if I had infected them).

Neither are you Pixie.

I'll tell you how.

I know my children do not have vaccination acquired immunity. I therefore take more care. I know what the first symptoms of these diseases are. I don't assume they can't carry them and can't pass them on. I keep my children off school with a raised temperature of any degree. I know how to look for Koplik's spots, for example, which can appear before measles rash or other symptoms. I have a very high awareness of local disease incidence and report. Guess what: this is not just to protect my child. I am not stupid.

Now none of that guarantees they can't catch something. Rubella, for example, can be extremely mild and the symptoms difficult to spot.

However as parents of vaccinated children seem to be confident they cannot pass on disease, they do not take these precautions.

Imagine a secondary school of, say, 1000 children. What's the MMR uptake, I don't know, it varies doesn't it. Say it's 85 to 90 pc. That's 100 to 150 children.

Now say 95pc of vaccinated children do not take. That's fifty children. How many in whom it's worn off? Who knows. A lot, judging by the fact that so many boosters are needed and the mumps epidemics among adolescents. Say it bumps it up to 100 children.

So you've got 250 children non-immune in the school, all able to catch and pass on a disease. Who's to say unvaccinated can't catch it from vaccinated? They can, of course.

How many of the vaccinated parents imagine their children are susceptible if there's no publicised outbreak? I would imagine about none at all.

So that's why my children are less of a risk: because I know about their risk status.

I would also second bubbleymum when she points out that vaccination is the reason these diseases have moved into vulnerable groups, such as babies and adolescents.

So the risk to those groups is enhanced by what you are most vigorously defending.

There's a well documented and acknowledged phenomenon known as vaccine shedding, actually. Vaccinated children can spread the disease they are vaccinated with- so the 2 month old baby (who I hope has just been made up to scare everyone and if not, I hope will make a full recovery) could have been infected by anyone

I have ahd to sign a waiver for ds4 not to be called for MMR (he's having singles btw, one down and rubella next)

I have two chidlren with autism and otehr conditions (not specifically teh asd) that make me beleive that vaccination is a risk to ds4 so I have chosen to do it in steps

however GP just knows we have no MMR, hasn't recorrded whatw e have had

Mum lost a baby to rubella so have some idea of risks but in our circs even she understands

I doo think a gpp should try and ensure its an informed decision but it is yours to make

Someone tolds the mum of a girl with cancer at our school tnat dsw3 had not6 had his booster; he did have MMR and developed severe asd afterwards

I was horrified it was released