In not having much sympathy with a couple on £45k plus per year having some benefits cut?

[ssd]

There is loads of this on the news just now about how "middle income" families will be having some child tax credits cut and might be paying more tax. They news are showing what to me looks like comfortable off families having to do with a bit less. Is this really so bad? I know an income of £45-£50k per year might not be much in central London but will keep you in style in parts of the north, but how bad will it be? So people might have to change jobs/give up the second car/holiday at home instead of Spain every year? SO WHAT? There are plenty of us living on less than £25k a year who have had to cut back since having kids and take this as a fact of life.

I know MN is made up of mostly middle earners and I'll get pelters for this, but I don't really care. Anyone I know on a middle income can afford to give up some things _ its called life.

It really irritates me that people bracket everyone who earns 45k+ as high earners who have an easy life. Do those people realise how expensive it is to live in London!? It?s not a simple as ?downsizing? as someone on here suggested?downsize to what? A studio flat!? And moving out of London is not the simple solution either ? moving somewhere which would reduce mortgage payments enough to make it worth while would mean an additional £3000 a year on transport fares alone ? just to get back into London to be able to go to work, not to mention finding a Nursery/childcare to look after your child from 7am ? 7.30pm! And just for the record, I am a self employed single mum of one who earns more than 45k a year. I?ve worked very hard for 20 years and gave up years of my life working extremely long hours on top of continually studying and taking professional qualifications to get me where I am so that I am able to earn that much. BUT?my son has been in nursery since he was 3 and a half months as that?s when my partner and I split so I had to go and find work. The nursery fees alone cost me £1500 per month, my mortgage for my 2 bed flat in East London is also £1500 per month (which in London is not at all unusual). This means I have to net 3k each month before I even think about paying bills or buying my son and I food and clothing (so much for the cappuccinos as someone on here mentioned). So in summary I have to earn a LOT of money just to keep a roof over our head, yet I RARELY get to spend time with my 8 month old son. The only benefit I get is £20 per week Child Benefit (NOTHING ELSE ? NO TAX CREDITS, NO HELP TOWARDS NURSERY FEES - NOTHING) which if you?ve ever been to London, you?ll know is the cost of a couple of tube rides if you?re lucky. No matter what state the countries finances are in, if the government were willing to help me out financially I?d take it in a heartbeat. So please, please do not think that every family who earns 45k is well off ? it very much depends on where you live.

Yes a period of inflation might do wonders for the deficit, but think about the law of unintended consequences.

Poverty. people who have nothing will be less able to cope with rising prices.

Savings. I already explained why its madness to save during a bout of inflation. Buts its saving that helps people break out of the generational cycle of poverty. Inflation will not help these people.

Interest rates. will rise with inflation. It will hurt youse guys with a hefty mortgage.

Exports. more expensive = loss of jobs = more deficit = less taxes etc etc etc

Winners and losers. In any situation there are winners as well as losers. The winners will be the people you already hate, the ones who who have alraedy made a pile, who dont claim bennys because they dont need to.
the people who think 45k is pocket money

trust me - we dont need too much inflation

It is, however, all a question of priorities and in the grand scheme of things someone on £45k+ a year is doing pretty well. It really isn't an income bracket that warrants extra help from the tax payer - not in the current climate. Even in London there are people earning the average wage of around £25k and much below that, and I shudder to think how they manage.

lg36-imo you could downsize. I dont think a single parent and an 8 month old NEED a 2-bed flat.

To have an under-1 and be paying £1500pcm on childcare you must be on £66k+ to not be entitled to childcare/child tax credit.

And surely if you've been working for 20 years you had plenty of opportunity to save before having your baby? If he was an accident then fair enough but surely you have something to show for all those child-free high-earning years?

If you took out your mortgage some time ago then you will have bulit up equity. Why should you not use this to fund your cureent cash flow crisis rather than expecting people worse off than you to effectively pay your mortgage for you?

foreverastudent good point there. I suppose it isn't fair that people in London with higher living expenses should be grouped in the same category as someone in a northern region on the same wage. It's true though that 45k, by nationwide standards, is a lot. It does needs to be put into context though.
My main thing is people on this thread complaining that they've got a mortgage, and an ISA and private schooling and blah blah so they can't afford the holidays, second car and cappucinos I was telling those people that they should get a flat.

lg36 your situation sounds terrible. Is there no way you can relocate while your baby is young?

lg, it's hard. When we had the first child the cost of the daily nanny in outer London was the same as one of our two wages (or 50% of each of us) but 25+ years later it was so worth it because these types of careers are an investment in yourself. Children get older and don't need childcare and if you've bought your flat in the mean time then things ease. It's worth the difficulties at the time for the long term gain and stability of owning your own place. When things get hard people can put the baby in their room and rent out the other room too which is why 2 bed places can be a good buy and they do better longer term than 1 or studios.

It's all relative. I won't say I'm the worst off on the thread because my mortgage is over £1m because I'd be laughted at and I've had a good year but even people on benefits live the life of riley compared with those starving in Africa.

I have never had CTCs either because I earn too much but I've not felt I didn't need the child benefit over 25 years as a mother. We have never felt so well off we could save it. But I'd much rather have had a large family even now as a single parent of 5 than lots of spare money.

you needed the child benefit and yet you have a £1m mortgage. Hmm.

yes..and essential

I would have had a kmmortgage if I hadn't had to pay my ex husband nearly £1m and of course I could have moved the 5 children and I into a small flat and taken them out of schools and sent them to our local comp which has now reached the dizzy heights of 34% A - C at GCSE

there are a lot of nice houses between one with a £1m mortgage and a small flat, tbh.

I hanker after a £300k one with 3 beds

Edinburgh...v. expensive here.

I'm not complaining. I'm just joking. I'm certainly not financially "poor" on any scale. I have always been prepared to work twice as hard as most people so I don't have the same issues. I just earn more money if I need it and I'm quite clever and make good career and business choices and I don't get any CTC to lose.

But certainly there is a band of people who work full time and are not that well off and indeed some have less money coming in than those who don't work. This has always been the problem for Govermnents, the able bodied who choose not to work. If we simply had compulsory work for benefits then the issue goes away. I could find the unemployed a good few jobs to do for their workfare here or give everyone £200 a week whether they work or don't and whatever they earn (when we can afford it - the guarantee minimum income people have often written about) and abolish all benefits. A lot simpler.

It's a bit insulting to people who don't have as much cash to say they don't work as hard as you and are less clever.

Xenia what about those that can't work ie the disabled what would you do with them.

well, I am tempted, my mortgage on a tiny 2 bed flat is that!